Global recognition for IR's music.......

[Sureshs65]

eagle,

When I see the definitions you had quoted "Eclecticism and freedom of expression, in reaction to the rigidity and aesthetic limitations of modernism, are the hallmarks of the postmodern influence in musical composition" ,

Wouldn't using the bass guitar and various guitar chords in a Tamil folk song constitute eclecticism? Wouldn't they not be beyond the aesthetic limitations of the Tamil folk genre? Wouldn't using western vocal harmonies, as he did in Devar Magan, to create a complete folk song experience be termed as eclecticism? Wouldn't introducing Carnatic ragas within the rigidity of western classical music classify as post modernism?

To me Raja has been the ultimate in experimenting in film music. The problem is that he fuses all these elements so well that many people do not recognize this. One person hears it as a folk song and another hears it as a carnatic piece and another hears the guitar chords. Every experiment is in the service of the song. My personal opinion is that this type of fusion to give an organic whole is far more difficult to achieve that many other types of fusion. Lot of classical musicians have tried it but in my opinion I really did not see much fusion out there but only two strands playing simultaneously.

[NormalMan]

What I miss from IR these days (or at the least NOT coming out explicitly for me) is the linearity in a totally non-linear score. He is not surprising me anymore. The only album that surprised me of late was, Dev D. I want him to play with strings more. Raw amp with mandolin more.

Does this mean his scores are not for a post-modern man or whatever that means. Absolutely no. First off, I have no clue how to define a post-modern score. How do you categorize a Four Seasons, Fifth by Beethoven or Purple Haze or Indi theme? Which ever score can stand the testament of time is indeed post-modern IMHO.

[Plum]

"Ithu ungalukku ellam puriya vaikirathukku thaan ivvalavu pakkam "
:-)
I'd like to add that my grouse is not about understanding one's understandign as post-modernistic per definition. When someone approaches something saying, I'll analyse this with a post-modernistic mind, I think that is gobbledygook.

That is where I found JeMo's analysis shallow. To me, you approach art, or anything else in life with your mind, your experiences, and as long as you have an open mind, you can receive various experiences and assimilate it. I dont need to understand what is post-modernism at all. That is about analysing one's appreciation or trying to do a meta-structure on appreciation or reception of thought. That is where, when someone primarily defines themselves as post-modernistic or starts throwing jargon, I find it funny.
RS, I understand that you had the experiences first and then have understood those as post-modernism which is fine. But indha sitridhazhgalila,and even Jemo types throw it as if it is a thing by itself as jargon - uh, doesnt mean much to me.

[rajasaranam]

Ok I forgot in which thread this 'Heyram' Promo thingy came up so Iam posting this here as a reply to Bala
'பால் நிலா பாதை'யில் சில தெருக்கள் (http://www.mediafire.com/?dxhdymz5dym)
He does not need a Bala or anybody else to tell him that he is blowing his own trumpet, he knows that its a mistake and accepts that too. But to whom else he will tell all these things other than his fans?!!
Bala,
If you are not able to understand 'Raaja's Personality even after reading this nothing else can!

irir,
Sorry to use this thread as a bin....but all these postss are somehow related to Raaja putting him in a 'Global perspective' is what I feel

[rajasaranam]

eagle


"Eclecticism and freedom of expression, in reaction to the rigidity and aesthetic limitations of modernism, are the hallmarks of the postmodern influence in musical composition"

"Composers such as Terry Riley, John Adams, Steve Reich, Phillip Glass, and Lou Harrison reacted to the perceived elitism and dissonant sound of atonal academic modernism by producing music with simple textures and relatively consonant harmonies. Some composers have been openly influenced by popular music and world ethnic musical traditions

And why does this not reinforce your conviction that Raaja is a post modern composer?!!
Raaja is first and last 'Kalaga' or a revolutionary music composer of India. I can quote a number of examples... If we need to take this forwards and discuss!

[raja_fan]

Rahman says "IR is bigger than Oscars "

http://thatstamil.oneindia.in/movies/specials/2009/02/26-ilayaraja-is-above-oscars-ar-rahman.html

சரியான முறையி்ல் அவரது இசை எடுத்துச் செல்லப்பட்டிருந்தால் எப்போதோ அவர் ஆஸ்கர் விருதினை வென்றிருப்பார் என்று புகழாரம் சூட்டினார்.

[nanchil_guy]

Ok I forgot in which thread this 'Heyram' Promo thingy came up so Iam posting this here as a reply to Bala
'பால் நிலா பாதை'யில் சில தெருக்கள் (http://www.mediafire.com/?dxhdymz5dym)
He does not need a Bala or anybody else to tell him that he is blowing his own trumpet, he knows that its a mistake and accepts that too. But to whom else he will tell all these things other than his fans?!!
Bala,
If you are not able to understand 'Raaja's Personality even after reading this nothing else can!

irir,
Sorry to use this thread as a bin....but all these postss are somehow related to Raaja putting him in a 'Global perspective' is what I feel

Thats what i have been telling here that please dont judge IR based on couple of his interviews or by some media reports. Please read some of his works like 'sangeetha Kanavugal', 'paal nila Paathai' , 'Thuli Kadal' etc, from that you can understand his character, his principles etc to some extend.

Because we see most of the celebrities through media's eyes, we can not really know any of their real character beyond some level. So their biogrpahys play a vital role here to reach out their soul to some extend.

[nanchil_guy]

Ok I forgot in which thread this 'Heyram' Promo thingy came up so Iam posting this here as a reply to Bala
'பால் நிலா பாதை'யில் சில தெருக்கள் (http://www.mediafire.com/?dxhdymz5dym)
He does not need a Bala or anybody else to tell him that he is blowing his own trumpet, he knows that its a mistake and accepts that too. But to whom else he will tell all these things other than his fans?!!
Bala,
If you are not able to understand 'Raaja's Personality even after reading this nothing else can!

irir,
Sorry to use this thread as a bin....but all these postss are somehow related to Raaja putting him in a 'Global perspective' is what I feel

Whenever he says such thinks 'this is the first time it is happening in indian music history and i am doing it etc' , he used to add these words ' itha solrathukku enakku koochama irukku, irunthallum aen solrenna ithu ungalukku (fans) theriyamaeley/sollapadaamaley poi vida koodaathu enbathaalthaan'.

[Hulkster]

Yahoo groups posted a message about why IR did not do symphony. Seems that he said he should not even have done something many great,great composers have done in the past. Looks like someone must have criticised it to the extent that IR felt that his symphony was "impure" or something.

[rajasaranam]

Whenever he says such thinks 'this is the first time it is happening in indian music history and i am doing it etc' , he used to add these words ' itha solrathukku enakku koochama irukku, irunthallum aen solrenna ithu ungalukku (fans) theriyamaeley/sollapadaamaley poi vida koodaathu enbathaalthaan'.

Its almost like a childish pride as rightfully identified by kamal (Athula thannaiyum saerthukittathu konjam over thaan :))

[crajkumar_be]

http://www.indiaglitz.com/channels/tamil/gallery/events/17586.html

Aandavar on A.R Rahman, Ilaiyaraaja and "India Shining" - PERFECT :clap: :notworthy:

[crajkumar_be]

Ok I forgot in which thread this 'Heyram' Promo thingy came up so Iam posting this here as a reply to Bala
'பால் நிலா பாதை'யில் சில தெருக்கள் (http://www.mediafire.com/?dxhdymz5dym)
He does not need a Bala or anybody else to tell him that he is blowing his own trumpet, he knows that its a mistake and accepts that too. But to whom else he will tell all these things other than his fans?!!
Bala,
If you are not able to understand 'Raaja's Personality even after reading this nothing else can!


Rajasaranam,
cool down cool down cool down :)

Firstly, thanks for the pointer. Will read it later today (I came to know about this book during my IR Yahoo fangroup days at the time of Thiruvasagam)

"Wrong" - appadingara sense la naan sollave illaye. I just pointed out a couple of instances where IR speaks out about his achievements, ability etc - which are statements of facts - just as a counter to the "oblivious to recognition" bit... thappu, right-u nu ellam judge pannala... (In fact, adhukku maaraga dhaan sila thadava solliyirundhen)
Melum indha disai la poga idhu sariyana idam alla... Lets put this matter to rest :)

[crajkumar_be]

* deleted *

[crajkumar_be]

Rajasaranam/Eagle,
Thanks for writing on post-modernism. Mahanadhi la Panjabi solra madhiri "ippo setha thevala" :)


dissonant sound of atonal academic modernism
Please could you elaborate with examples (with Raaja's work if he fits the 'modern' atonal composer with dissonant sound, as against 'eclecticism and freedon of expression... with world music influence')? I go with what Suresh is saying about this point


Charu says he romanticize the folk music by playing guitar... thats quite opposite to what i felt... didnt i lose myself in his music to note these details?...
I had commented upon exactly this facet in Rajasaranam's blog. WCM etc in IR's folk and yet sounding "native" to us... RS, said he would reply to that :)


eagle,

When I see the definitions you had quoted "Eclecticism and freedom of expression, in reaction to the rigidity and aesthetic limitations of modernism, are the hallmarks of the postmodern influence in musical composition" ,

Wouldn't using the bass guitar and various guitar chords in a Tamil folk song constitute eclecticism? Wouldn't they not be beyond the aesthetic limitations of the Tamil folk genre? Wouldn't using western vocal harmonies, as he did in Devar Magan, to create a complete folk song experience be termed as eclecticism? Wouldn't introducing Carnatic ragas within the rigidity of western classical music classify as post modernism?

To me Raja has been the ultimate in experimenting in film music. The problem is that he fuses all these elements so well that many people do not recognize this. One person hears it as a folk song and another hears it as a carnatic piece and another hears the guitar chords. Every experiment is in the service of the song. My personal opinion is that this type of fusion to give an organic whole is far more difficult to achieve that many other types of fusion. Lot of classical musicians have tried it but in my opinion I really did not see much fusion out there but only two strands playing simultaneously.
:exactly:

[crajkumar_be]

What I miss from IR these days (or at the least NOT coming out explicitly for me) is the linearity in a totally non-linear score. He is not surprising me anymore.
That's the exact word eluding me in the post-2000 thread (though i would say 'anymore' is a tad too harsh)

[rajasaranam]

http://www.indiaglitz.com/channels/tamil/gallery/events/17586.html

Aandavar on A.R Rahman, Ilaiyaraaja and "India Shining" - PERFECT :clap: :notworthy:

What did he say about Raaja? Iam not able to view this site :|

[crajkumar_be]

http://www.indiaglitz.com/channels/tamil/gallery/events/17586.html

Aandavar on A.R Rahman, Ilaiyaraaja and "India Shining" - PERFECT :clap: :notworthy:

What did he say about Raaja? Iam not able to view this site :|
"...namma oorla kalaignargal illa nu kedayaadhu... neraya irukkaanga..vaippu kedaikkala...." "..ippo Ilaiyaraaja irukkaaru. naan evvalavu periya IR rasigan nu ungalukkellaam theriyum..Avar thamizhan enbahdu verum address.. avar thiramai dhaan mukkiyam.. avar Telungara irundha venaamna sollirukkapporen?.. avaru engu irundhaalum.. adhanaala dhaan N.Indians avara thedi vandhu music panna solraanga.. indrum! 100 padangalukku mela avar kooda pannitten... Chandrahasan, Charuhasan, Ilaiyaraaja ngara mahdiri aiduchu... enga veettu perumaya solra madhiri dhaan... avarukku vaippugal varumbodhu easy-a nirubikkakoodiyavaradhaan avarum"

[Plum]

nammala maadhiriye pesaraaru Kamal IR pathi - looks like when he is talking about IR, he is talking exactly like a Raja fan in this forum would :-)

[joe]

nammala maadhiriye pesaraaru Kamal IR pathi - looks like when he is talking about IR, he is talking exactly like a Raja fan in this forum would :-)

கட்டபொம்மன்ல வர்ற வசனம் "பெரும் வீரனல்லவா அவன்!" மாதிரி 'பெரும் ரசிகனல்லவா அவன்(ர்). :)

[pure bliss]

I only wrote what i felt about the statement not musicwise!

oh you are K.H fan to. nice words on a public domain. keep going







ARR must not degrade his achivement by talking like this even though he is for peace and love. terrible i feel
Pure Piss,
Vayiru gubu-gubu nu eriyudhu pola :lol2: Unga aale soltaaru.. adhanaala vaayayum, athayum pothindu oru orama ukkarum, ok-va?

Seems like you don't understand jackcrap about music, let alone Rahman or Ilaiyaraaja. To extinguish the 'fire' you should do what is best for your kind : Listen to nursery rhymes :thumbsup:

[irir123]

dissonant sound of atonal academic modernism
Please could you elaborate with examples (with Raaja's work if he fits the 'modern' atonal composer with dissonant sound, as against 'eclecticism and freedon of expression... with world music influence')? I go with what Suresh is saying about this point


dissonant sound and IR - the scene in Mudhal Mariyadhai where a guys head is shown crawling with worms or something - IR uses sound that was as dissonant as it can get - but that was required for that scene

of late, IR singing some songs, gives an unintentional dissonant feel! but then, thats some other reason - )

[Fliflo]

[tscii:37f370fe55]http://www.tamilcinema.com/CINENEWS/Hotnews/2009/February/270209a.asp

இன்றைய தேதிக்கு ஆஸ்கர் விருதின் மதிப்பு என்னவென்று தெரியுமா? கிட்டதட்ட நு£று கோடிகள்! (இதில் ஒரு ரூபாயை கூட வரியாக வசூலிக்க கூடாது என்று முடிவெடுத்திருக்கிறது மத்திய அரசு. அதுமட்டுமல்ல, இசைப்புயலுக்கு நிரந்தர வரிவிலக்கு அளிக்கவும் யோசித்து வருகிறது)

பணமாக இவ்வளவு என்றால், பிற சலுகைகள் அம்மாடியோவ்... மூன்று வருடங்களுக்கு இலவசமாக எந்த நாட்டிற்கு வேண்டுமானாலும், எந்த ஃபிளைட்டில் வேண்டுமானாலும் பறக்கலாம். உலகின் எந்த மூலையில் வேண்டுமானாலும் எத்தனை ஸ்டார் அந்தஸ்து உள்ள ஹோட்டலில் வேண்டுமானாலும் தங்கிக் கொள்ளலாம். மொத்த பில்லையும் ஆஸ்கர் கமிட்டியே ஏற்றுக் கொள்ளும்! அதுமட்டுமல்ல, உலகின் தலைசிறந்த இசையமைப்பாளர்கள் வரிசையில் வைக்கப்படுவார் ரஹ்மான்! செல்லும் நாடுகளில் எல்லாம் கவுரவ பிரஜையாக அங்கீகரிக்கப்படுவார்! இப்படி சலுகை பட்டியல் நீண்டு கொண்டே போகிறது. இவ்வளவு பெருமைக்கும் சொந்தக்காரராகிவிட்ட ரஹ்மானின் ஆரம்ப காலமும் சரி, வெற்றியின் உச்சத்தில் இருக்கும் போதும் சரி, அவர் ஒரே மாதிரிதான் என்று வியக்கிறார்கள் கோடம்பாக்கத்தில்.

Summa kathai udarangaya..

Ithai Padiyungal

http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,313925,00.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/3499847.stm
[/tscii:37f370fe55]

[irir123]

tamilcinema.com !!!!!!! if Oscar committee takes responsibility for all those expenses, for each Oscar won, then there would be a mad rush/heavy lobbying even life threats to get the oscar! the oscar committee is not running the treasury of the American govt (unless of course, someone claims Obama's stimulus plans included a generous funding of the Oscar committee!)

[njv]

[tscii:8771853bf1]http://www.tamilcinema.com/CINENEWS/Hotnews/2009/February/270209a.asp

இன்றைய தேதிக்கு ஆஸ்கர் விருதின் மதிப்பு என்னவென்று தெரியுமா? கிட்டதட்ட நு£று கோடிகள்! (இதில் ஒரு ரூபாயை கூட வரியாக வசூலிக்க கூடாது என்று முடிவெடுத்திருக்கிறது மத்திய அரசு. அதுமட்டுமல்ல, இசைப்புயலுக்கு நிரந்தர வரிவிலக்கு அளிக்கவும் யோசித்து வருகிறது)

பணமாக இவ்வளவு என்றால், பிற சலுகைகள் அம்மாடியோவ்... மூன்று வருடங்களுக்கு இலவசமாக எந்த நாட்டிற்கு வேண்டுமானாலும், எந்த ஃபிளைட்டில் வேண்டுமானாலும் பறக்கலாம். உலகின் எந்த மூலையில் வேண்டுமானாலும் எத்தனை ஸ்டார் அந்தஸ்து உள்ள ஹோட்டலில் வேண்டுமானாலும் தங்கிக் கொள்ளலாம். மொத்த பில்லையும் ஆஸ்கர் கமிட்டியே ஏற்றுக் கொள்ளும்! அதுமட்டுமல்ல, உலகின் தலைசிறந்த இசையமைப்பாளர்கள் வரிசையில் வைக்கப்படுவார் ரஹ்மான்! செல்லும் நாடுகளில் எல்லாம் கவுரவ பிரஜையாக அங்கீகரிக்கப்படுவார்! இப்படி சலுகை பட்டியல் நீண்டு கொண்டே போகிறது. இவ்வளவு பெருமைக்கும் சொந்தக்காரராகிவிட்ட ரஹ்மானின் ஆரம்ப காலமும் சரி, வெற்றியின் உச்சத்தில் இருக்கும் போதும் சரி, அவர் ஒரே மாதிரிதான் என்று வியக்கிறார்கள் கோடம்பாக்கத்தில்.

