Charu doesn't like Raaja's music and calls it trash. Some of us don't like Charu's opinion and call him crazy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sureshs65
Both cases are at the same level in my mind. Throwing mud :)
Why should we go that low?
Charu doesn't like Raaja's music and calls it trash. Some of us don't like Charu's opinion and call him crazy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sureshs65
Both cases are at the same level in my mind. Throwing mud :)
Why should we go that low?
Exactly my point :clap:Quote:
Originally Posted by tvsankar
If I don't like Charu, I will keep away from him.
Shankar,
Unga list ai partha - 80s ai thaandi varalai pola irukae...
Vedham pudhidhu - film la - paiyan Sathyaraj parthu solvan - naan karai yeriten.. neenga angaeyae irukaelae nu..
andha madhiri,,
IR - 2010 varai music seinju irukar..
Neenga inum 80s list layae irukeengalae..
apo epadi ......... romba kashtam shankar...
Neraiya Homework ungaluku iruku....
90s Raajavai kelunga... Then 2000 ku vango... pesalam...
Objection your honour :)Quote:
Originally Posted by par
you are toally wrong. If anybody said here "Charu's Zero degree novel is worst?" or "His serious articles are exactly a comedy piece?". We told against him for his statement on IR and his music. period
par,
I will tell this slowly one last time and I hope you will understand.
There is a major difference between saying that you don't like 'Paa' songs and saying 'Paa is the laughing stock of North India. Check with your friends and if that is not the case I will remove half of my lovely mustache' or some such thing.
If the difference between these two statements is clear, we don't have an argument. In case it is not clear, then also we don't have an argument.
suresh65 - IMHO, both charu and par need to be safely ignored - giving them and their opinions importance actually gives them credibility!Quote:
Originally Posted by Sureshs65
Very true irir123. And desist I shall.
oru levelukku mela IR pathi analysis pannum intha makkalukku innamum charu oru manushanaaga paduvathu is surprising to me! IR's famelight is so powerful that we are / were thinking that he is the only one in whole of TN to make fun on raja(leave alone the 'few' ARR fans) thats the 1st mistake. he may dislike and totally discard raja, thats ok (infact thats not the case, he has written that he liked thiruvaasagam and nandalala) vimarsanangal sagajam thaan.
but look at the recent issue in mudam arasu bathilgal. the reader asked a question that did charu says hat IR DONT KNOW to compose music? what say abt it? the arasu answer is, charu is looked upon like a joker, in literary community.
charu, with all anger repented and tried to showcase(but in poor vain :lol: ) his 'unexisting' fame at kerala!!! but the problem is he never corrected his statement. he didnt try to say "நான் இளையராஜாவுக்கு இசையமைக்கவே தெரியாது என்று சொல்லவில்லை, அவரின் இசையை கடுமையாக விமரிசித்தேன், அவ்வளவுதான்" and that is too bad right?
இளையராஜாவின் இசையை கடுமையாக விமர்சிப்பதும்,
அவருக்கு (மருந்துக்கு கூட )இசையமைக்கவே தெரியாது என்று சொல்வதும், முற்றிலும் வெவ்வேறு. இதற்கு மேலும் சாரு நிவதிதாவை ஆதரிப்பவர்களை என்னென்று சொல்வது ? நல்ல வேலை, தமிழ்நாட்டில் மொத்தமும் ஒரு முப்பத்திநாலு பேருக்கு தான் சாறு என்றால் யார் என்று தெரியும்
1.30- 2.05 in Edhaya Baagilu -- Too Cool !! 8-) Raja Raja Thaan.
