The Greatest Indian Epic - Mahabharath

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Originally Posted by viggop

The moral behind this is that Lord demands total devotion, total surrender onto him. If there is a slight ego which makes us think "we" ,"I" can do anything, then he'll prove it to you that even an atom cannot move without HIS will.

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exactly, this reminds of another greatest event, when the Pandavas were in their VanaVasha, Lord Krishna wanted to destroy Arjuna's Ego of being the greatest archer, Lord Krishna calls up the supreme personality of God Head, Parama Iswar (Rudra i.e. Maheshwar,) so Lord Shiva takes the body of a hunter, and ventures into the jungle, there Arjuna and Maheshwar shoot a deer, both Arjuna's arrow and Maheshwar's arrow strikes and kills the deer at the same time, both of them had an argument as to who killed the deer first, this led to a fight, Arjuna tried all his asthirams on the supreme personality of GOD head, Maha Iswar, without realising this, Arjuna was like an ant in front of an Elephant, later Arjuna tried 'MalYuth (wrestling)' with Lord Maheshwar, in which Lord Shiva Hugged him Tight, and Arjuna could not even Move an inch, nor was he able to breath.

Lord Krishna appear in front of him and asks Arjuna to open his Gnana KaN (Eyes of wisdom), when he does Paramatha Maheshwar appears in front of him and grant him a boon. This was a huge blow for Arjuna's Ego.

A very tough quiz on the Mahabharatha.I scored 10/25

http://www.funtrivia.com/playquiz.cfm?qid=150304
&origin=http://www.funtrivia.com/search2_act.cfm_QN_type=quizzes_AND_searchstring=
The+great+mahabharatha_AND_Go.x=13_AND_Go.y=14

Nice quiz Vinugop... scored 22/25 :-)

3 that eluded me are : First arrow (Dhushasana), Beema's son's guru (krishna) and Jayatrada (Shiva's boon).

wow this is all so interesting..thanx Raghu and to the many hubbers for contributing...i never had the chance to see tv serials let alone read the books (comic or otherwise)...so im really appreciate this thread :D

2 questions
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(1)Can someone tell me the story behind Karna's wheel getting stuck because of a curse during the battle?

(2) I think Krishna also sacrifices the life of "Aravan" .another son of the Pandavas.But the above quiz gives name of Bheema's son being sacrificed.I have not heard about this story too.

The quiz was a good one,though a bit tough.

Yet,it may interest you to know that I scored 25/25 at the second attempt! :D :D :lol:

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Originally Posted by viggop

2 questions
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(1)Can someone tell me the story behind Karna's wheel getting stuck because of a curse during the battle?

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...Karna traveled to mount Mahendra where the great sage Parashurama lived. He bowed before the great rishi and with folded hands, he pleaded, зI am a brahmana descending in the line of Bhrigu. Please instruct me in the science of arms.' Hearing that the youth was a brahmana, Parashurama replied, зIndeed, you are welcome here.' Karna then took up his abode in the great sage's hermitage and became his disciple. While residing on Mount Mahendra, he met many Gandharvas, Yakshas and Rakshasas. He made friends with them, and they instructed him in how to use many weapons. He became a great favorite of the demigods. One day as he was roaming the area around the hermitage, he happen to kill a cow by accident. When he informed the brahmana who owned the cow, the brahmana became enraged and cursed Karna saying, O wretched person, you shall bear the fruit of this sinful act. While fighting with you worst enemy, the earth shall devour your chariot wheel. In that state of confusion, your enemy will cut off your head. Just as you have killed my cow when she was inattentive, so your enemy will kill you in the same way!' Karna tried to pacify the brahmana, but the brahmana would not withdraw the curse. Thus Karna returned to his preceptor greatly unhappy.

... and since he lied to Parasurama that he was a Brahmana, when Parasurama came to know that he was a kshatriya and not a Brahmana, he cursed Karna that he will forget all mantrams to divyastrams when he needs them the most....

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Originally Posted by Querida

wow this is all so interesting..thanx Raghu and to the many hubbers for contributing...i never had the chance to see tv serials let alone read the books (comic or otherwise)...so im really appreciate this thread :D

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No Problem Querida, I always wanted to start this, as I found this topic ever so interesting than anything in life, but was afraid of poor responses and interaction, but now I am happy to see many responses.