Summa kathai udarangaya..

Ithai Padiyungal

http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,313925,00.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/3499847.stm
[/tscii:8771853bf1]

All BS. ARR got $500 cash money for each Oscar. Thats about it. These tamil online site just brings up all the crap.

[joe]

இளையராஜா இல்லாமல் சினிமா இல்லை - குல்சார்
http://thatstamil.oneindia.in/movies/specials/2009/03/01-no-indian-cinema-without-maestro-ilayaraaja.html

[raja_fan]

Youtube launches its symphony orchestra.

http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/009200903031541.htm

Can some one pull IR in to it ?

[raagas]

RF

Forget it. You know it is impossible.

[irir123]

http://www.mfiles.co.uk/composers/Ilaiyaraaja.htm

[Sureshs65]

irir123,

Good work. Who is the author of the writeup?

[irir123]

Sureshs65 - the author is Jim Paterson the guy who owns that site - thx

[eagle]

Hi,
Wud like to know anybody listened to M.I.A... yes the same maya Arulpragasam who sung the "oh saaya" in SDM.
Apparently one of her songs is influenced by "kaattukuyilu manasukkulla" from Thalapathi.. she even mentions the source in the album... wondering Raaja wud ever collaborate with such artists the way Rahman do....
Way to go forward for him? or he is too conservative to use music for political purposes?

[baroque]

Youtube launches its symphony orchestra.

http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/009200903031541.htm

Can some one pull IR in to it ?

This is not for Shri.IR.
Note the passage from the News.


The selected musicians, playing 26 different instruments, will travel from around the world to New York City to perform at Carnegie Hall April 15, under the direction of Michael Tilson Thomas, the San Francisco Symphony music director, YouTube said on its blog.

The so-called YouTube Symphony Orchestra will play Internet Symphony No. 1 "Eroica", a piece written by award-winning Chinese composer Tan Dun.

Before performing on the stage of Carnegie Hall, the winners will also participate in a three-day classical music learning summit to learn from today's masters


Do you want him to be a player/musician in a symphony orchestra and play other's musical score?
That is backward step.


Even though the process is over now, they have already selected the 90 musicians, I find the auditioning part a good opportunity.
Auditioning by submitting two different videos- interpretation of Tan Dun composition and a talent video designed to show their musical expertise is attractive.

If he would have participated, even if they selected him, he need not have to accept to be a player in the orchestra but still he would have got an exposure. :)

I think Karthikraaja , Yuvan etc... all those young fellows can do all these thing.

we should leave Shri.IR alone.
Let him be GRACIOUS.

Vinatha.

[baroque]

http://www.mfiles.co.uk/composers/Ilaiyaraaja.htm

that's NEAT.

I am surprised to see Rahman's name in the article :) though some of you think Rahman is version - 2 of Shri.M.S.Viswanathan - he follows 'Shri.MSV school of Music'.

vinatha.

[rajasaranam]

JemO's Reply via mail!


நான் கையைத் தூக்கிவிடுகிறேன். எனக்கு இசை பற்றி ஒன்றும் தெரியாது. நான் சொன்னது ஒரு எளிய மனப்பதிவு. அதற்கு இசை அறிந்த ஷாஜி போன்ற சில நண்பர்களின் கூற்றுக்கள் உதவி புரிந்தன. எனக்கு ராஜாவின் இசையையும் ரஹ்மானின் இசையையும் ஒப்பிடும் தகுதியும் கிடையாது.
நவீனத்துவம் என்ற சொல்லை நான் மீண்டும் மீண்டும் வரையறைசெய்திருக்கிறேன். நவீனத்துவம் நவீனம் இரண்டும் வேறு வேறு நவீன என்றால் புதியகாலகட்டத்தைச் சேர்ந்த என்று பொருள்படும். நவீனத்துவம் என்றால் சில குறிப்பிட்ட குணாதிசயங்கள் அதனுடன் இணைந்துள்ளன.
நவீனத்துவம் 1. ஒருங்கிணைவும் ஒத்திசைவும் உள்ள படைப்புகளை உருவாக்கும். 2. ஒரே குரலில் ஒலிக்கும் ஆக்கங்களை உருவாக்கும் 3. ஒரு தனி மனிதனின் சுயத்தின் வெளிப்பாடாக இருக்கும்.
இவ்வியல்புக்கு எதிரானது பின் நவீனத்துவம். அது 1. ஒத்திசைவுக்குப் பதிலாக பலதிசைகளிலும் விரியும் தன்மை கொண்ட ஆக்கங்களை உருவாக்கும் 2. பலகுரல்களின் கூட்டுவெளியாக, உரையாடல்தன்மை கொண்டதாக இருக்கும் 3. ஒரு தனிமனிதனின் சுயத்தை மட்டும் வெளிபடுத்தாது, அவன் ஓர் ஊடகமாகவே இருப்பான். அவன் வழியாக ஓர் காலகட்டம் வெளிப்பாடு கொள்ளும்

இலக்கியத்தில் சுந்தர ராமசாமி, அசோகமித்திரன் போன்றவர்களை நவீனத்துவர்கள் என்கிறோம். அவர்களின் பல இயல்புகளை பிறகு வந்த ஆக்கங்கள் விலக்கிக் கொண்டன
ரஹ்மானின் இசையை பின் நவீனத்துவக் குணங்கள் கொண்டது என நான் சொன்னது இதன் அடிப்படையிலேயே. ராஜாவின் இசை எத்தனை விரிவானதாக இருந்தாலும் அது முழுக்கமுழுக்க ராஜாவால் மட்டுமே உருவாக்கப்பட்டு அவரது ஆளுமையை மட்டுமே வெளிப்படுத்தும் தன்மை கொண்டது. ஒரு இம்மி கூட பிறிதை அவர் அனுமதிப்பதில்லை
என் கருத்து தவறானதாக இருக்கலாம் என்றும் ஒப்புக்கொள்கிறேன். நான் இதைச்சார்ந்து விவாதிக்கும் தகுதி கொண்டவன் அல்ல

and Truce from my side :)


பதிலுரைக்கு நன்றி :) மேலும் இதை பற்றி விவாதிக்க இயலாதவாறு செய்து விட்டீர்கள். விவாதம் செய்துதான் என்ன ஆகி விட போகிறது?!! ஆயினும் நவினத்துவம் - பின்நவீனத்துவம் பற்றிய தங்கள் விளக்கத்தை உள்வாங்கி கொண்டேன். யோசித்து கொண்டிருக்கிறேன்.

[kiru]

RS,
Seems like Jeyamohan has a valid explanation for calling Rahman , post-modern. BTW, my impression of Jeyamohan's comment was it was negative on Rahman and that he was using some appreciation "post-modernism" to "out" some "modus operandi" of Rahman !! But then again am a fan of IR's music and style :-) (And again as somebody mentioned now that IR himself has appreciated Rahman,I now have the license to make fun of him :-) )

[Sureshs65]

Vinatha,

I too think that Rahman's tunes are more closer to MSV's style of tuning than to Raja's style of tuning. I guess these are liberties taken by the press in calling Rahman as disciple of Illayaraja. I don't think it is true.

[kham]

Vinatha,

I too think that Rahman's tunes are more closer to MSV's style of tuning than to Raja's style of tuning. I guess these are liberties taken by the press in calling Rahman as disciple of Illayaraja. I don't think it is true.

I dont tink dat Thalaivar's composition is closer to msv or illayaraja... He is unique in his own way...

[rajasaranam]

Vinatha,

I too think that Rahman's tunes are more closer to MSV's style of tuning than to Raja's style of tuning. I guess these are liberties taken by the press in calling Rahman as disciple of Illayaraja. I don't think it is true.

I dont tink dat Thalaivar's composition is closer to msv or illayaraja... He is unique in his own way...

Approved Wholeheartedly :twisted:

[ARUNPRAKASHKRISHNAN]

arr just follows msv style in his melodies. i have observed this from his first film..from chinna chinna aasai all his melodies are basically msv s melodic phrases. later he was influenced by sd burman, nusrat fateh ali khan, hrudayaneth mangeshkar, rd burman and of course ir also.

[baroque]

:)

[eagle]

JemO's Reply via mail!


நான் கையைத் தூக்கிவிடுகிறேன். எனக்கு இசை பற்றி ஒன்றும் தெரியாது. நான் சொன்னது ஒரு எளிய மனப்பதிவு. அதற்கு இசை அறிந்த ஷாஜி போன்ற சில நண்பர்களின் கூற்றுக்கள் உதவி புரிந்தன. எனக்கு ராஜாவின் இசையையும் ரஹ்மானின் இசையையும் ஒப்பிடும் தகுதியும் கிடையாது.
நவீனத்துவம் என்ற சொல்லை நான் மீண்டும் மீண்டும் வரையறைசெய்திருக்கிறேன். நவீனத்துவம் நவீனம் இரண்டும் வேறு வேறு நவீன என்றால் புதியகாலகட்டத்தைச் சேர்ந்த என்று பொருள்படும். நவீனத்துவம் என்றால் சில குறிப்பிட்ட குணாதிசயங்கள் அதனுடன் இணைந்துள்ளன.
நவீனத்துவம் 1. ஒருங்கிணைவும் ஒத்திசைவும் உள்ள படைப்புகளை உருவாக்கும். 2. ஒரே குரலில் ஒலிக்கும் ஆக்கங்களை உருவாக்கும் 3. ஒரு தனி மனிதனின் சுயத்தின் வெளிப்பாடாக இருக்கும்.
இவ்வியல்புக்கு எதிரானது பின் நவீனத்துவம். அது 1. ஒத்திசைவுக்குப் பதிலாக பலதிசைகளிலும் விரியும் தன்மை கொண்ட ஆக்கங்களை உருவாக்கும் 2. பலகுரல்களின் கூட்டுவெளியாக, உரையாடல்தன்மை கொண்டதாக இருக்கும் 3. ஒரு தனிமனிதனின் சுயத்தை மட்டும் வெளிபடுத்தாது, அவன் ஓர் ஊடகமாகவே இருப்பான். அவன் வழியாக ஓர் காலகட்டம் வெளிப்பாடு கொள்ளும்

இலக்கியத்தில் சுந்தர ராமசாமி, அசோகமித்திரன் போன்றவர்களை நவீனத்துவர்கள் என்கிறோம். அவர்களின் பல இயல்புகளை பிறகு வந்த ஆக்கங்கள் விலக்கிக் கொண்டன
ரஹ்மானின் இசையை பின் நவீனத்துவக் குணங்கள் கொண்டது என நான் சொன்னது இதன் அடிப்படையிலேயே. ராஜாவின் இசை எத்தனை விரிவானதாக இருந்தாலும் அது முழுக்கமுழுக்க ராஜாவால் மட்டுமே உருவாக்கப்பட்டு அவரது ஆளுமையை மட்டுமே வெளிப்படுத்தும் தன்மை கொண்டது. ஒரு இம்மி கூட பிறிதை அவர் அனுமதிப்பதில்லை
என் கருத்து தவறானதாக இருக்கலாம் என்றும் ஒப்புக்கொள்கிறேன். நான் இதைச்சார்ந்து விவாதிக்கும் தகுதி கொண்டவன் அல்ல

and Truce from my side :)


பதிலுரைக்கு நன்றி :) மேலும் இதை பற்றி விவாதிக்க இயலாதவாறு செய்து விட்டீர்கள். விவாதம் செய்துதான் என்ன ஆகி விட போகிறது?!! ஆயினும் நவினத்துவம் - பின்நவீனத்துவம் பற்றிய தங்கள் விளக்கத்தை உள்வாங்கி கொண்டேன். யோசித்து கொண்டிருக்கிறேன்.

I got the same reply from Je Mo. I think we will have to give credit to to him that he tried to figure out in his own way the most debated issue in the tamil film music ever.

One thing he left out in my opinion is his mentor Su.Ra's POV that MSV's music is incomplete (mentioned in "ninaivin nadhiyil" by Je.Mo) Rahman always used to appreciate MSV's compositions and consider him as the true genius....

Is he an extension MSV in the truest sense?

[kiru]

Vinatha,

I too think that Rahman's tunes are more closer to MSV's style of tuning than to Raja's style of tuning. I guess these are liberties taken by the press in calling Rahman as disciple of Illayaraja. I don't think it is true.

Suresh, Please elaborate.

I think Rahman follows the standard format of a song, which is followed by everybody including MSV or IR.
Later stages in his career IR started making the tunes "very tightly coupled" either with bassline (germaniyin), chords (kadhal oviyam) or layers of harmony (eg. enna solli paduvatho). Basically he transformed a film song into a sort of WCM composition. I dont think these sort of songs are the native taste of our people. Even though IR sets the tune in a specific raagam.
An example of "free form" melody is puththam pudhu kaalai and I think this is exactly what ARR does. A nice backdrop/drone, here it is a guitar vibe', a steady rhythm timed by a chalangai and unique drum arrangements.

Add to this, MSV introduced orchestral arrangements in his songs, which is why IR says, "without MSV I would not know how to create a film song". In that sense (WCM arrangements) and starting from a library of raagams, IR is MSV 2.0. All IMHO.

I am willing to listening to what you guys have to say anyways.

[ARUNPRAKASHKRISHNAN]

well this is an interesting subject.arr follows msv.for which i have to explain a composition. a song can be divided in to two parts. it has a mettu and a tune.the rhythmic structure in which the notes are placed is the mettu of the song. the flow of notes in that rhythmic structure is the tune.we can take two eg say chinna chinna aasai and aathangarai marame from kizhaku cheemaiyile.frist two lines of both the songs have the same mettu which msv has used in veedu varai uravu, pesuvathu kiliya,mambazhathu vandu etc. .every song has a key melodic line. in chinna chinna aasai it is ennai intha bhoomi sutri vara aasai. the notes phrasings for this line has been composed by arr in typical msv style which msv has used in many many of his compositions.similarly in aathangara marame,the key melodic phrase is nee ponna intha othai usiru thangathe[something like that. i dont remember the exact words]which is again typical msv style.will write more later. thanks

[ajaybaskar]

Kiru,

ARR changed the way a song is composed and the structure of the song is distinct in Rahman's music. As far as I heard, he is the one who adds lots of sounds to a song. This addition happens till the very last moment. I dont think any other MD does this.

MSV and IR's songs stuck to the basic skeleton of the song, i.e with a pallavi and 2 identical saranams. But in case of ARR, the flow of the songs were not the same. He has composed a lot of songs with two different saranams. Eg: Strawberry Kanne.., Pachai Niramae, Nadhiyae...etc,etc..

[app_engine]

MSV and IR's songs stuck to the basic skeleton of the song, i.e with a pallavi and 2 identical saranams.

Not true, there are SEVERAL examples otherwise. Much bigger number than the ARR ones (that you've mentioned and missed).

However, don't want to digress on that aspect in this thread. Can discuss somewhere else on "songs with unconventional structures" :-)

[Sureshs65]

Kiru,

I wouldn't call IR as an extension of MSV. As AE says this may not be the right thread to discuss this. Will post my thoughts later.

[kiru]

Kiru,

I wouldn't call IR as an extension of MSV. As AE says this may not be the right thread to discuss this. Will post my thoughts later.

Sure, please start a thread on this or activate a new one. I am getting bored of all threads talking about Oscars or about who is a humble or a nice person.

[irir123]

PAY DIRT!! renowned Los Angeles based journal FILM SCORE MONTHLY reviews and profiles Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's music!!!

[tscii:5011e846c4]http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/daily/article.cfm/articleID/6175/An-"Unknown"-Indian-Film-Music-master/

Highlight: "It is quite clear that Ilaiyaraaja’s respect is well-warranted. His music is immediately engaging, with a popular sensibility that gives way to detailed construction upon further exploration. Working with a variety of synthetic production, live orchestra, and fabulous singers and Indian music instrumentalists lends the music a unique quality that one discovers is part of the style of this composer. Here is someone who has discovered a way to fuse musics from multiple periods both East and West to create a sound that serves each subsequent film. There is much of the composer’s music to be explored and even with the language barrier that ultimately exists, the music is immediately communicative and often entrancing."

Hip Hip Hurray![/tscii:5011e846c4]

[MrJudge]

irir123:

8-) :thumbsup:

[Hulkster]

[tscii:251a404ab2]The whole article shows deep appreciation for thalaivar's style of music in a new light. The author describing IR's music as totally unique rather than just a blend of WCM and ICM cuts the cake. This comment is the best.