//eh? :confused2: .......puriyala sakala - enna solreenga? //Quote:
Originally Posted by sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar
I've read Charu's 0 Degree, Kalagam kAdhal Isai and rate him one of the ebst post modern writers in Tamizh. I Specifically call him a 'Crazy Dog' ( if that may apply had I written it earlier or else now) only due to his arrogant blinded bad mouthing about Raaja. If he has a problem in Raaja calling Gaddar, Bob Dylan and the Revolutionary musicians as Garbage ( That was not the case in reality IMHO. Reading the Article by S Anand will clearly indicate Anand's Agenda and how he had bullied Raaja to get those words from his mouth) He should've responded to that, not Trashing Raaja's music. My gut feeling is Charu Loves every part of Raaja's music and has created a pit for himself in the wrong notion that Raaja is against revolutionary music (Oh...Let him listen to Manitha Manitha from KSMS and Poraada..da from ALaiosai ) and living in that pit. Let him come out of that pit first, Only after that we can consider him to be a good human being. Till then he will be a errr... watever... :PQuote:
Originally Posted by par
one help Sir KSMS Song theriyum, Poraada daa from Alaiosai? unga kitta iruntha pls share. Thank u.Quote:
Originally Posted by rajasaranam
எல்லாம் சரி, அவர் எப்போ எழுதுவதையே நிறுத்தப்போறார் (அல்லது குறைந்த பட்சம் 'பா பற்றி தான் சவால் விட்டு எழுதினது தப்பு'ன்னு பகிரங்க மன்னிப்பு கேக்கப்போறார்) ?
சும்மா இந்த நந்தலாலா உலகத்தரம் பம்மாத்தெல்லாம் வேலைக்காவாது!
சவால் விடப்டாது, விட்டா சொன்னதை செய்யணும் :-) செஞ்சதுக்குக்கப்புறம் அந்த ஆளை எந்தக்கணக்கில் சேர்ப்பதுன்னு பேசலாம்!
after 4 days of leave came back to hub and read around 10 pages. oops.. so much of discussion on a 'burnt out composer' :lol2:
read someone wrote 'Raaja is weak in vocal Harmony' (I think its shankar, if not sorry) or something like that in response to irir's irritation towards jangu chaks and jingu chaks. Hmmmm... the person needs a proper initiation and education in regards to what vocal harmony is and where do songs like Thamtha theemtha, eriyile elantha maram, thendral vanthu... and many other songs with rich vocal harmony layers are present.
irir
Getting back to 'jingu chak's and jangu chak's the discussion on which irir has put to rest. my point is these things has to accepted by your american friends in our socio-cultural aspects not theirs. Doesnt these sound fun to you at all! high time we shed our prejudicies and try to see how Raaja approaches music in line with the film, characters and mood.
shankar,
How to enjoy the specific songs! Certainly these things cannot be explained since it is purely subjective and personal experience only. There are no proven scientific methods to make one love something or not. It just happens. Being a fan doesnt necesserily demand you to expect songs of high calibre only. Understanding Raaja is not composing 'albums' but 'Soundtracks' will be the first step towards this direction.
'Karuga mani Karuga Mani' was the best hit song of the movie ( To the extent of the movie's reach) and was demanded/played often in the Channels during the movies short-run. To trash it needs a mindset which keeps us in a high pedestal and I hope you have got it already. So Please enjoy the songs which gives you that elation and dont try to understand/listen to songs which are a delight to common man, it needs a higher level opening up in the mind to lap-up the beauty of other worlds.
Its a different World for us Raaja Fans here, who hail his every song as the best, that Specific Situation, that specific movie has got. The songs falls in place perfectly as does his BGM's. So we have no qualms when the hero goes 'Sullikuppam Ganapathikku Soorathenga udaikerendaa' or 'Adiyushas Sandhya poothathivide' because that is what the situation demanded from Raaja as a composer and he has delivered his 100%. If you have problems you can trash the Film Director for creating such uninspiring situations in the movie instead of Raaja who has given his heart and soul to understand the vision of the Director and perform in full.