Will Kunthi also curse Krishna when they attend the cremation of Karna?
When Yudishtra comes to know that Karna was their own elder brother,he is filled with remorse and confronts Kunti about it.
He is angry that his mother kept this as a secret.

He curses that from then on, women will never be able to keep any secrets :-)

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Originally Posted by viggop

Will Kunthi also curse Krishna when they attend the cremation of Karna?
When Yudishtra comes to know that Karna was their own elder brother,he is filled with remorse and confronts Kunti about it.
He is angry that his mother kept this as a secret.

He curses that from then on, women will never be able to keep any secrets :-)

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AS far as I know, Kunti never cursed Lord Krishna

Q1)

I am a bit confused, if Karna's dharma was to be loyal to his friend and encourage evil, then dharma is subject individuals conception? :? :?

Q2)

This was the reason why Panchali married all of the Pandavas, After Arjuna wins Draupadi in the contest and takes her home to show his mother(kunti), Yudhistar told Kunti that he had bought a fruit(meaning draupadi), Kunti matha without realising it was a women, rather than a fruit, she told the pandavas to share it, hence they shared her.

how can this be justified?? :x :x

to make it worse, Arjuna & Bhima had other wives too, now none of the Kauravas Including Ankaraj Karna and Duriyodhana had more than one wife (well, as far as I know).

what kind of dharma is this? :x

Q3) What happend to Vikarna, the ONLY athma who opposed Duchadhana seducing Draupadi and left the palace, did he not fight the batlle, I think he did, and wantedto fight along with the pandavas

Raghu
There is one meaning behind Draupadi marrying 5 men.
It seems that a husband should possess the qualities of pancha pandavas.
That is a man should follow/uphold dharma as Yudishtra,strong as Bheema,warrior against evil like Arjuna and skilled in tools like Nakula and Sahadeva.

P.S:- Do NOT tell this to your wife ;-)

Some mythological stories about Draupadi

(1)One story is that in her previous janams,she was a great devotee of Lord Shiva.She does penance to Lord Shiva to get a husband.When Shiva appears before her and asks for a boon,she repeats "I want a husband" 5 times and hence she gets 5 husbands as Draupadi

One more sizzling story is that Rishi Maudgalya had a devote wife called Nalayini.This rishi was afflicted with leprosy and his face was disfigured and ugly.Once,Nalayini was serving him food and eating too.Because of leprosy,one of Rishi's finger fell into the food Nalayini was eating.Nalayini did not flinch and calmly continued eating the rice without displaying any revulsion.So much was her devotion to her husband.Pleased by this, the rishi asked his wife for a boon.She then asked the rishi to make love to her in 5 different forms and the rishi should turn himself into a handsome man(instead of having the ugly leprosy afflicted face ).The rishi accedes to her request but she is not satisfied with his love.So, the rishi finally curses her that in her next janam ,she'll have 5 husband to quench her thrist of conjugal love.

Draupadi is also one of the panchakanyas(5 eternal virgins) in Hindu mythology.This boon is also said to have been granted by Lord Shiva.However many times she makes love with her 5 husbands,she'll become virgin again.

Raghu
I think only erudite persons will be able to give you explanations about the dharmic aspect of these stories.
Arjuna is also supposed to have a wife in Pandya kingdom called "Alli" (Alli arjuna)

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Originally Posted by viggop

Raghu
There is one meaning behind Draupadi marrying 5 men.
It seems that a husband should possess the qualities of pancha pandavas.
That is a man should follow/uphold dharma as Yudishtra,strong as Bheema,warrior against evil like Arjuna and skilled in tools like Nakula and Sahadeva.

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what ever the reason it was, it was highly disgusting, esp marrying your husband brothers (brother in laws)

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Originally Posted by viggop

P.S:- Do NOT tell this to your wife ;-)

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er, what made u think I was married, just because I am talking about spiritualism, you probably labelled me as a married man with couple of teenage kids in his 40's :x :x :lol: :lol: , any way, if One is a 'Sakalakalavalavan' like me, one does not need to worry, :lol:

ok, that's enough, let us not deviate from the topic, did you know what happened to Vikarna?

Atleast 1 Kaurava brother is supposed to have joined the Pandavas in the war.Do not know whether he was killed in the war or not.

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Originally Posted by viggop

Atleast 1 Kaurava brother is supposed to have joined the Pandavas in the war.Do not know whether he was killed in the war or not.