"The first of these is for a 2005 comedy, Mumbai Express (Venus Records 1542). Over the 6 ample tracks here, we here the jazzy funky sounds of “Aila Re” to samples of underscoring with dialogue in “Pyaar Chahiye” which give way to another beautiful lyric song. As all good film music does, Illayaraja’s score simply supports narrative with appropriate melodrama cast in moving string sounds. In “Bander Ki Dug Dugi” Indian percussion give way to an almost Grusin-like 80s jazz sound with vocals. This blend of dialogue that moves into song is indicative of Indian cinema and what this disc allows is fans of the film to hear the complete context of the songs that are used in the film and how the instrumental music weaves into and out of the song material. The one instrumental track, “Monkey Chatter,” is actually an 80s-ish jazz instrumental piece that uses a variety of electronic keyboards and some acoustic instruments (or an extremely dryly recorded live orchestra) for a suberb jazzy track. Most listeners would be hard pressed to know that this track was composed by an Indian composer demonstrating Illayaraja’s complete mastery of the Western forms explored here (this can be heard equally in the more classical crossover releases available for review as well). The melodic content of the score has an almost spiritual quality at times that makes it quite an engaging listen. The disc runs to 45 minutes but note that 16 minutes of that are repeated as bookends to the central material."[/tscii:251a404ab2]

[Hulkster]

irir123 if you had initiated this a big pat on your back. :clap: :clap: :notworthy:

[irir123]

hulkster - u r welcome! idhu kooda seiyya mudiyaatti ? :huh:

[prasad_subbu]

Hulkster. The best part I feel is that inspite of him being predominantly doing South Indian film music, his music could invoke curiosity and attention on LA based reviewer.

Let god him the way to get his due recognition before his life.

[prasad_subbu]

I meant "Let God show him the way to get his due recognition"

[natha1729]

If the genius article was founded on real "P O Sh@#" albums like Mumbai Express & Cheeni Kum, then the strategy must pay off for a much more steady and long - lasting flow of global recognition. Set high expectations low to the point that it cannot find the bottom but holds potential for reaching great heights.

[raja_fan]

irir123,

A great and well planned effort. Hats off to your team :D

But one question..I guess the authors are Namma makkal. Not an American..

How seerious are these articles/journals taken by the people in US ? Or particularly, do people from Hollywood industry read these ?

[irir123]

raja_fan - the author is NOT namma makkal - it is Steven A Kennedy - a seasoned music critic/reviewer who writes for Film Score Monthly - the journal is very professional and they specifically asked for original CDs and not burnt ones which speaks volumes of their quality!

This online journal is quite well-read in LA music circles - its too early to say what the impact will be - we will have to wait and see

[rajasaranam]

irir,

:D Thanks for your effort man. You are absolutely amazing :thumbsup:

Ok the article clearly mentions 80's feel/Style atleast thrice...Iam just wondering is Raaja still struck there :shock: This is shocking because a music reviewer/critic who has never heard Raaja, comes with this comment on his albums of 2000's. Haven't Raaja updated himself :cry: I feel his music is changed from 80's :|

[raja_fan]

irir123,

Not to devalue your efforts..

but still that American seems to have either used the ideas of some LA based IR fan to review the IR's albums or he just scritinized the article written by an IR fan.

Because an American cannot suddenly comment on IR's regional marketing limitations, Naan Kadavul etc to such depth.

This is what makes me prevent myself from getting excited...

Also I feel very sad that we have to do all this for IR which should have naturally happened..
i.e it is a pity that we have to run with his albums here and there and again and again cry like "Unknown composer, when will west recognize him ?" etc :( :(

[irir123]

raja_fan - do I need to keep reiterating that the article was written by Steven A Kennedy a veterain music critic and not by any IR fan, over and over again ? Steven took his time to do some background research and most likely also visited this forum (we never know), and read a bit about him and his music and then wrote this article

I dont understand, why you should be cribbing instead of being happy about it!

and pls dont make hilarious comments such as things happening naturally - nothing happens naturally, when the CD of 'Mumbai xpress' and 'TiS' HAD to be hunted for, online for several days before getting hold of one and sending the same!

[jaiganes]

@ raja saranam
The article is commenting on pieces scored in the 80s like how to name it (which is timeless) and nothing but wind (which had pop beats of 80s). As far as MX goes - much of its jazz pieces were assembled in late 80s and early 90s according to Guitar prasanna. So no issues here. Having an 80s style is not an issue. The strings he employs are 14th and 18th century music - so does it mean IR is stuck in 14th century?
The reviewer has given a clue to the listener to have an 'open mind' when it comes to expecting the kind of music from Ilaiyaraaja and I dont see it as a problem. In fact here in USA 70s and 80s are associated with glorious music and great artistes like Pink floyd, Bee Gees, Phil Collins etc.,

[eagle]

irir123,

Its heartening to see an american reviewer took effort and spend his time to analyze raaja's music.

Raja_fan,

This is something we people should be happy about...

spreading his music by his disciples is spreading a religion. You dont see converts overnight. It takes a lot of time and patience and understanding cross cultural issues for an westerner to appreciate raaja's music.

I wish he scores music for a hollywood film last time he scored (i think as a co-composer) is for "bloodstone". May be its time he takes an initiative again.

One thing i am not simply happy about is the replies... mostly from fans like us. People may find it really overwhelming.

irir 123 hats off to you!!!


:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[raja_fan]

raja_fan - do I need to keep reiterating that the article was written by Steven A Kennedy a veterain music critic and not by any IR fan, over and over again ? Steven took his time to do some background research and most likely also visited this forum (we never know), and read a bit about him and his music and then wrote this article

I dont understand, why you should be cribbing instead of being happy about it!

and pls dont make hilarious comments such as things happening naturally - nothing happens naturally, when the CD of 'Mumbai xpress' and 'TiS' HAD to be hunted for, online for several days before getting hold of one and sending the same!




irir123,

Please understand !

Do you want me to believe that Steven himself got every details right from South Indian film music scenario, the situation based film music in South India to the latest Naan Kadavul ?

It is simply unbelievable...At least I think you will accept that some IR fan introduced him to the fact that such a composer exists in India and gave him the necessary details about IR upon which Steven has written this.

You have yourself mentioned that he asked for the original CDs. So how did he come to know about such albums ?

If you are going to maintain that he did this all on a fine day suddenly out of blue, then I would say that it is simply marvellous !

Anyways , my intention is not to find some fault with all your great efforts to popularize IR. Just that I want to check things before I jump in joy :)

And about my "hilarious" comment that things should happen naturally, by naturally I meant for example like what happened with ARR. I don't think any of his fans had the need to yearn like "He is an unknown composer.underrated.. When are you going to recognise him ? " etc..

I just feel it unfortunate for a genius, not that what you are doing is bad.

So my wishes and support is always with you. Go ahead ! :D

[irir123]

raja_fan - sorry to broach the issue of other composers here, but a certain gentleman has a high-profile agency doing stuff for him - check this out http://www.gsamusic.com/ - let me get this straight - nothing happens naturally - that particular agency am sure takes care of all promotional aspects!! trust me, most people have absolutely no clue as to how things work here in the US, especially the music industry

Nothing happens naturally - you promote things bigtime, aggressively, rigorously, then you reap the benefits! like how one gentleman managed to become the President of the USA, by simply aggressively campaigning through the internet (he even has a Facebook profile!!)

In the music business, one hires an agent/agency, that does the marketing/promotional stuff, in a very well-planned, professional manner and gets a decent cut from the profits/benefits - without an agent/agency, artists simply dont stand a chance

Thats the way things work - its not the substance alone that matters, its the gloss that covers the substance that really does matter these days in showbiz!!

As a passionate fan I only sent a few of IR's CDS, gave him the link to raaja.com and Steve Kennedy did the rest - if you would like, I can send you his original email reaction after listening to HTNI first! compared to that reaction, his article is highly toned down and sober! that was the genuine reaction of a genuine music-love who KNOWS music!

If a random set of CDs sent to a reviewer can elicit such a response/review, you can just imagine, how things will turn out, if some bigtime agency takes up IR's case!!

IR with his genius, will be treated as the musical equivalent of a maverick mathematician in Hollywood (a la a musical John Nash)!

[Plum]

"by naturally I meant for example like what happened with ARR"
Well, in his case, ARR himself did the networking. Nammalukyu andha netowrking matter-lam theriyadhungaradhunala alladhu interst illain adhanala dhaane fans seyya vendi irukku. Good work irir123. However, idhu illattalum IR's music will live centuries - let's not get vexed with "current" global recognition.

[rajasaranam]

irir,

Hmmm... ARR has also told about the ways and methods to be adopted and the agencies were contacted to promote the music of SDM , in various inerviews.. I just went through the agency in wiki here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Gorfaine/Schwartz_Agency,_Inc.), Their client list is astounding and many of my favourite composers are over there. 'Kali muthiduthu' :evil:

Even then Iam confused over what will they do when ARR, John Williams, James newton, Hans zimmer, Thomas newman are all their clients, whom they will promote :confused:

[Sureshs65]

[tscii:b4e7d9a7b9]irir123,

Excellent work. A lovely article. It is definitely written by a westerner. No doubt about that. I particularly liked his conclusion. "... will make it easier for the curious to hear the work of one of India’s finest composers writing music that even as it suggests Western forms has a global transcendence often missing in much of the USA’s simplistic hinting at global cultural styles. "

Excellent summing up. Kudos to irir123 and whoever helped him in this endeavor
[/tscii:b4e7d9a7b9]

[raja_fan]

irir123,

Seriously, that was a wealth of information to me !

Thanks a lot !

And why should you wait for my consent to paste/send the reaction of that man on HTNI ?

Karumbu thinna kasakka pogudha ?
Anuppunga please ! :)

[irir123]

here are his initial responses: "these are quite intriguing blends of Indian (and I am guessing Southern Indian) music with that of Baroque and Classical period styles...the style in the two crossover discs that were sent seemed to take what I would describe as raga-like melodic ideas and cast them into either a Italianate, almost Vivaldi, Baroque sound that also reminds me of Hovhaness' music at times. I'm not implying it is derivative, I was fascinated at the way the violin idea in "How to Name It" felt at home in that approach to "melody" writing. There were even some moments there that felt a bit minimalistic to my ears. The inclusion of electronics reminded me of some of Morricone's experimental work as well. It's a far cry of course from the old de Massi score for the India documentary from the 1950s/1960s which introduced the West to the sitar. But the approach to the music here has a distinct quality that feels more "Indian" if you know what I mean? The incorporation of the Western period sounds, though likely as much as an acquired taste as say a Claude Bolling jazz/orchestra crossover, seems to work--though I felt the second album far easier to listen to (though my ears may have adapted to the style). Thanks again for enlarging my musical universe "

[app_engine]

irir123,

Great work!

Excellent article by Kennedy. Interestingly, he shares my view that NBW is easier to catch than HTNI for a new listener of IR's scores. Why, it was that way even for me :-) When both these got released one after the other, HTNI cassette was collecting dust while NBW was played frequently by me.

It wasn't until late 90's (a decade later) when I started liking and admiring the HTNI better. This time I obtained the CD's from a store in Mumbai.

That way this article is an 'alpa santhOsham' for me personally as well :-)

[eagle]

but a certain gentleman has a high-profile agency doing stuff for him - check this out http://www.gsamusic.com/ - let me get this straight - nothing happens naturally - that particular agency am sure takes care of all promotional aspects!!

The million dollar question is whether our man will ever hire an agency to promote his music!!!

[eagle]

At last some refreshing viewpoint

http://pitchaipathiram.blogspot.com/2009/03/blog-post_09.html

[raja_fan]

Can we somehow reach this guy and introduce IR to him ?
He knows Rahman and Burmans already..

http://www.hindu.com/mp/2009/03/12/stories/2009031250990500.htm

[raja_fan]

He is in facebook

http://www.facebook.com/people/Peter-Lavezzoli/598133414

irir123,

I leave it to you as you already know how to communicate IR's genius to westerners. :)

[raja_fan]

irir123,

by any chance do you personally know Sethupathi Arunachalam ?

[irir123]

who is Sethupathi Arunachalam ??

[irir123]

raja_fan - can you pls check your PM ? thanks

[raja_fan]

irir123,

I have replied your PM. Please check

[ananth222]

raja_fan - can you pls check your PM ? thanks

irir123,

I have replied your PM. Please check
ithu enna, thanthi adichittu telephone pannra madhiri irukku?? :roll:

sry for dig/ back to topic...

[soukavi]

"who is Sethupathi Arunachalam ?? "

follow this link
http://www.tamilhindu.com/author/sethupathi/

[venkkiram]

ஜெயமோகன் இணையத்தளத்தில் "இசை:ஒரு கடிதம்" என்ற தலைப்பிலான இசை பற்றிய கடிதக் கட்டுரையை தவறாமல் படியுங்கள்.

மனசெல்லாம் குளிரச்ச்செய்திருக்கிறார் அந்த மடலை எழுதிய ராம் என்ற மனிதர்.

மொத்தத்தில் வாசிப்பு ஒரு சுகானுபவம்.

[Movies]

A question to all IR fans,

Isn't fame and recognition when someone gets noticed?

If IR was truly a person worth global recognition wouldn't it have come onto him?

Why disgrace IR by begging for 'Global recognition'?

What a sad state!

[prasad_subbu]

Movies,

It is just the question of being worth of Global recognition. Leave alone IR, do you think none of the earlier film composers are not worth Global recognition?

Only when talent meets opportunity victory will follow. All the earlier composers(MSV,KVM,IR, RD Burman, Naushad etc) had required talent, but did not get opportunity. ARR had both and hence got the recognition.

ARR peak coincides with India's peak thereby providing various opportunities. Good for him. God bless him

[prasad_subbu]

I meant

It is just not the question of being worth of Global recognition.

[elfmaniac85]

May be the cheapo so called musicians crave for titles and all kind of awards.


IR already said it on a stage show to GA back in the 80s that "people give the awards and the same people will take it away". He already said it on record that he's also not interested in titles and awards.

So please don't undermine his stature with such topic.

[raagas]

I think this thread doesnt have much significance now. We can still make it better, by discussing about how Ilaiyaraaja's music can have better reach and audience (which thereby translates into everything else). All the other talk isnt necessary now, since the core topic is to be understood from the title of the thread.

[eagle]

I think this thread doesnt have much significance now. We can still make it better, by discussing about how Ilaiyaraaja's music can have better reach and audience (which thereby translates into everything else). All the other talk isnt necessary now, since the core topic is to be understood from the title of the thread.

I second this :D .... come on guys lets think about spreading raja's music in constructive ways...

[eagle]

Does anybody knows about formalities for starting internet radio station? I think it will be good promo for raaja if we can start a iradio exclusively for his music .....

There are internet radio stations exclusively for individual artists in the west... We can shoot out mails asking people to try his music... how about this idea? :D

Seriously there are musicians who used net as a medium to gain popularity....and our guy has got such a wealth to share... i am sure at least we can create a global community of his fans by implementing this idea!!!

[irir123]

"THE WORLD OF MUSIC" journal reviews Ilaiyaraaja's "THIRUVASAGAM - A CLASSICAL CROSSOVER" -

http://www.vwb-verlag.com/Katalog/m816.html

Reviewed by Hollie Longman

[rajasaranam]

irir,

I cannot read the article :(

[irir123]

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=cdc459d6fda6123e67cd7f7bd65f7eefe04e75f6 e8ebb871

article can be downloaded from there - it looks like an elite journal read by ethnomusicologists and scholars!

[rajasaranam]

There was a discussion going on Post-modernism and Raaja in this thread I believe. Here is an article (http://nagarjunan.blogspot.com/2008/03/1_14.html) by Write Nagarjunan touching briefly on the subject quoting few examples including Raaja's songs.

[eagle]

[tscii:ec9f0599d4]Charu's take on postmodern music!!!

பின் நவீனத்துவ இசை என்றால் என்ன என்று சிறிது பார்ப்போம்.

1. பின்நவீனத்துவ இசை எந்தக் குறிப்பிட்ட வடிவத்திலும் வைத்துப் பொருத்திப் பார்க்க முடியாத, பிடிபடாத தன்மை (Elusiveness) கொண்டது.

2. இசைய ஜனநாயகப் படுத்துகிறது. (அதாவது, யார் வேண்டுமானாலும் பாடலாம்; எந்த ஒலியை வேண்டுமானாலும் இசையாக்கலாம். ஒரு பாடகியின் வளையல் ஓசையைக் கூட ரஹ்மான் ஒரு பாடலில் சேர்த்ததாகக் கேள்விப் பட்டிருக்கிறேன். தில்லி-6 படத்தில் வரும் ‘யே தில்லி ஹை மேரே யார், பஸ் இஷ்க் மொஹபத் ப்யார்’ என்ற பாடலை ப்ளாஸே, பென்னி தயால், விவியன் போச்சா, தன்வி, க்ளேர் ஆகியோர் பாடியுள்ளனர். இவர்களின் குரல்களைக் கவனியுங்கள். இளையராஜா போன்ற இசையமைப்பாளர்கள் இக்குரல்களைப் பயன்படுத்துவது பற்றிக் கற்பனையும் செய்து பார்க்க முடியாது. ரேகே, ராப், மெட்டல் ராக் போன்ற இசை வடிவங்களைச் சேர்ந்த பாடல்களில்தான் இக்குரல்களை நீங்கள் கேட்க முடியும். இவர்களில், தனது 12ஆவது வயதிலிருந்து பாடும் விவியன் போச்சாவை இன்றைய ஜாஸ் உலகின் முதல் தரமான பாடகி என்று சொல்லலாம். ஜாஸ் தவிர, ப்ளூஸ், ராக் என்று பலவித இசை வடிவங்களிலும் பாடி வருபவர். இவருடைய ’புன்னகைக்கும் முகங்கள்’ என்ற ஜாஸ் பாடல் ஒரு இசை அற்புதம். தன்வி ஷா ஸ்லம்டாக் மில்லியனரில் ஜெய் ஹோ பாடியவர்.