<<<will continue later...>>>
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
அதானே இந்த கூத்துல அந்த சவாலை மறந்துடாதீங்கப்பா
Thanx Krish for pointing out the beauty. You made my day.Quote:
Originally Posted by krish244
maddy, dont mistake, raja rahman diskassen sila samayam sandaila mudiyumpothu sila ARR fans making fun of IR and IR fans making fun of ARR sagajam illayaa?(nevermind who starts fisrt) i meant that and not anyone specificallyQuote:
Originally Posted by MADDY
freeya vidunga :)
illa illa - idhula enna irukku :) .......its true, there is disrespect in both camps but that is pretty harmless compared to the broad and concerted malignation campaign of charu on IR......charu blabberings are unparalleled.........Quote:
Originally Posted by sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar
hello - not just american friends, as i have explained earlier, there is nothing like an 'american' - its a melting pot here - if you are using words in a song meaning lyrics they better have some meaning if you want serious music fans to appreciate music - am not talking abt the britney spears, shakira music lovers - am talking abt the country, folk music lovers who also love johnny cash, phil collins et al - if you dont want lyrics, then fine, dont compose music for lyrics, just stick to instrumentals - you may or may not be happy with it - am fine with it and so will be lovers of dire straits, or, pink floyd, who care not much abt lyrics, but only abt musical creativityQuote:
Originally Posted by rajasaranam
while PR is complete from both lyrical/musical point of view, an album like suryakanthi is spoilt royally by these 'mumbo-jumbo' crap - its like making a nice 'javvarisi paayasam' and adding some iron filings into it ! doesnt make sense to me
btw, the same american friends can appreciate and relate to "megam karukkuthu, mazhai vara paarkudhu' for its 'overall innocence and rustic beauty' - this song did not have the 'dangu dingu' nonsense
fyki, am not claiming adding legitimacy to my claims by referring to 'american' friends - long before i even set out overseas, way back in the 1980s, i felt odd/disgusted by IR's use of such nonsense! have u listened to 'ku ku ku kokila raave' from sitara (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GoZuUdh-cQ) ? such a beautiful tune (complete in its pallavi and charanam et al) is totally spoilt by the 'pee pee' (again!) in the second interlude! i simply dont see any connection between the quality of the sublime tune and this anything-but-sublime nonsense!
once again am telling you, i dont become an IR hater and a cynic just because i point out these definite drawbacks - am yet to see a truely accomplished composer in the international/national scene, resorting to such nonsense and fans still legitimising it relating it to cultural/social factors - an 'aylesa' or a 'yelo yelo' chrous, by fishermen/farmers or 'lali lali' as a lullaby is standard, have heard it myself, but to use every other 'word' tat comes to ones imagination n use it in songs and somehow give it a social/cultural relevance to the same sounds naive - i dont care if any other composer does it or not, i only care abt IR using it and cant accept the same after 880 films into his career!
i didnt want to post this, but cudnt resist after the repeated harking abt social and cultural relevance without substantiating the same with real examples
Todays Malayala Manorama carries a statement issued by Ayya on Pazhassi Raja lyrics controversy.Ayya says he never said anything against ONV and he is nothing before the great poet.He further adds that when Hariharan narrated the song situation he had a particular idea on the shaping up of the song.When he got the lyrics he had to keep it aside and come with a new one which became "Aadhi usha sandhya".Manorama is gutter press personified.After Paa music got released there was a lengthy article in the lines of "how dare Ilaiyaraaja criticize when he can only rehash his old tunes for a movie starring amitabh himself".It was their reports that lead usually very silent people like Ouseppachan and Hariharan declare war on Ayya
Nalla vishayam. Andha aRikkaila yaarum kuttaya kuzhappaama irundhaa seri!Quote:
Originally Posted by rajaalltheway
How about you widening your knowledge about Folk music of south India and then getting to know that these jinkchaks, jamchaks, dingdongs, damaku dams and numerous other catch phrases employed by Raaja in various songs are from the vocabulary of the common folks of Rural India?!!Quote:
Originally Posted by irir123
How do I substantiate this with real examples? It was there, It is there and It will be there in common mans Vocabulary. I've seen and heard people singing without words using only jingsa jingsa while separating rice and husk with Ural+Ualkkai or chamchak, jinguchaks, in multiple Rural Festivals. Infact I've never heard 'Ailelo' or 'Ailesaa' in real life which are distinct sounds to seashore folks. I've heard them only through cinema songs. Had I been a blinded Cat, I would've dismissed them as some alien sounds which Raaja (or any other composer) has conjured up himself.