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Viggop,

It would be great, if you can or some post about Vikarna.


Q 4)

What was the reason for Vidura to break his bow and not to take part in the war? :?

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There is one meaning behind Draupadi marrying 5 men.
It seems that a husband should possess the qualities of pancha pandavas.
That is a man should follow/uphold dharma as Yudishtra,strong as Bheema,warrior against evil like Arjuna and skilled in tools like Nakula and Sahadeva.

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Viggop, What abt this?
The sons should always listen to their mothers without doubting her words. Because they say that they have a gift for her, and the mother who is busy, doesn't look, and says "Share it between the 5 of u." Which leads to the marraige of the Pandavas.

Later. 8)

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Originally Posted by Raghu

Q1)

I am a bit confused, if Karna's dharma was to be loyal to his friend and encourage evil, then dharma is subject individuals conception? :? :?

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If you had read my post on this question earlier in this thread, Raghu, maybe it would be a little helpful? Anyway, let me try and answer the latter part of your question.

What is Dharma? Dhaarayate iti dharmaha...is the definition given for Dharma...translated literaly "That which is worn is called Dharma" - meaning that which is to be upheld.

But the interesting thing is going by the meaning that which is worn...like clothes. Although Dharma is said to be universal, it is also individual. Meaning, one cannot apply the same dharma to every situation. Just as you would wear one set of clothes to work, another set of clothes to play cricket and an entirely different set to go swimming, and a total lack while bathing, Dharma too differs depending on the situation.

Again, a man is father to his children, son to his parents, husband to his wife, brother to his sister, friend to his friends - each of these roles calls for a different dharma on his part. He has to fulfill those dharmas as appropriate. In that way, while it is not an individual's own conception of what dharma is, it does mean that there is no one dharma that has to be followed irrespective of the situation.

Then again, Vyasa gave a beautiful summarization of what Dharma, Papa and Punya (Virtue and Sin) are.

Asthadasa Puraneshu Vyasascha Vachanadwayam
Paropakara punyaya paapaya parapeedanam

Translated: The 18 puranas written by Vyasa can be condensed and understood based on 2 statements of Vyasa

a) Punya or virtue is to help others
b) Paapa or sin is to harm others

Very simple, almost black-and-white concept. If your actions harm another person or society, it is sin and therefore not dharma. If your actions bring betterment to society or individuals, then it is punya and therefore dharma.

Again, cannot apply this statement blindly. There are nuances of dharma. What may appear good may not be really good for a person in the long run. Again, what may appear bad may really be good. A doctor cutting open a man's stomach to heal him is actually doing a good thing, although one would view a murderer doing a similar thing differently.

Again, dharma decrees that for the sake of the family, an individual can be given up or harmed, for the sake of a town, a family can be destroyed, for the sake of a country, a whole town can be wiped out etc etc.

Who takes a call on these, who can be the best judge is debatable, and not something I wish to go into, but suffice it to say one's own conscience, in accordance with what has been presribed by the wise in the form of shastras or scriptures is certainly dharma.

Raghu
In Mahabharatha,there is an interesting conversation between a lake spirit and Yudishtra about dharma.

Read this link about Lord Krishna's musings on Dharma

http://sai.aros.net/dharma.html

amazingly wonderful explanation. thanks for the post viggop!!

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Originally Posted by viggop

Raghu
In Mahabharatha,there is an interesting conversation between a lake spirit and Yudhistira about dharma.

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This takes place when the brothers of Yudhisthira are killed one by one for disobeying the lake guarding Yaksha . For the Yaksha to grant their lives back, Yudhisthira is required to answer a list of questions put forth failing which Yudhisthira too will fall prey to the being.

a.ratchasi
DO you know what was the questions put forth by that Yaksha and Yudishtra's answers to that? It is supposed to be a good tutorial on Dharma.
Please post it here.

viggop, as mush as I want to, I am in the midst of clearing something which has to be done at soonest. :(

Nevertheless, a quick search online brought me to this link:
http://www.cs.memphis.edu/~ramamurt/gems/gem60.html

Below are the excerpt:

"Yudhistira knew that these could be none other than the words
of a yaksha and guessed what had happend to his brothers. He
saw a possible way of redeeming the situation. He said to the
bodiless voice: "Please ask your questions."
It asked:
What makes the sun shine every day?
Yudhistira replied: The power of Brahman.

What rescues man in danger?
Courage is man's salvation in danger.