3. முரண்நகை (மஸாக்களி – தில்லி 6)

4. இசையில் உயர்வு தாழ்வு என்று பாகுபாடு பார்ப்பதில்லை.

5. கட்டமைப்பில் ஒரு ஒற்றுமை இருக்க வேண்டும் என்பதை மறுத்தல்.

தில்லி – 6 இல் வரும் ’தில் கீரா கஹி பல் தஃபதன்’ என்ற பாடலின் மத்தியில் வரும் வாத்திய இசை ஹங்கேரியன் நடன இசையாகும். ஆரம்பத்திலிருந்து முடிவு வரை இப்பாடலில் ஒரு நேர்க்கோட்டுத் தன்மை இருக்காது. ஆரம்பத்தில் குரலின் பின்னணியில் ஒரு மந்திரவாதியின் வசிய இசை போன்ற கிதார் ஒலி, பிறகு அதுவே சிம்ஃபொனியாக மாறி, உடனே ஸ்காட்டிஷ் பேக்பைப்பருக்குச் சென்று, பாடலின் மத்தியில் ஹங்கேரிய நடன இசையும், கடைசியில் பிரம்மாண்டமான Baroque வடிவ இசையுமாக ஒழுங்கற்று எங்கெங்கோ பயணித்து முடிகிறது இந்தப் பாடல். மத்தியில் வரும் ஹங்கேரிய நடன இசையை, நான் பார்க்க நேர்ந்த நூற்றுக் கணக்கான ஹங்கேரியத் திரைப்படங்களில் பார்த்தும் கேட்டும் இருக்கிறேன். குறிப்பாக, திருமணம் முடிந்து இந்த நடனத்தை ஆடுவார்கள். அங்கே குழுமியுள்ள ஒவ்வொரு ஆடவனும் மணப்பெண்ணுடன் ஆடுவான். ரஹ்மானின் இந்தக் குறிப்பிட்ட பாடலைப் பற்றி மட்டுமே நான்கு பக்கங்களுக்கு எழுத முடியும். 25 ஆண்டுகளுக்கு முன்பு தில்லி ஹங்கேரியத் தூதரகத்தில் திரையிடப்படும் ஹங்கேரிய இயக்குனர் ஸொல்தான் ஃபாப்ரியின் படங்களில் பார்த்த அந்த நடன இசையை இப்போது ரஹ்மானின் பாடலில் கேட்டது ஓர் அபூர்வ அனுபவம். ரஹ்மானின் இசையை உலகின் எந்த மூலையில் உள்ளவனும் ரசிக்க முடிவதற்குக் காரணமும் இதுதான். நம்ப முடியாதவர்கள் இந்த இணைப்பில் ’நடனமாடும் ஹங்கேரியர்கள்’ என்ற பாடலையும், நடனத்தையும் பார்க்கலாம். இதையும் ரஹ்மானின் மேற்கண்ட பாடலின் மத்தியில் வரும் வாத்திய இசையையும் ஒப்பிட்டுப் பாருங்கள். http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuViJiviRe8&NR=1

ரஹ்மான் பயன்படுத்தும் பாடகர்கள் ஒவ்வொருவரைப் பற்றியும் ஒரு தனிக் கட்டுரை எழுதலாம் என்ற அளவுக்கு அவர்கள் பெரும் சாதனையாளர்களாக விளங்குகிறார்கள். தில் கீரா கஹி பல் தஃபதன் என்ற இந்தப் பாடலைப் பாடியிருப்பவர் ஆஷ் கிங் என்ற 25 வயது இளைஞர். ரிதம் அண்ட் ப்ளூஸின் (R&B) முடிசூடா மன்னன் என்று கருதப்படும் ஆர். கெல்லியுடன் பாடி வருபவர் ஆஷ் கிங். லண்டனிலேயே பிறந்து வளர்ந்த ஆஷ் கிங்கின் அப்பா பெங்காலி, அம்மா குஜராத்தி. இவருடைய அப்பாவும் ஒரு இசையமைப்பாளர். இன்றைய ரிதம் அண்ட் ப்ளூஸ் இசை வட்டத்தில் ஆஷ் கிங் இரண்டாவது இடத்தைப் பிடித்திருக்கிறார்.

இவ்வாறாக ரஹ்மான் உலகம் முழுவதும் இசைக் கலைஞர்களைத் தேடித் தேடி அலைந்து கொண்டிருக்கிறார். டேலண்ட் ஹண்ட் என்பார்கள். இசையின் மீதான வேட்கைதான் ரஹ்மானை இப்படி உலகம் முழுவதும் தேட வைக்கிறது.

6. இசையில் மேட்டிமைத் தன்மையை விலக்குவது.

தில்லி – 6 இல் மொஹித் சௌஹான் பாடிய ’மஸாக்களி’ பாடலை உதாரணமாகச் சொல்லலாம். கடந்த பத்தாண்டுகளின் பாடலாகக் கொண்டாடப்படும் இதில் கடக் முடக் என்றுதான் ஏதேதோ சப்தங்கள் வருகின்றன. ஆனால் இதுவரை இப்படி ஒரு பாடலை நாம் கேட்டிருக்க மாட்டோம். இதேபோல் தில்லி-6 இல் ரேகா பாரத்வாஜ், ஷ்ரத்தா பண்டிட், சுஜாதா மஜூம்தார் பாடிய ’கேந்தா ஃபூல்’ என்ற பாடல். (கேந்த் – விளையாட்டு; ஃபூல் – மலர். பூக்களை உருண்டையாகக் கட்டி விளையாடும் ஆட்டம்). இதில் ஆரம்பத்திலிருந்து முடிவு வரை தொடர்ந்து வரும் ’ஹே ஹே’ என்ற குரலை வட இந்தியக் கலாச்சாரத்தின் ஒரு குறியீடு என்று சொல்லலாம். அங்கே புறா வளர்ப்பது அவர்களின் கலாச்சாரத்தோடு இணைந்த விஷயம். ஐம்பது நூறு என்று வளர்ப்பார்கள். அவர்கள் புறாக்களோடு பேசும் பாஷையே அந்த ஹே ஹே...

7. முழுமைத் தன்மையைத் தவிர்த்தல். (தேவ்.டியில் வரும் இமோஸனல் அத்யாச்சார் என்ற பாடலின் பாண்டு வாத்தியக் கோஷ்டி வடிவம். பொதுவாக, திருமண வைபவங்களில் பாடும் பாண்டு வாத்தியக் கோஷ்டியின் பாடல்களுக்கு யாரும் மரியாதை தருவதில்லை. ஆனால் தேவ்.டியில் இந்தப் பாடல் ஒரு சூப்பர் ஹிட்).

8. இசையை அரசியல், சமூக, கலாச்சாரச் சூழலுக்கு அப்பாற்பட்டதாகவும், தனித்த, சுயேட்சையான அளவீடுகளைக் கொண்டதாகவும் கருதாமல் இருத்தல்.

உதாரணம், தில்லி-6 இன் ‘மோலா, மேரே மோலா’ என்ற ஒன்பது நிமிட சூஃபி பாடல். கைலாஷ் கேர் மற்றும் ஜவேத் அலி பாடியது. இஸ்லாம் என்பது அன்பின் வாழ்முறை என்பதை உலகுக்கு அறிவிக்கும் பாடல் இது. ஆழ்வார் பாடல்களில் காணக் கூடிய அதே பக்திப் பரவசம் பொங்கும் கவ்வாலி.

அர்ஸியான் ஸாரி மே செஹ்ரே பே லிக் கே லாயா ஹூம்

தும்ஸே க்யா மாங்கும் மே; தும் குத் ஹீ சமஜ் லோ

மோலா, மேரே மோலா...

என்னுடைய எல்லா வேண்டுதல்களையும்

என் முகத்திலேயே எழுதிக் கொண்டு வந்திருக்கிறேன்

உன்னிடம் நான் என்ன கேட்கப் போகிறேன்; நீயாகவே அதைத் தெரிந்து கொள்...

எஜமானே என் எஜமானே...

இந்தப் பாடலைப் பற்றியும் ஏராளமாக எழுதிக் கொண்டு போகலாம். இதைப் பாடியவர்களில் ஒருவரான கைலாஷ் கேர் என்ற இளைஞர் சூஃபி இசையின் மிக முக்கிய பாடகர். நுஸ்ரத் ஃபதே அலிகானைத் தனது ஆசானாகக் கொண்டவர். இவரது ’அல்லா கே பந்தே’ மிகவும் பிரபலமான பாடல். ஜவேத் அலியை இனி நாம் யுவன் ஷங்கர் ராஜாவின் இசையில் அதிகம் பார்க்கலாம் (குங்குமப் பூவும் கொஞ்சும் புறாவும்).

9. உலகின் சகலவிதமான இசை வடிவங்களையும், மரபுகளையும் உபயோகப் படுத்திக் கொள்ளுதல்.

ரஹ்மானின் இசையை வைத்து இது பற்றி நிறையவே எழுதலாம் என்றாலும், தில்லி-6 இல் வரும் ’ரெஹ்னா தூ’ என்ற அற்புதத்தை மட்டும் எடுத்துக் கொள்வோம். 6 நிமிடம் 51 நொடிகள் செல்லும் இப்பாடலின் இறுதியில் இரண்டு நிமிடங்களுக்கு ஒரு ஆஃப்ரிக்கப் புல்லாங்குழல் எந்தக் குரல்களும் இல்லாமல் தனியாக ஒலிக்கிறது. பல ஜாஸ் நிகழ்ச்சிகளில் மட்டுமே இந்தப் புல்லாங்குழலைக் கேட்டிருக்கிறேன்.

அதே படத்தில் இடம் பெற்றுள்ள ’ஹேய் காலா பந்தர்’ என்ற பாடல் உலகின் சிறந்த ராப் (Rap) பாடகர்களுள் ஒருவரான எமினெம்மின் தரத்தை விட உயர்ந்ததாக இருக்கிறது. இந்தப் பாடலின் ஆரம்பத்திலும் மத்தியிலும் வரும் அசரீரியான பெண் குரல் ரய் இசையைச் சார்ந்தது.

10. இசையில் நவீன தொழில்நுட்பத்தைப் பயன்படுத்துதல். அதாவது, இசையைப் பாதுகாப்பதில் மட்டும் அல்லாமல், இசையின் உருவாக்கத்திலும், அதன் உட்கட்டமைப்பிலும் தொழில் நுட்பத்தைப் பயன்படுத்துதல்.

தில்லி-6இல் வரும் உஸ்தாத் படே குலாம் அலி கானின் தும்ரி பாடலான ‘போர் பயி...’ ரீ மிக்ஸ். நாம் இதுவரை தமிழ் சினிமாவில் பார்த்த ரீ மிக்ஸ் ரகம் அல்ல இது. இந்தப் பாடலை ஒருமுறையேனும் கேட்டுப் பார்த்தால்தான் இது எம்மாதிரி ரீ மிக்ஸ் என்பதைப் புரிந்து கொள்ள முடியும். உஸ்தாத் பாடும் போதே அவரைத் தொடர்ந்து ஷ்ரேயா கோஷலும் பாடுகிறார். ஷ்ரேயா கோஷலின் வாழ்நாளில் அவருக்குக் கிடைத்த உச்ச பட்ச கௌரவம் இதுவாகத்தான் இருக்கும் என்று நினைக்கிறேன்.

11. முரண்பாடுகளை அனுமதித்தல்.

12. இரட்டை எதிர்முரணை விலக்கிப் பல்வேறு ஊடுபாவுகளைப் பரவச் செய்தல்.

13. துண்டு துண்டாகவும், சிறு கூறுகளாகவும் ஆக்கி நேர்க்கோட்டுத் தன்மையை நீக்குதல்.

14. பன்முகத் தன்மை.

15. பலவித அர்த்தங்களை உருவாக்குதல்.[/tscii:ec9f0599d4]

[jaiganes]

Absolutely laughable!!!
Eminently avoidable article.

[eagle]

Absolutely laughable!!!
Eminently avoidable article.

:D ... dont you think at least some parts are worth considering?

[Sanjeevi]

Absolutely laughable!!!
Eminently avoidable article.

:D ... dont you think at least some parts are worth considering?

I want to ignore this guy's articles particularly about music. Kazhuthai paya

[Sureshs65]

eagle,

Too many Tamil writers have started writing about music as if they are top rate music critics. I had corresponded with one such writer and I was disappointed with the reply I got but that's a different story.

I personally believe there are enough people in this forum who know much more about music than Charu. So I don't think we need to take this person seriously. Atleast I don't intend to.

[rajasaranam]

Absolutely laughable!!!
Eminently avoidable article.

:D ... dont you think at least some parts are worth considering?

Full comedy thaan :lol:
Oru dilli-6 layae ivvalo post-modern music kandupdudichavarkku raajavoda aayiram aayiram paadalgalla kandupudikka mudiyalanannu nenaikkum bodhu paavama irukku avara nenacha :P
yes some parts are worth considering and I have answers for those too, but replying to this idiot is waste of time :twisted:

[anegan]

ரகுமானை பற்றி எழுதுபவர் அவரை பற்றி மட்டும் எழுதி இருக்க வேண்டும். முதலில் எனக்கு சாருவின் attitude பிடிக்கவில்லை. இன்றல்ல, இவர் தினமலரில் எழத துவங்கிய போதிருந்தே இவரை ignore செய்து வருகிறேன்.

தயை கூர்ந்து இவர் கிளப்பும் controversyயை கண்டு கொள்ளாதீர்கள்.

[irir123]

[tscii:2bf3756438]Breaking news! "All About Jazz" publishes review of Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's music for PAA and KERALAVERMA PAZHASSI RAAJA....

Renowned jazz music critic/columnist Chris Slawecki reviews/critiques Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's recent best-selling album "PAA" for Allaboutjazz.com, the web's premier resource for jazz music.

http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/article.php?id=35635&pg=4

Snippets:

'the bright and colorful "Mudhi Mudhi Ittefaq Se," the sound of internationally-contemporary jazz—jazz that sounds at home in any nation—painted in colorful strokes behind a female vocalist who chases its light melody the way that a kitten chases a kite tail'

Enjoy!!

PS: since Chris Slawecki is essentially a jazz music critic, it would be unfair to expect him to write about the nuances of Indian classical music elements used by IR in either of these albums - plus, the slot(s) given for reviews of albums is/are limited - so, pls bear in mind, these factors while reading the reviews[/tscii:2bf3756438]

[app_engine]

Great news irir123!

I'm sure you had an important part in this, by making these albums accessible to such renowned westerners! Very appreciable!!

[jaiganes]

[tscii:7af0c8a14a]Breaking news! "All About Jazz" publishes review of Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's music for PAA and KERALAVERMA PAZHASSI RAAJA....

Renowned jazz music critic/columnist Chris Slawecki reviews/critiques Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's recent best-selling album "PAA" for Allaboutjazz.com, the web's premier resource for jazz music.

http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/article.php?id=35635&pg=4

Snippets:

'the bright and colorful "Mudhi Mudhi Ittefaq Se," the sound of internationally-contemporary jazz—jazz that sounds at home in any nation—painted in colorful strokes behind a female vocalist who chases its light melody the way that a kitten chases a kite tail'

Enjoy!!

PS: since Chris Slawecki is essentially a jazz music critic, it would be unfair to expect him to write about the nuances of Indian classical music elements used by IR in either of these albums - plus, the slot(s) given for reviews of albums is/are limited - so, pls bear in mind, these factors while reading the reviews[/tscii:7af0c8a14a]

collars up!!!
irir123 - kalkosmiyaa!!!

[baroque]

:ty: IRIR123 for putting efforts with passion and love!
Good for Ilayaraja!
FANTASTIC for MUSIC!
vinatha. :)

[irir123]

hi all - i emailed Mr.Balki abt PAA review and he acknowledged the email and that he has fwded the information to the Maestro himself! at last, the review has reached the man it should rightfully reach!

[venkkiram]

hi all - i emailed Mr.Balki abt PAA review and he acknowledged the email and that he has fwded the information to the Maestro himself! at last, the review has reached the man it should rightfully reach!

:clap: :clap:

வானமும் ஒரு நாள் வசப்படும்!

[Sanjeevi]

Raaja email padippara :roll:. Atleast avar magangalla yaaravathu padichu solluvanga :)

[irir123]

Curtain raiser titbit:

A radio station serving the Griffin, Atlanta, Georgia, area owned by Chappell Communications, LLC focussed mostly on film scores, will soon be featuring a special show on Maestro. Ilaiyaraaja and his music!

It will be an hour-long program, about 50 minutes of which would be devoted to featuring Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's music and the remaining 10 minutes talking about the composer, his history etc.

The radio station has an audience of a couple thousand in the Georgia area, but the show also reaches many more listeners in podcast form (it's featured every Tuesday on the website dvdverdict.com).

IR will be unusual for those unfamiliar with him in the US, but film music fans (the primary audience for the show) are largely open to discovering new composers as long as they have good music to offer.

A handful of shows on this radio station spotlighting lesser-known composers before have been well-received.

For starters, it will be just one episode for now - depending on how well-received it is, perhaps they could set up another for the future.

The radio station will focus on cues that have a strong crossover appeal for western listeners, since they know their patrons well.

Keep watching this thread for more information in the next few weeks!

PS: the radio station manager, a connoisseur of film scores, has already been floored by some of the random samples he listened to!

[jaiganes]

Curtain raiser titbit:

A radio station serving the Griffin, Atlanta, Georgia, area owned by Chappell Communications, LLC focussed mostly on film scores, will soon be featuring a special show on Maestro. Ilaiyaraaja and his music!

It will be an hour-long program, about 50 minutes of which would be devoted to featuring Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's music and the remaining 10 minutes talking about the composer, his history etc.

The radio station has an audience of a couple thousand in the Georgia area, but the show also reaches many more listeners in podcast form (it's featured every Tuesday on the website dvdverdict.com).

IR will be unusual for those unfamiliar with him in the US, but film music fans (the primary audience for the show) are largely open to discovering new composers as long as they have good music to offer.

A handful of shows on this radio station spotlighting lesser-known composers before have been well-received.

For starters, it will be just one episode for now - depending on how well-received it is, perhaps they could set up another for the future.

The radio station will focus on cues that have a strong crossover appeal for western listeners, since they know their patrons well.

Keep watching this thread for more information in the next few weeks!

PS: the radio station manager, a connoisseur of film scores, has already been floored by some of the random samples he listened to!

pinreenga irir123!!!

[Bala (Karthik)]

IRIR,
Ungalukku clap pannitte irukkamporom varum kaalathil


he radio station will focus on cues that have a strong crossover appeal for western listeners
Just a humble request to have this in mind while giving them the tracks ('ambient factor', 'pleasing' etc). Obviously you know this but enakku valiyuruthanum nu thonichu, adhaan

[Sureshs65]

irir123,

Superabbu. I guess our hands will start aching clapping for you now :D This is excellent stuff and all the very best to you for more such initiatives in the future.

[naarayanan]

irir, may god be with you in all your endeavours. i could understand how deeply raja has touched you.

there are many who want something like this to happen. but not all can take efforts like you.

best wishes from all of us are with you.

[buggle]

Long live ir and irir123

[app_engine]

irir123,
:clap: :clap: :clap:

[ajithfederer]

Great work irir23 :clap:.

Curtain raiser titbit:

A radio station serving the Griffin, Atlanta, Georgia, area owned by Chappell Communications, LLC focussed mostly on film scores, will soon be featuring a special show on Maestro. Ilaiyaraaja and his music!

It will be an hour-long program, about 50 minutes of which would be devoted to featuring Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's music and the remaining 10 minutes talking about the composer, his history etc.

The radio station has an audience of a couple thousand in the Georgia area, but the show also reaches many more listeners in podcast form (it's featured every Tuesday on the website dvdverdict.com).

IR will be unusual for those unfamiliar with him in the US, but film music fans (the primary audience for the show) are largely open to discovering new composers as long as they have good music to offer.

A handful of shows on this radio station spotlighting lesser-known composers before have been well-received.

For starters, it will be just one episode for now - depending on how well-received it is, perhaps they could set up another for the future.

The radio station will focus on cues that have a strong crossover appeal for western listeners, since they know their patrons well.

Keep watching this thread for more information in the next few weeks!

PS: the radio station manager, a connoisseur of film scores, has already been floored by some of the random samples he listened to!

[jaiganes]

IRIR,
Ungalukku clap pannitte irukkamporom varum kaalathil


he radio station will focus on cues that have a strong crossover appeal for western listeners
Just a humble request to have this in mind while giving them the tracks ('ambient factor', 'pleasing' etc). Obviously you know this but enakku valiyuruthanum nu thonichu, adhaan

irundhaalum ore oru 'jigu jigu' 'changu chakku' 'cham cham' paattaavadhu podanum saar - just for the heck of it.. ;-)

[Sureshs65]

I second Jai. Something like 'Rakamma Kaiya thatu', where you cannot miss the 'janganakka janakunakka' :D

[irir123]

Thank you all for the encouragement! its a small, humble contribution to a man's work which IMHO, deserves to be recognised/ given its due

I have no idea what would happen in the long run - the efforts may not yield anything substantial, in terms of results - but to do something like this, without expecting anything in return or, worrying about long-term results helps me rediscover many of IR's gems!

once again, thank you all for the support!

Am awaiting a detailed feedback from the radio station manager about some samples he has heard - only then will the list of tracks to be sent would be decided - as of now, there are no plans to include 'jangu chakku' type tracks - this is a serious attempt and I have no intention of jeopardising the planned show by including tracks with weird sounds

[rajasaranam]

irir,

Nandri & Vaazhthukkal :)

[naarayanan]

as of now, there are no plans to include 'jangu chakku' type tracks - this is a serious attempt and I have no intention of jeopardising the planned show by including tracks with weird sounds

:lol:

[eagle]

as of now, there are no plans to include 'jangu chakku' type tracks - this is a serious attempt and I have no intention of jeopardising the planned show by including tracks with weird sounds

:lol:

நேட்டிவிட்டி மிஸ் ஆயிடுமே? :D

[tvsankar]

as of now, there are no plans to include 'jangu chakku' type tracks - this is a serious attempt and I have no intention of jeopardising the planned show by including tracks with weird sounds

:lol:

நேட்டிவிட்டி மிஸ் ஆயிடுமே? :D

apadi ilai eagle. Mudhan muraiyaga Raaja vai therinjuka - Avanga Nativity la irukara - Nama Rajavoda List ai than kodukanam.

Adhula impress anavanga, automatica - Raaja voda matra album yum gavanika varuvanga...

This is Our Raaja.....

Raaja dhan - Ulagam poora irukara ella country Nativity kum compose panni irukarae.. appram enna........

[raagas]

irir123 is putting in many efforts to spread IR music. :clap:

[tvsankar]

irir123 ai vera oru thread la wish panniten.
anyway,

Wish you get more success in this Journey dear irir123.....

[Punnaimaran]

irir123,
Great work. We all appreciate your efforts.

[irir123]

'nativity' and all that jazz apart, what the station/show manager wants are tracks with heavy crossover appeal - none of the 'jangu chakku'-like words give that 'appeal' - in fact, scores with as less vocals as possible are what they prefer - another point they highlighted was the 'tinny' sound in IR's recordings - which is something i have always been reiterating - which every other composer is carefully/ consciously avoiding

most interestingly, every single track of IR with a pop/synthetic sound was rejected! even those which we think are good ones (like 'megam kottattum')

tracks that were immensely/immediately liked were :
(i) edho mogam
(ii) edeya bagilu
(iii) how to name it ? main track
(iv) i love mozart
(v) poo poothadhu (mumbai xpress)
(vi) aye zindagi (sadma)

each of the above was glorified no ends by the show manager in his feedback!

will give further updates when the show timings/dates are announced

[Plum]

irir - did you try out GURU with him?

[tvsankar]

'nativity' and all that jazz apart, what the station/show manager wants are tracks with heavy crossover appeal - none of the 'jangu chakku'-like words give that 'appeal' - in fact, scores with as less vocals as possible are what they prefer - another point they highlighted was the 'tinny' sound in IR's recordings - which is something i have always been reiterating - which every other composer is carefully/ consciously avoiding

most interestingly, every single track of IR with a pop/synthetic sound was rejected! even those which we think are good ones (like 'megam kottattum')

tracks that were immensely/immediately liked were :
(i) edho mogam
(ii) edeya bagilu
(iii) how to name it ? main track
(iv) i love mozart
(v) poo poothadhu (mumbai xpress)
(vi) aye zindagi (sadma)

each of the above was glorified no ends by the show manager in his feedback!

will give further updates when the show timings/dates are announced

irir123,

wat about these songs....

idhai ellam solli irukeengala.. reject acha??

`1. Kadhal oviyam - alaigal oivadhilali

2. PUtham pudhu kalai

3.Anand - ella paatum nalla iurkum...... except ola kudisaiyilae...

4. Devanin kovilil - Aruvadai naal

5. Nanae naana - Azhagae unnai arathikiren

4,

[Aalavanthan]

Curtain raiser titbit:

A radio station serving the Griffin, Atlanta, Georgia, area owned by Chappell Communications, LLC focussed mostly on film scores, will soon be featuring a special show on Maestro. Ilaiyaraaja and his music!

It will be an hour-long program, about 50 minutes of which would be devoted to featuring Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja's music and the remaining 10 minutes talking about the composer, his history etc.

The radio station has an audience of a couple thousand in the Georgia area, but the show also reaches many more listeners in podcast form (it's featured every Tuesday on the website dvdverdict.com).

IR will be unusual for those unfamiliar with him in the US, but film music fans (the primary audience for the show) are largely open to discovering new composers as long as they have good music to offer.

A handful of shows on this radio station spotlighting lesser-known composers before have been well-received.

For starters, it will be just one episode for now - depending on how well-received it is, perhaps they could set up another for the future.

The radio station will focus on cues that have a strong crossover appeal for western listeners, since they know their patrons well.

Keep watching this thread for more information in the next few weeks!

PS: the radio station manager, a connoisseur of film scores, has already been floored by some of the random samples he listened to!

pinreenga irir123!!!

Appreciations pala irir

[Sanjeevi]

What abt EVK songs and the latest Nandala?

[rajkumarc]

Curtain raiser titbit:

A radio station serving the Griffin, Atlanta, Georgia, area owned by Chappell Communications, LLC focussed mostly on film scores, will soon be featuring a special show on Maestro. Ilaiyaraaja and his music!

Hats off to you irir23 for all your efforts in spreading out our Maestro's music :clap: :clap: :clap:
Best wishes for the show to be a great success. Hope they archive it and we could listen to it later.

[rprasad]

Great work irir123.Regarding your point of choosing songs with as less vocals as possble, i fully agree. Most of the westerns will find it extremly difficult to relate and appreciate our songs espically IR songs which have a lot of nativity built in the melody inspite of the orchestration being western/fusion. I think you should also maybe present them a list of IR's BGM's/Theme scores and get their feedback since most of them really appreciate theme scores. AS for songs i think they are looking for something that is different and can appeal to them as well(with crossover appeal). Pop/synth based fast numbers by IR will not appeal to them since they are all to familiar with that genre and will not find it appealing eventhough the songs might be good or having some innovation somewhere. Another thing i think you can stress on is to make them take extra notice of the introduction, and interlude orchestration of IR's songs which can be mini scores by themselves and should captivate them easily.
Great work again. Thanks.

[Plum]

The Thumbi vaa instrumental also is a good option

[vel]

'nativity' and all that jazz apart, what the station/show manager wants are tracks with heavy crossover appeal - none of the 'jangu chakku'-like words give that 'appeal' - in fact, scores with as less vocals as possible are what they prefer - another point they highlighted was the 'tinny' sound in IR's recordings - which is something i have always been reiterating - which every other composer is carefully/ consciously avoiding

most interestingly, every single track of IR with a pop/synthetic sound was rejected! even those which we think are good ones (like 'megam kottattum')

tracks that were immensely/immediately liked were :
(i) edho mogam
(ii) edeya bagilu
(iii) how to name it ? main track
(iv) i love mozart
(v) poo poothadhu (mumbai xpress)
(vi) aye zindagi (sadma)

each of the above was glorified no ends by the show manager in his feedback!

will give further updates when the show timings/dates are announced


:notworthy: hats off to your efforts irir123! Very eager to get to see his feedback mail !

[aruLaracan]

long time ago, when i used to do the india show in santa barbara (KCSB, 91.9 fm), i used to play rumbam bam Aranbam quite often and would get at least two phone calls asking for more about the song - every time i play it. (another song which elicited similar response was avaLukkenna from sarvar sundaram!)

[Vivasaayi]

irir,

Putham pudhu kaalai will be an excellent choice ..interludes and the prelude are just too good and the singing also is so breezy.

Nee partha parvaikoru will be a good choice too

[irir123]

long time ago, when i used to do the india show in santa barbara (KCSB, 91.9 fm), i used to play rumbam bam Aranbam quite often and would get at least two phone calls asking for more about the song - every time i play it. (another song which elicited similar response was avaLukkenna from sarvar sundaram!)

'rambam bam' was heavily inspired from some famous song! therefore, phonecalls!

[p]

aruLaracan
Newbie Hubber

:lol: :lol:

[irir123]

Special Radio Show on MAESTRO.ILAIYARAAJA'S music !!

"WHIE-AM", a radio station devoted to film music scores based in Griffin, GA, USA - will be featuring scores composed by MAESTRO. ILAIYARAAJA on Saturday, the 8th of May, 2010.

The show will be titled "The Sounds and Sights of Cinema" - Special Focus on MAESTRO. ILAIYARAAJA.

The show will run for 50 minutes, with an introduction and interspersed with snippets about the MAESTRO.

WHIE-AM is a small station, and hence, perhaps only those who live in the Griffin, GA area would be able to pick it up.

The station has 1000s of cinema music loving patrons not only in the US, but all over the world!

However, this special show will be available in podcast form (all over the world) on Tuesday, May 11th at http://dvdverdictpresents.com/rss/cinema

[Hulkster]

Great work again. :clap: :notworthy: What scores were chosen?

[Sureshs65]

irir123,

As usual, your efforts are amazing. Happy that your efforts are bearing fruit. First the 'Paa' / PA review in the jazz magazine and now this. Super stuff.

Eagerly waiting to listen to the podcast.

[app_engine]

irir123,
:clap: :clap: :clap:

[raagas]

I only wish IR or atleast some of his team members come to know about the efforts of irir123. Kudos to irir123 for taking Ilaiyaraaja to remote avenues.

[jaiganes]

IRIR123
sooper effort!!!
best fan anyone can hope to get!!!

[irir123]

raagas - IR's reaction will likely be: "ok nalladhu nadandhaa nadakkattum" with a philosophical smile!

[rajasaranam]

irir,

:clap: :thumbsup:

[raja_fan]

Good work irir !



raagas - IR's reaction will likely be: "ok nalladhu nadandhaa nadakkattum" with a philosophical smile!


Appadi sonnaa kooda paravaa illaiye...

Adha vittuttu "adhai yen enkitte kekkareenga ? avaraiye (irir) kelunga" appadeennu sonnaalum solluvaar ;)

[raajarasigan]

IRIR123!!

:notworthy: :notworthy: :clap: :clap:

[vel]

IRIR123 - what is the songs list? great work again by you. Hats off !

[baroque]

IRIR123 :ty:
vinatha.

[rajkumarc]

Great to see this show coming up. IRIR23 - Hats off to all your efforts :salute: :salute: :salute:

Looking forward to listen to this show.

[Sanjeevi]

great irir123 :D

[irir123]

I might get the actual song list - chosen based on the radio station admin's liking/choice considering their suitability for the show - finalised for the show by this evening - will post the list once I get it

in case I dont, then we will have to wait until Tuesday the 11th May, 2010

Am once again posting the information here:

"WHIE-AM 1320 KHz" - http://www.ontheradio.net/whie, http://www.radio-locator.com/info/WHIE-AM, a radio station devoted to film music scores based in Griffin, GA, USA - will be featuring scores composed by MAESTRO. ILAIYARAAJA on Saturday, the 8th of May, 2010.

The show will be titled "The Sounds and Sights of Cinema" - Special Focus on MAESTRO. ILAIYARAAJA and run for 50 minutes.

WHIE-AM is a small station, and hence, perhaps only those who live in the Griffin, GA area would be able to pick it up.

However, this special show will be available in podcast form (all over the world) on Tuesday, May 11th at http://dvdverdictpresents.com/rss/cinema

The station has 1000s of cinema music loving patrons not only in the US, but all over the world!

[tvsankar]

Dear irir123,

Ungala pola Fan kedaika - IR um naangalum
punniyam seidhu irukom........

Hearty Wishes to your Great Efforts irir123..

(unga per enna nu solla kudadha......)

[irir123]

tvsankar - you are welcome - its all about a four letter word that starts with "L" and ends with "E" ! combine that with passion and thats what drives me!

[tvsankar]

thanks for the response irir123..
unga perai kaeten.. inum sollalai.
start with L end with e - Love??


got it. adhan sonnen. IR and We - gifted..... becoz of U.....

en per Usha Sankar. apadiaye sollalam.

[tvsankar]

irir123,
unga reply ai yen delete pannineenga..

youtube parkalaiyae... Power cut achu apo.......... :shock:

[irir123]

Hi all:

the following tracks have been chosen/selected by the WHIE radio station admin based on their crossover appeal, ethnic flavor as well as colorful cues:

"How to Name It" - The House - 7:20
"Modern Concerto" - In the Eyes of a King - 4:00
"Mozart, I Love You" - Don't Steal My Heart - 9:00
"Puthham Pudhu kaalai" - Never Ending Waves - 4:30
"Mandram Vandha" - Silent Symphony - 4:40
"Elangathhu" - Pitha Magan - 6:10
"Ilaya Nila" - Never Ending Journies - 4:40
"Panivizhum malarvanam" - She is Forever in My Thoughts - 4:30
"Edho Moham" - As the Hen Croons - 5:30
"Muthu natramam" - Tiruvasagam in Symphony - for its breathtaking orchestral usage reminiscent of Broadway musicals/opera with fast-paced movements that would appeal to modern audiences as well

the English translation of each film's title was given by me, at the insistence of the program/show manager!

the radio station admin have confirmed that this will not just be a one show thingy, but will be a series of shows and the remaining tracks will be covered subsequently! they are already convinced that most of these tracks will be liked by their patrons!

[Sanjeevi]

:clap:

excellent selection :thumbsup:

[tvsankar]

Nice list irir123...

avanga rasanaiyai pathi yosikaren.......

[venkkiram]

Hi all:

the following tracks have been chosen/selected by the WHIE radio station admin based on their crossover appeal, ethnic flavor as well as colorful cues:

"How to Name It" - The House - 7:20
"Modern Concerto" - In the Eyes of a King - 4:00
"Mozart, I Love You" - Don't Steal My Heart - 9:00
"Puthham Pudhu kaalai" - Never Ending Waves - 4:30
"Mandram Vandha" - Silent Symphony - 4:40
"Elangathhu" - Pitha Magan - 6:10
"Ilaya Nila" - Never Ending Journies - 4:40
"Panivizhum malarvanam" - She is Forever in My Thoughts - 4:30
"Edho Moham" - As the Hen Croons - 5:30
"Muthu natramam" - Tiruvasagam in Symphony - for its breathtaking orchestral usage reminiscent of Broadway musicals/opera with fast-paced movements that would appeal to modern audiences as well

the English translation of each film's title was given by me, at the insistence of the program/show manager!

the radio station admin have confirmed that this will not just be a one show thingy, but will be a series of shows and the remaining tracks will be covered subsequently! they are already convinced that most of these tracks will be liked by their patrons!

ராஜபார்வை படம் தானே! பாராட்டுக்கள் ! திறம்பட தொகுத்திருக்கிறீர்கள்! இவை எப்படிப்பட்ட அதிர்வுகளை அமேரிக்கர்களிடத்தில் ஏற்படுத்தப் போகிறது என்பதை தெரிந்துகொள்ள மிகவும் ஆவலோடு காத்திருக்கிறேன்.

[irir123]

hi all

The morning of Saturday the 8th of May, 2010, "WHIE-AM", must have broadcast the show featuring the music of IR

For those who missed it, this special show will be available as podcast beginning from Tuesday, May 11th at http://dvdverdictpresents.com/rss/cinema

and here is the place where feedbacks for the show/podcast are likely to be put up! - http://www.dvdverdict.com/juryroom/viewforum.php?f=56

lets wait until May 11, 2010, for feedbacks to appear!

[baroque]

Very impressive list of compositions from you, IRIR123. :clap:
Excited to read the inputs of the listeners...there is so much music out there in the world.. we have very little time to find out and treat us.
Wonderful of them to take your inputs & introduce some of their ardent music fans to a new artist!
Let me grab the soulful compositions of Shri.IR and hit the road to enjoy the serenity of pacific coastline :musicsmile:
aahaa.. Cloudy weather with light drizzle and Shri.IR's sangeetham :swinghead: HEAVENLY!
உறவெனும் புதிய வானில் பறந்ததே இதய மோகம் ....
GOOD JOB, IRIR123,
You treat yourself too! :musicsmile:
vinatha.

[irir123]

[tscii:d14ed75adb]http://dvdverdictpresents.com/rss/cinema

check out the podcast - Douglas Clark gives an introduction to IR exactly as I gave it to him!



* Songs are an integral part of the soundtracks of Indian films - and they are all context-driven, and specifically in the case of Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja, the context-specific structuring of the songs takes utmost prominence.

* Having said that, the Maestro, in his 30 years of film music composing has NOT ONLY composed close to 5000 songs composed to 'fit' the mood and context of a given film, he has done equal amounts of voluminous output in terms of the orchestral/instrumental component that goes with a movie.

* However, despite such a phenomenal output of instrumental music, given the strange situation in which there is hardly any market for such music in India, most of his instrumental/orchestral tracks have never been released! it is only in recent years, have they been released, or, some of his instrumental non-filmy works have been used in films as a backdrop.


* RAAGA – is a combination of notes often referring to a certain mood, and feeling or even time of the day – it has its roots in the spiritual culture/tradition of India – but the Maestro, broke all barriers and exposed the flexibility of a RAAGA using it in every possible manner – a distinct hallmark of his creative genius!
[/tscii:d14ed75adb]

[venkkiram]

கேட்டுவிட்டேன்! அந்த நிகழ்ச்சியை கேட்டுவிட்டேன். mp3 வடிவத்திலேயும் இணையத்திலேயே கேட்கலாம். முதல் முயற்சியே ரொம்ப சிறப்பா அமைந்துவிட்டது என்றே தோன்றுகிறது.

கண்டங்கள் கடந்து ராஜாவின் இசை, அதற்கான மக்களை சென்றடைய ஆரம்பித்துவிட்டது... அத்தகைய அருமையான முயற்சியை தொடங்கி வைத்திருக்கும் IRIR-க்கு கோடி வந்தனம்.

நிகழ்ச்சியின் ஆரம்பப் பாடலே, எப்போதும்போல ரோமங்கள் அனைத்தையும் சிலிர்த்தெழ வைத்துவிட்டது.

[venkkiram]

Modern Concerto - In the Eyes of a King

இன்னும் சிறந்த தரமான ஒலிப்பேழையை ஒலிக்கச் செய்திருக்கலாம் எனத்தோன்றியது!

[irir123]

venkkiram - pls be content with what i managed to get hold of - its virtually impossible to get a genuinely high quality recording of the "modern concerto" - not my fault!

its in the pursuit of getting good quality MP3s/tracks, that delayed this show by more than 2 months

[venkkiram]

"Muthu natramam"

இந்தப் பாடலை ஒலிபரப்புவதற்கு முன்பு பேசிய முன்னுரை நன்றாக இருந்தது.

[jaiganes]

[tscii:0fe47e02db]http://dvdverdictpresents.com/rss/cinema

check out the podcast - Douglas Clark gives an introduction to IR exactly as I gave it to him!



* Songs are an integral part of the soundtracks of Indian films - and they are all context-driven, and specifically in the case of Maestro.Ilaiyaraaja, the context-specific structuring of the songs takes utmost prominence.

* Having said that, the Maestro, in his 30 years of film music composing has NOT ONLY composed close to 5000 songs composed to 'fit' the mood and context of a given film, he has done equal amounts of voluminous output in terms of the orchestral/instrumental component that goes with a movie.

* However, despite such a phenomenal output of instrumental music, given the strange situation in which there is hardly any market for such music in India, most of his instrumental/orchestral tracks have never been released! it is only in recent years, have they been released, or, some of his instrumental non-filmy works have been used in films as a backdrop.


* RAAGA – is a combination of notes often referring to a certain mood, and feeling or even time of the day – it has its roots in the spiritual culture/tradition of India – but the Maestro, broke all barriers and exposed the flexibility of a RAAGA using it in every possible manner – a distinct hallmark of his creative genius!
[/tscii:0fe47e02db]

IRIR123
buddy u have made me cry man...
nesamaave nee raasaayya!!
nalla irukkanumyaa nee!!

[Bala (Karthik)]

Irir,
:Salute: as always and the choice of songs was superb ("Muthunatraman", especially)

[baroque]

:ty: IRIR123 for the link and your efforts.
vinatha.

[app_engine]

Fantastic intro!
irir123 வாழ்க!!

[irir123]

Please post your comments/feedback for the show at http://www.dvdverdict.com/juryroom/viewforum.php?f=56

[app_engine]

irir123,
Your list had putham puthukkAlai, pani vizhum malarvanam & EdhO mOham but they're not in the podcast.

Were they featured in the radio at all?

[venkkiram]

Please post your comments/feedback for the show at http://www.dvdverdict.com/juryroom/viewforum.php?f=56

Any thread is created sofar to discuss IR songs in the above mentioned forum? I dont see any.

[irir123]

irir123,
Your list had putham puthukkAlai, pani vizhum malarvanam & EdhO mOham but they're not in the podcast.

Were they featured in the radio at all?

pls wait for the next segment(s) of the show in a few weeks from now

[jaiganes]

Please post your comments/feedback for the show at http://www.dvdverdict.com/juryroom/viewforum.php?f=56

Any thread is created sofar to discuss IR songs in the above mentioned forum? I dont see any.

http://www.dvdverdict.com/juryroom/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=4396

here u go - i created one just now.

[irir123]

i get the message "The requested topic does not exist"

[Sureshs65]

irir123,

Great stuff. As usual from you, if I may add. I have left my comment there. It is awaiting moderation.

[Sanjeevi]

Kudos to irir123 :)

Somehow I feel non-film pieces has rocked in this programme

[raagas]

Great effort by IRIR. As always.

[aruLaracan]

IRIR123,

Are you the 'Goa Madan'? Please send an PM if you are the one.

[eagle]

Superb!!! i am listening to the podcast while i typing this... great effort... amazing song selection....முடிஞ்சா அவருக்கு ஒரு ஹாலிவுட் பட வாய்ப்பு வாங்கி கொடுங்களேன் :D

[irir123]

Superb!!! i am listening to the podcast while i typing this... great effort... amazing song selection....முடிஞ்சா அவருக்கு ஒரு ஹாலிவுட் பட வாய்ப்பு வாங்கி கொடுங்களேன் :D

"Great things are not done by impulse, but by a series of small things brought together." - Vincent Van Gogh

it took this long for the Indian govt to give him a Padma award - how in the world do we even expect hollywood to even know abt him ??

small things such as this radioshow if done to perfection, are adequate enough - it took me an entire 2-3 months to organise this - and there are limitations

even if a few handful of people who have never heard of IR's music get to listen to it, and raise their eyebrows thats a good start

hollywood is a different beast - a fortress shielded by myriad agencies, groups, forums all of whom cater and nurture locally grown talent

to be honest, Hollywood does not need IR !

and IR does not need Hollywood either!

[raajarasigan]

Superb!!! i am listening to the podcast while i typing this... great effort... amazing song selection....முடிஞ்சா அவருக்கு ஒரு ஹாலிவுட் பட வாய்ப்பு வாங்கி கொடுங்களேன் :D

"Great things are not done by impulse, but by a series of small things brought together." - Vincent Van Gogh

it took this long for the Indian govt to give him a Padma award - how in the world do we even expect hollywood to even know abt him ??

small things such as this radioshow if done to perfection, are adequate enough - it took me an entire 2-3 months to organise this - and there are limitations

even if a few handful of people who have never heard of IR's music get to listen to it, and raise their eyebrows thats a good start

hollywood is a different beast - a fortress shielded by myriad agencies, groups, forums all of whom cater and nurture locally grown talent

to be honest, Hollywood does not need IR !

and IR does not need Hollywood either! :exactly:

[Devaraagam]

to be honest, Hollywood does not need IR !

and IR does not need Hollywood either!

Its true. IR is beyond that and His thinking is totally different.

[irir123]

to be honest, Hollywood does not need IR !

and IR does not need Hollywood either!

Its true. IR is beyond that and His thinking is totally different.

this is not abt whether IR is better or beyond what Hollywood needs - it is more of a practical issue - there are dozens of upcoming very talented composers like Alexandre Desplat, Sharon Farber, Michael Giacchino, etc

this is besides the regulars from John Williams, Horner, through Sylvestri, James Newton Howards, Howard Shore, Elfman etc

and hence there is no dearth of composers in Hollywood, that they have to seek someone from distant India!

thats what I meant

if you ask me, I would say, we dont have original talented composers actually doing music the way it should be done - in India! barring IR, and a few others, we might end up actually hiring someone from outside, at this rate of borrowing samples/loops!

[njv]

if you ask me, I would say, we dont have original talented composers actually doing music the way it should be done - in India! barring IR, and a few others, we might end up actually hiring someone from outside, at this rate of borrowing samples/loops!

Irir, my opinion on this, what you said is true in all fields among indians. The education system doesnt develop creativity and our belief system forces us not to. You are told to study, you are told to get 100%, you are told to write IIT-JEE, you are told to find a job, you are told to go to US or other country, you are told to get GC. Please read "you are told to" as your parents told you or peer pressure forces you".

In India, the focus is survival, so create lot of pressure to people and we forget about creativity.

[app_engine]

In India, the focus is survival, so create lot of pressure to people and we forget about creativity.

அப்படீன்னா பாரதியார், இளையராசா எல்லாம் எப்படி உண்டானாங்க?

நீங்கள் சொல்லும் கருத்து மத்திய வர்க்கக்குடும்பங்களைப்பொறுத்த மட்டில் பெரும்பான்மையாக சரியென்றாலும், இந்தியாவில் அவர்கள் மட்டுமே இல்லை :-)

[irir123]

In India, the focus is survival, so create lot of pressure to people and we forget about creativity.

அப்படீன்னா பாரதியார், இளையராசா எல்லாம் எப்படி உண்டானாங்க?

நீங்கள் சொல்லும் கருத்து மத்திய வர்க்கக்குடும்பங்களைப்பொறுத்த மட்டில் பெரும்பான்மையாக சரியென்றாலும், இந்தியாவில் அவர்கள் மட்டுமே இல்லை :-)

though we are digressing quite a bit, let me add one last point:

our middle-class values simply suck bigtime - they are centred around survival, marriage and children and nothing beyond these - add to these, a dumba*s bureaucracy and ritualistic belief systems (blaming the horoscope of someone who is diagnosed of cancer, for example) - and worst of all, we are the most class-ridden society in the world

[ajithfederer]

irir and njv, well said.

[njv]

In India, the focus is survival, so create lot of pressure to people and we forget about creativity.

அப்படீன்னா பாரதியார், இளையராசா எல்லாம் எப்படி உண்டானாங்க?

நீங்கள் சொல்லும் கருத்து மத்திய வர்க்கக்குடும்பங்களைப்பொறுத்த மட்டில் பெரும்பான்மையாக சரியென்றாலும், இந்தியாவில் அவர்கள் மட்டுமே இல்லை :-)

Common thing among these people - They have not gone through schooling and their parents didnt force them to go thru belief system (although Bharathiyar's parents forced him though).

It has nothing to do financial status, it is more to do with how much parents support the kids in what the kid want to do and how many kids has the will to go against the parents and scoiety.

Population in India to the inventions that we made vs population in US or otehr western country and the inventions they made is a proof for this.

[tvsankar]

In India, the focus is survival, so create lot of pressure to people and we forget about creativity.

அப்படீன்னா பாரதியார், இளையராசா எல்லாம் எப்படி உண்டானாங்க?

நீங்கள் சொல்லும் கருத்து மத்திய வர்க்கக்குடும்பங்களைப்பொறுத்த மட்டில் பெரும்பான்மையாக சரியென்றாலும், இந்தியாவில் அவர்கள் மட்டுமே இல்லை :-)

though we are digressing quite a bit, let me add one last point:

our middle-class values simply suck bigtime - they are centred around survival, marriage and children and nothing beyond these - add to these, a dumba*s bureaucracy and ritualistic belief systems (blaming the horoscope of someone who is diagnosed of cancer, for example) - and worst of all, we are the most class-ridden society in the world

Creativity - idhu oru culture illai.

India - inga dhan idhu adhigam iruku.

chinna kids - velaiyadum podhu gavaninga.

Illadha road la - speed a car odum. Lorrry pogum.

Vessels illamalyae - samaiyal nadakum. sapadum irukum...

Anal - ivai elalm - School ku ponadhum - oduka padugiradhu. azhika padugiradhu.

Because - Padipu matumae panam tharum - Book la padithum, manapadam seidhum (idhu dhan prob inga) indha culture dhan india vil solla padudhu.

adhu dhan India voda prob.

idhuvum thavaru kedaiyadhu. idhanudan, ceativity kum value koduthal podhum....

India kite yarum vara mudiyadhu.

Neenga ellarum - ipadi padichu than USA la irukeenga... Nalla velai seiyareenga... Enna korainju poiteenga......

USA la - ipo dhan - India madhiri - syllabus - homework style - gavanikaranga... News la pakkaren.......

[tvsankar]

Adhanala,

Nammai patri - Naam - Uyarvaga ninaika vendum.(nammudiaya Uyarndha arivukum, gunangalukum..)

Indha gunam dhan - Matra country people kite iruku......


Adhanal dhan - avanga vishayam ellam
uyarvaga therigiradhu.

Panam - idhan udhaviyal dhan Uyarvai velipadutha mudiyum.

IR ai patri - Avarudiaya compositions ellavatriayum - Best Quality la - Record panni irundhal,

IR oda compostion - enna nu indha ulagam Unarum....

Ordinary aga record seiya patadhal,
IR oda composition onum Ordinary ilai..........

[buggle]

Adhanala,

Nammai patri - Naam - Uyarvaga ninaika vendum.(nammudiaya Uyarndha arivukum, gunangalukum..)

Indha gunam dhan - Matra country people kite iruku......


Adhanal dhan - avanga vishayam ellam
uyarvaga therigiradhu.

Panam - idhan udhaviyal dhan Uyarvai velipadutha mudiyum.

IR ai patri - Avarudiaya compositions ellavatriayum - Best Quality la - Record panni irundhal,

IR oda compostion - enna nu indha ulagam Unarum....

Ordinary aga record seiya patadhal,
IR oda composition onum Ordinary ilai..........

இப்பவே கண்ணை கட்டுதேய்

[irir123]

Adhanala,

Nammai patri - Naam - Uyarvaga ninaika vendum.(nammudiaya Uyarndha arivukum, gunangalukum..)

Indha gunam dhan - Matra country people kite iruku......


Adhanal dhan - avanga vishayam ellam
uyarvaga therigiradhu.

Panam - idhan udhaviyal dhan Uyarvai velipadutha mudiyum.

IR ai patri - Avarudiaya compositions ellavatriayum - Best Quality la - Record panni irundhal,

IR oda compostion - enna nu indha ulagam Unarum....

Ordinary aga record seiya patadhal,
IR oda composition onum Ordinary ilai..........

humble request - can you type in English or if in Tamil, pls type in tamil fonts - its difficult to understand what you are saying!

[tvsankar]

அதனால்,
ந்ம்மைப் பற்றி நாம் உயர்வாக நினைக்க வேண்டும்.(ந்ம்முடைய உயர்ந்த அறிவிற்க்கும், குணத்திற்க்கும்.)
இந்த குணம் தான் மற்ற நாடுகளில் இருக்கிறது.
அதனால்தான் அவர்களின் விஷயம் எல்லாம் உயர்வாகத் தெரிகிறது.

பணம் - இதன் உதவியால்தான் உயர்வை வெளிப்படுத்த முடியும்.

IR ai பற்றி - அவருடைய இசை அமைப்பு எல்லாவற்றையும் - மிகச் சிறந்த ஒலியில் பதிவு செய்தால்,
அவருடைய இசையின் மேன்மையை இந்த உலகம் தெரிந்து கொண்டு இருக்கும்.

சாதரண பதிவில் பதிவு செய்யப் பட்டதால்,
இளையராஜாவின் இசை ஒன்றும் சாதாரணம் இல்லை.

[Sanjeevi]

ஈறை பற்றி :lol:

tvsankar - kavanikka 'preview'

[tvsankar]

sanjeevi,
enna kidnal.

indha kashtathuku than - thanglish...

irir123 - meratarar. adhanala dhan tamil..
correct panradhukulae kindala......

Grrrrrrrrr..

[Sanjeevi]

Usha Sankar, better you can use google which will reduce spelling mistakes

http://www.google.com/transliterate/tamil

[ananth222]

Wow, when it comes to belittling our own culture, Indians are the best! The belief system in the US is much worse than the Indian one - many people here are quite certain that the earth is only 6000 years old and write books and build museums about how dinosaurs and men lived together. The basic education is so pathetic only 25% of high-schoolers can correctly point Europe on the world map. Many westerners look up to the Indian belief system and education system.

Coming back to the main issue, there is no dearth of talent and creativity in India. Due to the fast marketing of art, only the cheap stuff is sold. Same here with the auto-tuners and cheap rap albums. Both places have good creative artists also, if you look for them. It is easy to complain, but hard to step above the limitations and succeed. And harder still to appreciate those who stepped above the limitations better than you.

[irir123]

Wow, when it comes to belittling our own culture, Indians are the best! The belief system in the US is much worse than the Indian one - many people here are quite certain that the earth is only 6000 years old and write books and build museums about how dinosaurs and men lived together. The basic education is so pathetic only 25% of high-schoolers can correctly point Europe on the world map. Many westerners look up to the Indian belief system and education system.

Coming back to the main issue, there is no dearth of talent and creativity in India. Due to the fast marketing of art, only the cheap stuff is sold. Same here with the auto-tuners and cheap rap albums. Both places have good creative artists also, if you look for them. It is easy to complain, but hard to step above the limitations and succeed. And harder still to appreciate those who stepped above the limitations better than you.

peace! the belief systems prevalent regarding the age of the earth etc etc, but a liberal media/scientific community is fighting it tooth and nail - am not belittling the finer aspects of what we have - but to ignore the glaring loopholes will not be very honest

[irir123]

sanjeevi,
enna kidnal.

indha kashtathuku than - thanglish...

irir123 - meratarar. adhanala dhan tamil..
correct panradhukulae kindala......

Grrrrrrrrr..

i thought i made a humble request - the request was also because there are others in the forum who dont understand tamil, so as a matter of common courtesy, it wud be good to write in english so that everyone can understand what we are saying!

[tvsankar]

irir123,
unga request -enanku meratara madhiri thonithu.

enaku english la solla theriyalai. dono engllish.
sorry.
inime disturb panna maten.

pl continue your service........

[irir123]

irir123,
unga request -enanku meratara madhiri thonithu.

enaku english la solla theriyalai. dono engllish.
sorry.
inime disturb panna maten.

pl continue your service........

naan mirattavey illai madam! i swear - neengaley naan ippo ezhudhuvadhai padichhu paarthu, adhai purindhu kolvadharkku yevvalavo kashtappadanumnu sollunga paappom!

IR rasigan anbaagathaan pesa mudiyum - miratti pesinaal, adhu isai rasiganukku azhagum illai, poruthhamum illai!

[tvsankar]

சரி இல்லாததை சரி செய்ய ராஜா FANS
மிரட்டலாம். தவ்று இல்லை

நான் தவறு செய்வதால் , எனக்கு மிரட்டுவது போலத் தோன்றி இருக்கலாம்.

இப்படித் தமிழில் எழுதும் நேரம், 8 சப்பாத்தி செய்து இருப்பேன்

irir`123, naan thanglish il ezhudhuvadhal,
thanglish il padika - enaku kashtam ilai. hahahha..

kochikadhingo. inime inga ezhudha vara maten.

[eagle]

தமிழ் தெரிந்தவர்களுக்கு கூட இந்த மாதிரி தங்லிஷில் தாங்கள் எழுதுவதை படிப்பதற்கு ரொம்பவும் கஷ்டமாக இருக்கிறது.

முயன்றால் முடியாதது இல்லை... சித்திரமும் கைப்பழக்கம் செந்தமிழும் நாப்பழக்கம் உங்களுக்காக வேண்டுமானால் சப்பாத்தி செய்வதும் தமிழில் தட்டெழுச்சு செய்வதும் கைப்பழக்கம் என்று மாற்றி விடலாம்...:lol:

நான் ஜிமெயில் உதவியுடன்தான் டைப் செய்கிறேன் பெரும்பாலான நேரங்களில் நாம் சிறிய தவறுகள் செய்தாலும் சரியான வார்த்தைகளை அதுவே அளித்து விடுகிறது...

[eagle]

நான் ஹாலிவுட் படத்துக்கு ராஜா இசை அமைப்பதைப் பற்றி கொளுத்திப்போட்ட திரி கொழுந்துவிட்டு எரிந்ததை கண்டேன். நமது எந்த இந்திய மொழிகளில் உருவாக்கப்படும் எந்த படத்தையும் விட (சில விதிவிலக்குகள் உண்டு) நிறைய ஹாலிவுட் படங்கள் ராஜாவின் பின்னணி இசை அமைக்கும் திறனுக்கு தீனி போட வல்லது என்பது என் உறுதியான நம்பிக்கை. குறிப்பாக science fiction, historical படங்கள்... ஆற்றொழுக்கான நடை என்பது போல ஒரு முழு நீள symphony சினிமாவில் அமைப்பதற்கு அங்குதான் வாய்ப்பிருக்கிறது.

[irir123]

நான் ஹாலிவுட் படத்துக்கு ராஜா இசை அமைப்பதைப் பற்றி கொளுத்திப்போட்ட திரி கொழுந்துவிட்டு எரிந்ததை கண்டேன். நமது எந்த இந்திய மொழிகளில் உருவாக்கப்படும் எந்த படத்தையும் விட (சில விதிவிலக்குகள் உண்டு) நிறைய ஹாலிவுட் படங்கள் ராஜாவின் பின்னணி இசை அமைக்கும் திறனுக்கு தீனி போட வல்லது என்பது என் உறுதியான நம்பிக்கை. குறிப்பாக science fiction, historical படங்கள்... ஆற்றொழுக்கான நடை என்பது போல ஒரு முழு நீள symphony சினிமாவில் அமைப்பதற்கு அங்குதான் வாய்ப்பிருக்கிறது.

AM not denying that - however, there are already enough composers in hollywood who can easily take up the challenge of doing such a score for such a film! they simply do NOT NEED someone like IR to score for them !

thats not the case here in India! if someone were to make a historical with a solid script, IR wud be the automatic choice!

[venkkiram]

நான் ஹாலிவுட் படத்துக்கு ராஜா இசை அமைப்பதைப் பற்றி கொளுத்திப்போட்ட திரி கொழுந்துவிட்டு எரிந்ததை கண்டேன். நமது எந்த இந்திய மொழிகளில் உருவாக்கப்படும் எந்த படத்தையும் விட (சில விதிவிலக்குகள் உண்டு) நிறைய ஹாலிவுட் படங்கள் ராஜாவின் பின்னணி இசை அமைக்கும் திறனுக்கு தீனி போட வல்லது என்பது என் உறுதியான நம்பிக்கை. குறிப்பாக science fiction, historical படங்கள்... ஆற்றொழுக்கான நடை என்பது போல ஒரு முழு நீள symphony சினிமாவில் அமைப்பதற்கு அங்குதான் வாய்ப்பிருக்கிறது.

AM not denying that - however, there are already enough composers in hollywood who can easily take up the challenge of doing such a score for such a film! they simply do NOT NEED someone like IR to score for them !

thats not the case here in India! if someone were to make a historical with a solid script, IR wud be the automatic choice!அமேரிக்கர்களுக்கு ராஜாவின் இசையை அறிமுகப்படுத்துவதற்கும், ஹாலிவுட்டுக்கு ராஜா தேவையில்லை என்பதற்கும் இடையேயுள்ள நிலைப்பாடு புரியவில்லை.

நீங்களே சொல்கிறீர்கள்! அங்கு புதிய இசையமைப்பாளர்கள் வந்துகொண்டே இருக்கிறார்கள் என.. அப்படிருக்கும் போது, ராஜாவும் வந்தால் என்ன? என்னைக் கேட்டால், ராஜாவின் பல்வேறு பின்னணி இசை முயற்சிகளுக்கு நமது இந்தியப் படக் காட்சிகளின் தரம் யானப்பசிக்கு சோளப்பொறி போட்டது போல. எல்லா திசைகளிலிலும் எல்லைகளை நீட்டித்துக்கொண்டே யிருக்கும் அயல்நாட்டுப் படைப்புக்கள்தான் ராஜாவிற்கு தகுந்த களம்.

ஆனால் ஹாலிவுட்டில் ஒரு படத்தில் இசையமைப்பாளர் எப்படி தேர்ந்தெடுக்கப் படுகிறார் என்பதிலும், எப்படியெல்லாம் ஒரு படத்தின் கூட்டு முயற்சியில் பங்கெடுத்துக் கொள்கிறார் என்பதிலும், கோடம்பாக்கம் - ஹாலிவுட்டிற்குமிடையே மலையளவு வேறுபாடுகள் இருக்கிறது. அந்த நிலைக்கு ராஜா தன்னை தயார் படுத்திக் கொள்வாரா, இல்லை அதெல்லாம் அவருக்கு ஒத்துவராது என்பதை முன்கூட்டியே அறிந்துதான் அந்த முயற்சிகளில் ஈடுபடாமல் இருக்கிறாரா என்றெல்லாம் ஐயப்பாடுகள் எழுகின்றது.

[kiru]

ஆனால் ஹாலிவுட்டில் ஒரு படத்தில் இசையமைப்பாளர் எப்படி தேர்ந்தெடுக்கப் படுகிறார் என்பதிலும், எப்படியெல்லாம் ஒரு படத்தின் கூட்டு முயற்சியில் பங்கெடுத்துக் கொள்கிறார் என்பதிலும், கோடம்பாக்கம் - ஹாலிவுட்டிற்குமிடையே மலையளவு வேறுபாடுகள் இருக்கிறது. அந்த நிலைக்கு ராஜா தன்னை தயார் படுத்திக் கொள்வாரா, இல்லை அதெல்லாம் அவருக்கு ஒத்துவராது என்பதை முன்கூட்டியே அறிந்துதான் அந்த முயற்சிகளில் ஈடுபடாமல்
இருக்கிறாரா என்றெல்லாம் ஐயப்பாடுகள் எழுகின்றது.

Venkiram, I dont think IR will have problems collaborating with others. He did very well with Lazlo Kovacs, the conductor of the Budapest Symphony Orchestra. I think he just needs somebody who is at his level of expertise. Even today, for film music, if somebody can immediately tell the raagam of the tune, as soon as they hear him sing the first few lines, he will just wakeup and the whole movie music will be very good. Kamal is able to extract work out of him because his knowledge is so very good, that IR will take pains to do quality work.
I have a very slight doubt, artistically, he might be in a different school of thought. The western world is highly structured and expects people to not 'over-innovate' ie. clean, structured music is appreciated and only when the artiste has proven in delivering this level of quality any creative efforts to do "free-form" is welcomed. Till then you have to play by the books. Rahman understands and does this very well. It is quite possible IR also will do this because he is old and mature now and if big money is involved he might be very receptive :-)

[kiru]

AM not denying that - however, there are already enough composers in hollywood who can easily take up the challenge of doing such a score for such a film! they simply do NOT NEED someone like IR to score for them !

thats not the case here in India! if someone were to make a historical with a solid script, IR wud be the automatic choice!
I think Indian composers have an edge. Rahman is an example. We are very good at "tunes". I dont think westerners can create as many tunes like we do in Indian film music. Now, with classical music, only compositions which had a tune like flow were popular hits. So somebody like IR who can create complex/polyphonic music, but also have the tune-smithing skills has a very good advantage. BTW, it is very difficult for even westerners to do counterpoints. IR is one of those people who can do this very well. Counterpoint though is only one of the various techniques, it paves the way for learning/do other classical music techniques. So I am waiting for a duel with John Williams and IR :-)

[venkkiram]

Venkiram, I dont think IR will have problems collaborating with others. He did very well with Lazlo Kovacs, the conductor of the Budapest Symphony Orchestra. தனிப்பட்ட சொந்த ஆல்பம் சம்பந்தமாக ஒருவரை தேர்ந்தெடுத்து அவருடன் பணியாற்றுவது வேறு.. ஹாலிவுட் படங்களுக்கு இசையமைக்கும் பணி என்பது வேறு என நினைக்கிறேன்.

இணையத்தில் படித்து தெரிந்து கொண்டதுவரை, ஹாலிவிட்டில் ஒரு படத்தின் இசையமைப்பாளர் எனத் தேர்வு செய்வது நம்ம நாட்டில் Govt Tender விடுவதுபோல, ஒரு ஒழுங்கு முறை. படத்தின் கதையும், கதைக்களனும் பரிசலிக்கப்பட்ட இசையமைப்பாளர்களுக்கு தெரிவிக்கப்பட்டு, அவர்களிடமிருந்து படத்தின் சாராம்ச இசை பெறப்படுகிறது. John williams-கூட விதிவிலக்கல்ல.. அந்த முறையில் ஆட்படுத்தப்பட்டே, அதில் இயக்குனர்களுக்கும், மற்ற சம்பந்தப்பட்ட கலைஞர்களுக்கும் திருப்தி அளிக்கப்பட்டால் மட்டுமே தேர்ந்தெடுக்கப்படுகிறார். மேலும், இசையமைப்பாளரின் எல்லா பின்னணி இசைக் குறிப்புக்களும் அப்படியே படத்தில் இடம்பெறப் போவதில்லை. இயக்குனர் மற்றும் இறுதித் தொகுப்பை உருவாக்கும் கலைஞர்கள் தேவையில்லாத பட்சத்தில் சில இசைத் தொகுப்புக்களை நீக்கிவிட்டு, தேவை என உணர்வதை தேர்வு செய்து படக்காட்சியோடு சேர்க்கிறார்கள். கோடம்பாக்கத்தில் ராஜா செய்துவரும் வேலைகளுக்கும், ஹாலிவுட்டில் நடத்தப்படும் வேலைகளுக்கும் சொந்தக் கருத்தை செயல்படுத்துதல் மற்றும் அதிகார பங்கீடு என்ற முறையில் பார்த்தால் கூட நிறைய வித்யாசங்கள் தென்படுகிறது.

[jaiganes]

Venkiram, I dont think IR will have problems collaborating with others. He did very well with Lazlo Kovacs, the conductor of the Budapest Symphony Orchestra. தனிப்பட்ட சொந்த ஆல்பம் சம்பந்தமாக ஒருவரை தேர்ந்தெடுத்து அவருடன் பணியாற்றுவது வேறு.. ஹாலிவுட் படங்களுக்கு இசையமைக்கும் பணி என்பது வேறு என நினைக்கிறேன்.

இணையத்தில் படித்து தெரிந்து கொண்டதுவரை, ஹாலிவிட்டில் ஒரு படத்தின் இசையமைப்பாளர் எனத் தேர்வு செய்வது நம்ம நாட்டில் Govt Tender விடுவதுபோல, ஒரு ஒழுங்கு முறை. படத்தின் கதையும், கதைக்களனும் பரிசலிக்கப்பட்ட இசையமைப்பாளர்களுக்கு தெரிவிக்கப்பட்டு, அவர்களிடமிருந்து படத்தின் சாராம்ச இசை பெறப்படுகிறது. John williams-கூட விதிவிலக்கல்ல.. அந்த முறையில் ஆட்படுத்தப்பட்டே, அதில் இயக்குனர்களுக்கும், மற்ற சம்பந்தப்பட்ட கலைஞர்களுக்கும் திருப்தி அளிக்கப்பட்டால் மட்டுமே தேர்ந்தெடுக்கப்படுகிறார். மேலும், இசையமைப்பாளரின் எல்லா பின்னணி இசைக் குறிப்புக்களும் அப்படியே படத்தில் இடம்பெறப் போவதில்லை. இயக்குனர் மற்றும் இறுதித் தொகுப்பை உருவாக்கும் கலைஞர்கள் தேவையில்லாத பட்சத்தில் சில இசைத் தொகுப்புக்களை நீக்கிவிட்டு, தேவை என உணர்வதை தேர்வு செய்து படக்காட்சியோடு சேர்க்கிறார்கள். கோடம்பாக்கத்தில் ராஜா செய்துவரும் வேலைகளுக்கும், ஹாலிவுட்டில் நடத்தப்படும் வேலைகளுக்கும் சொந்தக் கருத்தை செயல்படுத்துதல் மற்றும் அதிகார பங்கீடு என்ற முறையில் பார்த்தால் கூட நிறைய வித்யாசங்கள் தென்படுகிறது.

i think directors can and always have overrided this aspect.
Classic example is the music composer selection of Serpico, blade runner and 'The mission'. Directors wanted a composer to compose and got their choices approved. concerned composer has to simply go and register their names in hollywood union. thats all.
The rules and processes always apply to 'general' talents. Hollywood has never denied special talents its doors. They were more than ready to work with Ray.

[irir123]

venkkiram and others:

1. new composers keep coming up in Hollywood, YES - thats true, however, they come up through proper channels - the industry is highly structured and follows certain protocol - name/fame/reputation of any other composer outside their ambit WILL NOT entice them to hire an 'outsider', unless, if the 'outsider' makes an honest effort to reach them!!

2. ARR did the 'reaching out' very meticulously, in an organized manner, and hence ended up scoring for Danny Boyle

3. In spite of this, ARR will not simply get an oppurtunity to do scores for, say, a "Robinhood", or a James Cameron, Robert Zemeckis film etc, since they all have standard preferred composers and they plan well and way ahead of time - 2-3 years down the line, ARR might get hooked up with a major production house for a major director etc, if he continues in this same meticulous fashion! we are talking about the different approaches (of IR and ARR) towards furthering ones ambitions in this field, thats like daylight and night!

4. What am doing is out of sheer passion - the odds of some Hollywood agent listening to IR's scores (through my efforts), then getting interested in IR's music, then approaching IR, IR saying "yes" to that agent, and then the agent getting hold of a production house to get a project for IR - its like investing $50 in a casino gambling game in vegas, hoping to make 5 million dollars!

5. There is an even more remote possibility that some Hollywood director, or a producer from a big production house, happens to listen to IR's scores (through say this radio show), or, read abt IR on AllAboutJazz.com and get hooked and then decides entirely on his/her discretion that IR shd be hired for that studio's next production - and thats like investing $5 in vegas, hoping to make 50 million dollars!

6. we are talking about remote possibilities and half-chances - hollywood DOES NOT work that way, fyki - the industry is highly structured and things are done in a very professional manner - even if a Hollywood rep wants to contact IR, there is not a single source through which he/she can contact IR! he/she would have to spend at least a month trying to contact IR! our side of the story speaks/smacks of such profound unprofessionalism

Its my sincere wish that IR first gets nation-wide popularity in India and then probably with a bigger NRI network watching more Hindi films than regional ones, IR might become popular and this popularity might attract production houses

Tamil Nadu is not the center of the earth and even now, majority of people from the other side of Andhra Pradesh have not even heard of IR (despite cheeni kum, paa etc etc)

being optimistic is ok, but it helps keep ones feet grounded, being a realist!

[Sureshs65]

irir123,

Very aptly put. What you say is the reality. As you said, the situation is that Hollywood is definitely not looking towards India to give them a composer. It is very true that unless Raja has the ambition and then the necessary PR bandwagon behind him, there is no hope of breaking through in Hollywood. That is a given. So it all depends on Raja's own wish and desires, of which we have no control.

Having said that, what you have been doing is definitely an effort in the right direction. It is bound to bring more people to notice and appreciate Raja's work. It is not necessary to be labelled a great composer only if you compose for Hollywood. All of us know Raja's calibre and what he has delivered and his capability to deliver top class music even now. If we are able to pass on this enjoyment to more people, as Raja fans we would have done our job. Everything else is a bonus. Of course, this is my individual stand and I know you may want more people to recognize Raja and give him some work which can showcase his talents to a world wide audience.

Anyway, I had passed on the podcast link to my college mates group, and lot of them heard it and were quite taken in by the compositions, especially the instrumental ones. All these guys are the children of 80s but haven't heard NBW and HTNI!!! In that way, the podcast can also reach our own people who do not know what Raja has done!!!
(A small digression. The podcast discussion in my college group ended up with one person asking me to write about old movie songs from Indian films and to showcase other composers as well. So I have started a new series on my blog. Interested people can check it out at: http://sureshs65music.blogspot.com. Sorry for this self plug.)

[eagle]

I would like to remind people here raaja had already once scored for an hollywood movie though the movie is produced by another indian ashok amirtharaj. He worked as a co - composer (?) his name appeared in the title card.

The music in the movie bloodstone unfortunately failed to create an impression even among the HCIR fans. That time the talk was that he plan to score a an album the way generally western musicians do but that also never materialized.

Even today its not very difficult for him to get a chance to score one hollywood movie... he has enough connections to make that as a reality. It is not as tough as its been projected here. But the real question is whether our man would be interested... he lost that interest long time back...

[eagle]

He once said thiruvannamalai is the only reason he prefers to be here all the time..otherwise he would settle in a western country and produce music... what can anybody do if he is so much spiritually grounded here...

[Devaraagam]

irir123,

What you said is 100% true "being optimistic is ok, but it helps keep ones feet grounded, being a realist!"

we were grown with IR when IR was growing in the Tamil film so whatever the music we listen, IR is personal touch for us. like this everybody in the world has their personal touch which we cannot deny and cannot expect IR should be the personnel touch for everyone and this does not mean that we (I) won't listen and appreciate others work.


I feel you had done (Radio Show)the show based on this personal touch.

the choices made by you on that show was excellent which can understand by everyone.

To have a feel of complete work done by IR, a person should have greater understanding of our culture and the life, which is impossible for others outside south India.(as you said, even in Andra its difficult)

In my opinion and the person observing IR for the past 30 yrs. I can tell that IR is the person knows only Music and he is giving that whoever is asking from him as a music. He won't care when someone is getting music from others and some one not turned back..

As I told earlier in the forum, IR used to tell."Music is always good. there is no bad and good music..its all whether you like it or not"

ARR approach was very clear and focused on Global rego. aspect. I want to say that ARR has not achieved this in a simple way..he had put the effort which is required for that.

Finally..This is what IR..This is what I like with IR

If a person has to listen IR music in his life time..he will listen..no one cannot deny that and no one cannot enforce the same.

Let us see widely and listen all musics and have a personal touch of IR.

[app_engine]

Seriously, if IR is showing 100% interest, there are enough people to get him connected to HW. May not be the big ones like those making avatar etc but there're tons of others and it's really no big deal to get "just a movie".

IR has enough admirers among Indians of various languages & Thamizh Srilankans worldwide (not necessarily only TN folks). And these groups are not totally without Hwood connections.

In any case, like irir123 said, IR has no habit of reaching out and that closes the whole possibility.

[irir123]

I would like to remind people here raaja had already once scored for an hollywood movie though the movie is produced by another indian ashok amirtharaj. He worked as a co - composer (?) his name appeared in the title card.

The music in the movie bloodstone unfortunately failed to create an impression even among the HCIR fans. That time the talk was that he plan to score a an album the way generally western musicians do but that also never materialized.

Even today its not very difficult for him to get a chance to score one hollywood movie... he has enough connections to make that as a reality. It is not as tough as its been projected here. But the real question is whether our man would be interested... he lost that interest long time back...

Ashok Amritraj and Bloodstone - sigh - Bloodstone does not even qualify to be a "D" grade tamil masala film - who cares if IR scored for that film, or not ??

[raagas]

Interesting Discussion.Very valid thoughts by irir.

To add further,I dont think IR would find it comfortable working in Hollywood setup firstly. As irir said, it is highly structured, corporatized and what not. In case of IR, he is the final authority for his creations. Hollywood doesnt work like that. They have a team, which has to approve every piece of creation and its relevance & apt-ness to the story or theme etc. Be it music or make-up or costumes, anything. I dont want to digress or compare, but film-maker shekar kapur once lamented that - "I asked A R Rahman to score the music for Golden Age, and even then I was allowed only to take him as a co composer. And I watched as the studio rejected the most beautiful compositions from A R Rahman, because they did not get or were not willing to embrace something from another culture. As it happened the score of Golden Age was not half as good as it could have been."

IR can never ever take the system of functioning in Hollywood.He cares a hoot about some studio fellow dumping his track & will eventually quit, to return back to tamil films & devotional albums. So, lets not really worry about IR & Hollywood. It will never happen.

[kiru]

Golden Age ..needed IR, probably not ARR.

[raagas]

Kiru,

I agree that it needed IR.But i cited it as an example.We all know that IR sticks to the notes he writes.Not a single note changes and it is merely executed. He write the whole code for the program and his crew comes and click their respective "Run" buttons for the Program. Now in Hollywood, the studio guys tweak a lot with the scores. If not technically, atleast by suggestions and demands. They might dismiss some tune and take some other tune. or they might even ask IR to collaborate. I dont think IR will give in to all that. He can never do his work whole-heartedly in such a setup.

[eagle]

யார் எழுதிய பாட்டாக இருந்தாலும் குற்றம் கண்டு பிடிப்பார்களா? :)...எ.கொ.ச இது?...அப்ப நம்ம தல அந்த பக்கமே தல வச்சு படுக்கமாட்டார்னு நினைக்கிறேன் ..

[app_engine]

யார் எழுதிய பாட்டாக இருந்தாலும் குற்றம் கண்டு பிடிப்பார்களா? :)...எ.கொ.ச இது?...அப்ப நம்ம தல அந்த பக்கமே தல வச்சு படுக்கமாட்டார்னு நினைக்கிறேன் ..

That is one of the wrong propaganda about IR, IMHO. There is at least one reported case where IR's melody was rejected and he composed an alternate (then pANdichcheemaiyilE). That IR is inflexible / fixed is a media (or hub?) generated thingy.

How could Balki "arm-twist" him to simply tweak his yesteryear hits for his two movies, had IR not wanted to work in such settings?

If there's an opportunity with sufficient revenue terms, I don't think IR will refuse to work with different terms and conditions.

The only problem with him at this point of time is "lack of efforts or possibly motivation to get an opportunity" :-)

[Sanjeevi]

You people is not considering his age and his wish? See he is getting more and more a religious no no spiritual. So I think he won't take any move even a bit atleast initially. If everything will happen correctly atleast 'the start' then he can try at max.

[eagle]

யார் எழுதிய பாட்டாக இருந்தாலும் குற்றம் கண்டு பிடிப்பார்களா? :)...எ.கொ.ச இது?...அப்ப நம்ம தல அந்த பக்கமே தல வச்சு படுக்கமாட்டார்னு நினைக்கிறேன் ..

That is one of the wrong propaganda about IR, IMHO. There is at least one reported case where IR's melody was rejected and he composed an alternate (then pANdichcheemaiyilE). That IR is inflexible / fixed is a media (or hub?) generated thingy.

How could Balki "arm-twist" him to simply tweak his yesteryear hits for his two movies, had IR not wanted to work in such settings?

If there's an opportunity with sufficient revenue terms, I don't think IR will refuse to work with different terms and conditions.

The only problem with him at this point of time is "lack of efforts or possibly motivation to get an opportunity" :-)

I agree partially that he composed different tunes if the director is not satisfied there are so many examples to that.One that come to mind immediately is RV udhayakumar narrated incident about yejaman song but again when it comes to scoring BGM he prefers to listen to director any length befor scoring it but refuses to alter it later if the director demands... is there any incident where he compromised on this too? would like to know...

[app_engine]

when it comes to scoring BGM he prefers to listen to director any length befor scoring it but refuses to alter it later if the director demands... is there any incident where he compromised on this too? would like to know...

Don't remember reading anything about BGM stuff (except the 'AhA / OhO / aRputham / instantaneous / perfectly fitting etc' business).

There're two things here -
First - not much attention is paid in general by the public for BGM. So, that reflects on the importance the production group gives for that. Under such conditions, what IR gave was accepted as if a "small eclairs" expecting child were given a big "herschey's almond bar":-)

Only on rare occasions they give extra attention, like BSO etc.

Second, even on such occasions, there's possibility that IR far exceeded the expections of the team (thus possibly not requiring changes).

[Sureshs65]

The only thing I am very certain about Raja is this ability of his to surprise us, musically or otherwise. When he speaks in public functions you sometimes want to hide the microphone from him. In other cases, like the one during Rahman's felicitation function, you don't want him to stop!!! Added to it is the fact that he is a person who knows what is happening around him. (I remember reading a member of Rahman's technical team saying that two of the most technology savvy guys amongst music directors are Rahman and Raja.) I can't read his mind but I am more than sure he knows _exactly_ what happens in Hollywood when you score for a film. More importantly, even in the Indian film context, he knows his role exactly. He never overdoes his part in BGM. He gives what is required for the movie and not what he wants to give. Given this background, I wouldn't be surprised if he agreed to do a Hollywood on Hollywood terms !!! Of course, as irir123 has indicated, Hollywood will not seek him out and he himself is not seeking out Hollywood. So this will remain our wish only for the time being. Something can only happen if it is a wish of Raja.

[raagas]

Added to it is the fact that he is a person who knows what is happening around him. (I remember reading a member of Rahman's technical team saying that two of the most technology savvy guys amongst music directors are Rahman and Raja.) I can't read his mind but I am more than sure he knows _exactly_ what happens in Hollywood when you score for a film. More importantly, even in the Indian film context, he knows his role exactly. He never overdoes his part in BGM. He gives what is required for the movie and not what he wants to give.

I totally agree. Even i agree reading one article. I cant exactly recall if it was H.sridhar but could be. But i remember someone saying that IR & ARR are very techno savvy guys.
Secondly, I also think that he is well aware about what happens in Hollywood and how.Matter of common sense too.. that if we, just the audience who are outside the industry know few things, he definitely must be knowing quite a lot, having worked in the industry for decades. Added to that, he has worked with a number of musicians, in Chennai, Bombay & Budapest. So he is very much aware and may be thats why he is not ambitious about trying Hollywood (so that he neednt compromise).

[rajkumarc]

Listened to the show and it was nicely conducted. Made a couple of my friends listen to that and they were pleasantly surprised. The quality of the songs broadcasted was awesome and it was a good mix.

How was the feedback? I was unable to find any comments or discussions on the show from listeners.

[irir123]

many of my friends here often curiously ask me as to how and why am this deeply/passionately hooked to this particular composer's work !

last evening, a very good friend (who knows music, plays the piano, and not the run-of-the-mill slam bang music fan!)asked the same question yesterday "dont you listen to other music at all ?" - i go "yes, i do, music is music, who am i to judge ? but i wud like you to listen to some stuff i have and know your reaction, response"

Yesterday evening, I played some of IR's music to her - since i didnt want to prejudice/bias her opinion, i let her choose the track from a CD at random and tell me about the tracks she liked/could relate to!

the piano prelude to "poo poothadhu" piece, brought tears (real tears, btw) and when the title score of "Hey Ram" was played, we both involuntarily swung our arms as if conducting the score, when the vocal chorus goes to a crescendo - i had to play it at least 4 times and my friend was not content with it even then!

and then I ask "now tell me - how can I, who grew up listening to such stuff, NOT get hooked to this, when such music moved someone like you, who is listening to this for the first time ?!"

her (and many others) main complaint is that most of IR's most absorbing/moving music is short and they feel they have been robbed off a beautiful listening experience abruptly since the tracks dont extend beyond 2-3 min!!

yennatha solla, yaar kitta poyi solla!

[Sanjeevi]

her (and many others) main complaint is that most of IR's most absorbing/moving music is short and they feel they have been robbed off a beautiful listening experience abruptly since the tracks dont extend beyond 2-3 min!!


This is called film music. Is not it? Raaja played/plays always within boundaries and rarely he has given NBW kind stuffs that too stopped now :sad:

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

yennatha solla, yaar kitta poyi solla!

u already know, thiruvaasagam, NBW & HTNI as lenghty tracks... i know, only 3 albums... but still...


kodumai ennannaa nammaalu is not releasing his symphony :oops: :cry:

[Sureshs65]

irir123,

Great experience. Composing a 2 to 3 min track is quite different from composing a longer piece. Raja shows he is capable of maintaining the consistency, beauty, a sense of surprise throughout a long piece as he had demonstrated in his private albums. His pieces have an organic unity and that aspect of his music cannot be demonstrated with short pieces. As you say, how can we get him to do something bigger? That's the million dollar question.