Again! you heard only the 'pee pee' not the accompanying 'dam dam' both sounds accentuating each other because an artist was trying to experiment instrumental sounds with human voices as does young children. ( My own childhood personal experience relates to these 'pee peeeeii' and 'dam dams' or 'tataaataaans' being played without instruments with our own mouths when playing games or even the 'darrr' 'uzzz' sound of bikes and scooters were created with our own mouths during some other games.) If 'Vamsi' the director of the movie wanted to emulate such a scene with 'kiddishness' thrown in this situation what is there for us to bother?Quote:
Originally Posted by irir123
Listening to Vamsi/Raaja combo is always a delight since these two crossed the limits in their artistic ways of exploring into film making and music making. both were made for each other and had sheer fun in breaking the norms of then film/music making style. The music from these mens films are replete with such incorrigible human voices adding them on to music and layering them in their stupidest form, Questioning every authority about what is music and what is not? Madmen they are, filled with such nonsense, Experimentation at its height. It is only possible to get engulfed into this madness or get away from them to live in sanity. I want to be MAD!
Vamsi/Raaja Combo :
Sitara
April 1st Vidhuthala
Anveshana
Maharshi
Preminchu Pelladu
Chettukinda Pleader
Sri Kanaka Mahalaxmi Recording Dance Troupe
Aalapana
Ladies Tailor
Anumanaspadam
Madmen at Work :lol: After posting the above I've put all the songs from these films and playing @ shuffle mode. ...tha Sheer fun & Hilarious - the way they have pushed the limits of music language. :rotfl3: Raaja needs someone like this now to motivate him :|
HereQuote:
Originally Posted by K
http://www.mediafire.com/?tjamwyfdx4v
When Charu criticize abt Raaja no body should discuss on that, but when Kumudam writes charu is a joker on his comments on Raaja , he will do monky dance and cry that how can he write that , if he write he will not work in kumudam like that… what a zero man…
RS, you forgot Detective Narada in that Vamsi-IR combo. Good songs!
It was obvious from the way he spoke on the function that he was not criticising Ouseppachan but rather speaking on how he felt should have been tuned. Enna seivethu if thalaivar uses a single odd-sounding word , they would immediately create a 2-page article sound like 2012 has arrived.Quote:
Originally Posted by rajaalltheway
As everybody had a 'final' comment on Charu, let me have one too. :D
Even though I haven't said anything wrong about Ilaiyaraaja (which I would never say) or anything good about Charu, the regulars here were on to me quickly. No surprises there. :D
In an argument, you say something... the other one says something... you say another thing.. the situation heats up... then an unwanted thing is said in a angry state of mind. It is always the case, unless one withdraws mid way.
Charu's dislike for Ilaiyaraaja is nothing new. He is saying uncharitable things about him for years now. If Ilaiyaraaja's fans have not responded to those comments at the initial stage, Charu may have stopped writing about Ilaiyaraaja (I am only guessing here :) ). To my mind, now it's more of Charu vs Fans of Ilaiyaraaja than Charu vs Ilaiyaraaja.
About this jinkchaks, jamchaks stuff.......
I live very near to Ilaiyaraaja's native place. I have not heard anything like that in these parts.