By the study of which science does man become wise?
Not by studying any sastra does man become wise.
It is by association with the great in wisdom that he gets wisdom.

The yaksha asked: What is more nobly sustaining than the earth?
Yudhistira replied: The mother who brings up the children she
has borne is nobler and more understanding than the earth.

What is higher than the sky?
The father.

What is fleeter than the wind?
Mind.

What is more blighted than the withered straw?
A sorrow-stricken heart.

What befriends a traveller?
Learning.

Who is the friend of one who stays at home?
The wife.

Who accompanies a man in death?
Dharma. That alone accompanies the soul in its solitary journey after death.

Which is the biggest vessel?
The earth, which contains all within itself is the greatest vessel.

What is happines?
Happiness is the result of good conduct.

What is that, abandoning that man will be loved by all?
Pride-- for abandoning that man will be loved by all.

What is the loss that yields joy and not sorrow?
Anger giving it up we will no longer be subject to sorrow.

What is that, by giving up which, man becomes rich?
Desire-- getting rid of it, man becomes wealthy.

yudhishtra's Q&A with the yaksha and Nachikethus' Q & A with yama are the most interesting and enlightening Q&As in hindu religious texts. Some say that these Q&As were not originally a part of the story but inserted by upanishad experts who wanted the essence of upanishads to permeate far and wide, while remaining immortal within the text of the great epic like Mahabharath and Ramayan.

Nachiketa with Yama --- Is it in Katha Upanishad?
Sage Yagnavalkya's debate with his wife Gargi in another upanishad is also supposed to be very good.

Coming to charcater of Draupadi,she appears very haughty, arrogant,proud and vengeful character.
She is born in the yagna of Draupada.The objective of the yagna was to take revenge(not noble) on Drona and both Drishtadyumna and Draupadi are born in it.

She laughs at Duryodhana when he slips and falls in Indraprastha.
She takes a vow not to plait her hair till she drinks the blood of dushashana.Hence she is also very vengeful person full of fury.

She loves Arjuna more than other husbands and does not treat them equally as Arjuna.This is supposed to be adharmic! Hence,she is the first to fall down dead on the way to Himalayas at the end.

She is much sinned against too.Arjuna loves Satyabhama(?) more than Draupadi.Yudishtra keeps her as an object in the game of dice and loses her.She is disrobed publicly.When Pandavas have to be incognito for 14 years,she is serving as a servant for some queen.

sbadri99,

thanks for your detailed exp on dharma, but I still think dharma is circumstancialy individualy based on our atma :)

Dharma is difficult to understand if we dont understand what it is meant for. Dharma is meant for us to know our essence (Atma). We all chose our own dharma.example..not speaking a lie is a dharma. Now some one can adhere to this principle, but it becomes his dharma only when we does not give it up even when his life is in danger. That way that principle that he followed becomes his dharma and that lightensup his "Individuality". Example is Harichandra who used speaking Truth as his dharma. Look at karna , for him to be loyal to his friend is dharma. Even now karna is know for that.

But ordinary people will have pricniples but when they give that up in challenging situations , it will never ripen to dharma. A principle is like a raw fruit, it ripens to dharma when the principle is not given up in any situation.

Look at the life of nayanmars and alwars. For one washerman (dobi) nayanmar every day washing clothes of a shiva devotee free of chrage as the first duty ,was his principle. It did not become a dharma until he was challenged and refused even to stake his life for his principle. Then that principle became his dharma and got enlightenment. This is why dharma always will save oneself. Dharma alone can help us to know the self.

Ordinary mortals would in the place of nayanmars would give an excuse saying "What can I do. I tried maximum to find a shiva devotee and stick on to my principle. But what to do I could nto find and so I cannot stick to to my words". Then his principle becomes a failure and also not frutify to dharma.

This is what we see in mahabharata.....each one has a principle and that is the dharma for them. That projects their strength of their individuality and attains moksha. Thus we should always stick on to one principle in life and never give it up. That alone will save us. we will meeet hardships but that is a means to test us. Alas very few only make it up. Then their principle becomes Dharma for rest of the people.

Dear Pradheep,

Welcome, thanks for posting at last.

Yes, I agree with you, Dharma is based on individual conception of atma. which may vary due to circumstances. for example, I am againts killing of any living entities that is my dharma, but if I see a tiger or a snake charging at some one, I may have to kill it to save another live, here my dharma changes according to my Consciousness(atma)

Raghu
Please unveil the story behind Vidura now.:-)

I liked these most among Yudhishtra's answers!

Who is the friend of one who stays at home?
The wife.

Who accompanies a man in death?
Dharma. That alone accompanies the soul in its solitary journey after death.
Remember the dog which went with Yudishtra to the heavens.

What is happines?
Happiness is the result of good conduct.

What is that, abandoning that man will be loved by all?
Pride-- for abandoning that man will be loved by all.

What is the loss that yields joy and not sorrow?
Anger giving it up we will no longer be subject to sorrow.

What is that, by giving up which, man becomes rich?
Desire-- getting rid of it, man becomes wealthy.


Pride,anger and desire!!! If only we can conquer them!!!

Mr. Pradheep has beautifully analysed the Point

And... Further.. certain clarifications are to be defined more ...which I add...

"pradheep"

//Dharma is difficult to understand if we dont understand what it is meant for.//

This Sanskrit word .. taken in all the Indian Languages including Tamil... means ..in Tamil... "ARHAM" («Èõ)... even which carries several meanings and definitions according to Tamil Dictionary and wide usage in Literature..

Sanskrit Nikandu(Dictionary) too presents several meanings... all relevant to day to day life of Mankind...with or without the faith in God.

But the most conspicuous meanings of this Word Dharma... are...

(1) Divine-Commandments ( Aandavan Kattalhai).. the Ultimate Code
(Ex: Manitha-Dharmam).

(2) Set-Law commonly applicable as a Yardstick or Basic-principle as the order of the day...(for Example "Yuga-Dharma").

(3) Specific Way of Life under specifc delicate circumstances (Aapath-Dharmam).

(4) Righteousness unharming to anybody's Best interests towards the Life-Goal. (Para-Dharmam / Supreme Will of God)

(5) Utmost Self-Discipline (Suya-Dharmam)

(6) Moral-approach of Empathy ...of Self-realisation as One in the Family, ..One amongst the Society... One within the God's Creations... and the One bound by Life-Code of Practice commonly applicable to any Creature.

//But ordinary people will have pricniples but when they give that up in challenging situations , it will never ripen to dharma. A principle is like a raw fruit, it ripens to dharma when the principle is not given up in any situation//.

Some times... one Dharma competes or Classhes with another Dharma ... culminating in a Dilemma or Embarassing Situations in practical Life of Reality. Such situations are called as . DHARMA- SANGATAM"... as have been confronted by some Historical and Puranic Characters as well as we too see in our Lives sometimes....

For example ... a Police Inspector find his Father is caught red-handed as the Criminal... where arises the clash of Principles..

... whether to carry out his official duty as an Inspector ?

.. or the Moral duty to his Father?... since...both are his Principles.

Under some such challenging circumstances ... the Heroes have decided differently... where only we get the HIGHLY VALUABLE LESSONS for our Life.

For example... the Best Character... in any Epic or Literature... for analysis.

Karna was caught in between two Dharmas... both are worthy and meaningful... but in discerning and chosing the BEST according to Situation... Karna failed...

Because Sucees of Righteousness towards everybody's Life-Goal is the the God's Will of UTMOST PRIORITY and Preferable under any and all circumstances... whether Vibheeshana, Harischandra, Lakshmana, Kumbakarna, or Meer-Jaffer.

//Look at the life of nayanmars and alwars.... principle became his dharma and got enlightenment. This is why dharma always will save oneself. Dharma alone can help us to know the self //.

While the man is placed in between his Mind's activities like...Desires Wishes Ambitions and the like on one side...and...

His Conscience Questions him on his Duties...and Commitments...and Bounds based by Laws, Principles, Disciplines, Gospels and so on based by Wisdom... raise Questions to him...

Irrespective of Dharma-Sangatam...even under day to day situations... only Dharmic principles helps him decide.

//Under such situations Ordinary mortals would in the place of nayanmars would give an excuse saying "What can I do. I tried maximum... I cannot stick to to my words". Then his principle becomes a failure and also not frutify to dharma.//

There only Man to Man differs in appklication of his Wisdom couple with Mind.

For example..two boys are taught how to use a Match-stick to make a Flame out of it. Both of them are EQUALLY wise and so have learnt well.

One boy lit several street- lamps in the village... making the whole village bright... and he studied at his home ...got educated more.

While the other... threw the match-spark on a Hut... making the whole Village burn...

Both have applied their Wisdom and Knowledge... But whereto?

There comes Dharma... to make him differentiate rather DISCERN by himself as also help others to convince him realise his FAILURE of Right Mind-application... bound by certain principles in his own interests as well as his Moral commitments in Life.

//This is what we see in mahabharata.....each one has a principle and that is the dharma for them.//

While Duryodana alone... had no principle... nor Dharma... inspite of his enormous Streengths around in support of him...

... Except engrossed by Adharmic Goal of ... Finshing his Brothers Pandavas somehow.. UNREASONABLE and unjust Wish...

... Based on Sheer JEALOUSY... and Nothing Else...

... So God interfered at every stage whenever the relevant Dignitaries in power and positions utterly failed in their DHARMAs...

... and had to show to Posterity of Humanity... that any amount of Power canbnot make an Adharmas win...

Best words of convincing answer on the Question of miserable onslaughts towards the failures and pitiasble End of Karna.. the GREAT-MAN ..
.
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("Senjoatru Kadan theerka saeraadha Idam saerndhu Vanjaththil veezhndhaayadaa Karna.... Naanum vun Pazhi sumandhaenada")

Dear Raghu
I dont agree that dharma keeps changing. Dharma is the same everytime and everyplace. There are four types of dharmas..... universal, individual, social and human dharma.

Now in the case you mentioned, your still follow dharma againts killing of any living entities.

But you take up the task of "protecting dharma " of a human dharma and kill a tiger or a snake charging at some one. So killing act is not the problem here but "protecting" is dharma here. That does not change any time any place. If you protected soemone in India will that change going to usa or UK or any other place. ?. You would do the same. It is the intention of the act the problem and not the act.

Dear sudhama

Very good for bringing the word "DHARMA- SANGATAM". Yes that sankatam is what helps us to know what is our real "Self". ordinary mortals would be bothered about "Me, my mine" attitude. In the example you gave, an ordinary police inspector would see a son in a criminal and fail in his decision because he is attached to his "My son, My family" attitude. A correct one would not see a son but see only a criminal who is dangerous for the soceity.

This failing of dharma is so clear now in India...the reason for all social immorals and social problems.

Mahabharata is an epic that shows how a king strayed from the dharma and instead appointed an unworthy son duryodhana as the prince. Our modern politicians are such dhrithirastras ruining the country.

Mahabharatha is the biggest literary work in the world, which is comlete in all fields. Personally clarity dawned in me after knowing mahabhratha.

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²¸¨ÄÅý ܼô ÀÚ¢ø¨Ä; '¸ð¨¼ ŢçġÎ' §À¡Â¢üÚ!

¸÷½ý Å¡ØõŨà ¦¿ÕôÀ¢ý Á£§¾ ¿¢ýÈ¡ý :(

«ó¾î "ºã¸ ¿£¾¢'측¸ - «ÅÛìÌ þ¨Æì¸ôÀð¼ «¿£¾¢¨ÂÔõ - þ¨ÈÅÛõ ܼò ¾Îì¸ ÓýÅÃÅ¢ø¨Ä!

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¬É¡ø, ¸ñ½¾¡ºý ±ý¸¢È ¸Å¢»ý - ¸÷½ÛìÌ ¯Ã¢Â Á⡨¾ ¦ºö¸¢È¡ý þó¾ô À¡¼ø ãÄõ!

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±ýÉ þÕó¾¡Öõ ¸ñ½¾¡ºÉ¢ý 'À¢ýÒÄõ' «ôÀÊôÀð¼Ð «øÄÅ¡?!
'¾¡É¡¼¡Å¢ð¼Öõ «ÅÕìÌ þó¾ þ¼ò¾¢ø º¨¾ ¬ÊÅ¢ð¼Ð' §À¡Öõ! :D

>>This failing of dharma is so clear now in India...the reason for all social immorals and social problems. <<

Think of when and why this failing started. Think of what deprivation does to people - what they had taken away from them - the needs of everyday survival. Those who done the taking away have long rot to the bottom and now seeking the path of "Dharma" to find themselves. Indians should not lose focus of this while they struggle for survival - they should not allow themselves to rot to the bottom. There should be compassion for such struggles of survival and seeking to hold on to dharma.

>>There should be compassion for such strugglers of survival "while" seeking to hold on to dharma.