There are two possibilities I may guess. Folk songs may have been sung with words like that in his younger days. There are not that many who sings folk songs here these days. Second, he may have got it from other parts of TN. We all know he travelled all over TN in his younger days.
even in PR's 'ambum kombum' the tribals ye chorus sounds very funny and creates an upbeat mood. if asali pisili kathakali (aadhavan) is meaningful and appealing for this generation...why should we cry over jinkchaks, jamchaks, dingdongs, damaku dams
ரைஸ் மில்லு வந்துதான் உரலையும் உலக்கையையும் கொண்டு போய்டுச்சே! அப்புறம் எங்க 'ஜிங்கு சான்' வாழும்? அவர் இசையிலாவது அந்த சப்தங்கள் வாழட்டும் :)Quote:
Originally Posted by par
yeah! yes :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by raagas
leave PR aside - the use of tribal chorus sounds in 'ambum kombm' was quite apt to the "T" -Quote:
Originally Posted by Shankar.P
i give up - absolutely no point in trying to explain/get my points across- of course no offense meantQuote:
Originally Posted by rajasaranam
par, the thing is, almost all got familiar with the loads of crap junk that charu sheds in tons, about raja and others like kamal etc. most of us are just happy whenever we see him posting about raja. we got new entertainment, jokes right? so charu wont go out of raja fans or kamalfans discussion. who will give such an entertainment?? but sad thing is, we still see some souls supporting him and his ilakkiyam which is non existing and unpopular by all ways.Quote:
Originally Posted by par
avangala nirutha shollunga!! btw, naanga eppavum nirutha maattom, we need charu the joker :lol:
We still have one :DQuote:
Originally Posted by rajasaranam
Same here.. & I have been travelling from Delhi to Mumbai in the last week.First things - You get to know the actual reach during travel. The Marathi family in our compartment in the train had a son in 6th standard & when my daughter was not opening up for more than a few hours, they prompted the son to the Paa monkey dance & I was surprised, the son & later joined by his father broke of to the monkey dance while the father also recited the theme music piece.Quote:
Originally Posted by rajasaranam
I was surprised – the first hand experience of the level to which the theme music & the music has really sunk – in a place at “random”. Not really the way some guys have placed suspicion on it in their article.
By the end of our journey, the guy taught my 4 year old daughter the sequence of steps, which is complicated I must say, watching them do it a few times, but the children were enjoying!
Interesting, Saagar!
Now, let the people who talk about "IR's music is confined to south" explain what is that he has done extraordinary in pA to get their attention :-)
IMO, it's all the same (actually a number of tunes reused / slightly modified and the orchestration is nothing one can call "north Indian" or catering to their sensibilities etc).
Reason for reach is simple - vehicle & timing! Ofcourse, some interest and focus!
Only these were missing during his prime and the reach-non reach has got nothing to do with music or sensibilities of audience IMSO!
Saw Paa at a theatre in Bandra, Mumbai. Defintely a milestone film.
The songs & the music is so well integrated as a part of the film. One thing that I definitely liked (after watching the film) that I failed to appreciate earlier was the lyrics. Swanand Kirkire has done a very good job. Simple but effective lyrics - and nothing that stands out very odd - another reason for some of IR's earlier Hindi films not doing well. Remember an interview with Sameer, where he had said after Cheeni Kum that IR had felt that many of his earlier songs did not click earlier due to lyrics thats stood out sorely & that Sameer's lyrics gelled best in Hindi for his music.
Balki's placement of songs was excellent. Right from Halke se Bole that went bang on to create goosebumps to the last one.
But could not hide my disappointment that Gum sum was not in full & Mere Paa appearing at the end credits. He could have definitely used them to the full. While my wife too complained, Just after Gum Sum, the ladies in the row in front of us, were also saying the same for Gum sum!
But on the whole, A must watch film , you cannot imagine the film being the same without any of the key people - Amitabh,Abhishek,Vidya, Balki,PC & Of course IR!
Well said "Reason for reach is simple - vehicle & timing! Ofcourse, some interest and focus!". Pity such things did not happen earlier!Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine