In all this melee, I missed addressing your point about audience taking it as a comedy, which is what matters?
Whatever happened to your oppopsition to intentional fallacy? :-)
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In all this melee, I missed addressing your point about audience taking it as a comedy, which is what matters?
Whatever happened to your oppopsition to intentional fallacy? :-)
I ignored Pattiyal because it was a good performance. I was trying to understand why you clumped koodal nagar with that. Lookalike was the only reason I could think of that may explain it. What I have seen in the movie is very ordinary. One wouldn't compare it with the performance in Kaminey.
Unlike - say equa :P - I will not argue that his knowing has no bearing on our evaluation of his performance. Just that I don't buy this "he doesn't know what he did". puriyAmayA avvaLO nallA pannApla.... sariyA label ottalainnA thittinA eppidi.
I wrote my previous reply before I saw this post :lol2:Quote:
Originally Posted by Plum
I believe it is 'intended' to be a comedy. Intention illaama audience sirikka idhu enna TR padamA. Just that it is not David Dhawan, Priyadarshan type.
DevD gets 10 minute standing ovation in venice film festival :bow:
http://lite.epaper.timesofindia.com/...4&publabel=TOI
Wow... :clap: :clap: :clap: (IthellAm silar notes edukkanum :wink: )Quote:
Originally Posted by MADDY
10 minutes-A. Konjam overA pOyittAinga. :lol2:
venice film festival enna periya idhuva?? :lol2: why should we get convinced by jury members of a international film festival, we have our own likings/dislikes etc :lol2: ....."chennai kadhal" was far more realistic depiction than devd :PQuote:
Originally Posted by Thalafanz
10 minutes is stretching it a bit far, agree........i think even 1 minute of clappings would seem like 10 mins........for bombay dreams, rahman was supposed to have got 13 mins of standing ovation - 13 mins doesent sound like a gross number.......it will be really overwhelming to get applause for 13 mins :shock:Quote:
Originally Posted by P_R
:lol: Seri aduththa thadavai Chennai Kadhal, Koodal Nagar pOndra padanggal ithE festival-a screen panni, audience-a 11 nimisham kai thatta solluvOm... :)Quote:
Originally Posted by P_R
worst vs best'aa :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by MADDY
yaarunga sonna - chennai kadhal, koodal nagar were examples of brilliant writing and exemplary acting skills - P underscore R-a venaa kaettu paarunga :P .......Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarna
:lol2:Quote:
Originally Posted by MADDY
Writing point-ai thaan (oru vazhiyA) concede paNNittaanga-lla.
ippo performance paththi mattum dhaan pEchchu.
murdhaar, jenned, paar-ki-sutta deffet., kutta paai patta paai, abaaroopan ...etcs'ku 12 nimishan kaithatta solluvOm :clap: :clap:Quote:
Originally Posted by Thalafanz
DISCLAIMER: A general point I want to address - I am not going to argue with the blanket meisters who take a passing reference to koodal nagar as a testimony for brilliant writing and great performances - I think I can address P_R who has substantive arguments to put forward. I am not in this argument as a "bollywood daddy is greater than tollywood daddy or vice-versa". So, I think I will skip the people who are trying to establish their daddy is bigger.
P_R, yes, I conceded long ago that the average writing in Bollywood is better. (Still, "mere paas kamalhassan hai" -ngaradhu vera vishayam, as Bala(K) would put it:-) )
That is not the question but the cynical attempts to paint everything connected with bollywood > everything connected with kollywood is what I resist - I know you are not saying that, though, so no point addressing that now because I said I will not address people who ARE saying that.
(Thanks Ricky, solla vEndiyadhai sollittu, solla maateennum solra vitthai kathu koduthadhukkaga!)
So, yes, a Kaminey or Devv D gets appreciated - immediate implication here: kollywood blanketly sucks, bollywood is all time greatest cinema(including all time hollywood, sappan, koria, checkaslovakia etc).
While comparing Chennai Kaadhal and Dev D, why not compare a Virumandi and Kissaan? Where will this argument go, if we keep discussing in that angle?(Kissaan-nu oru padam vandhudhu recent-A, theriyumA?)
Vishal B> most writers in Tollywood. Conceded. And I know I dont even need to concede it, it is so obvious. Again, I will still say, "mere paas kamal hai". I am not so convinced on Kashyapa munivar still. Generation gap, may be :-).
But BS_Kappoor-ai ellaam associative glory-la glorify pandradhu dhaan....:lol:
Bharath showed his potential in Pattiyal and other movies, and the reference to koodal nagar was wishful thinking on what koodal nagar could have been, afterall, it does deal passingly with one brother copping the impact of the others' doings. The reference was to say that where a BS_K gets a Kaminey, Bharath gets a koodal nagar. How can you even compare then? Ofcourse, for cynical people, this is an opportunity to make a half baked point on Dev D > some random ordinary movie in tollywood. Thanks, I didnt know that before :-)
The kambi argument is very meritorious and I know that Bharath can simply try to scale the potential he has by dissociating from mass movies, even if he has to starve for that. Especially considering that he will never be Ajith or Vijay, except in his mother's dreams, may be. But that is a trap kollywood lays, and he is just another victim. Idhai sonnA, disappointingly, P_R, you make that oscar joke. I'd have expected that from someone else but from you, it was disappointing.
BS_Kapoor clearly didnt mean it the way you did, he clearly said that the A certificate means young fans of his cannot watch the movie lamentingly - I mean, it was either like he didnt understand what the final product was and why it wasnt fit for kids' consumption, or he probably thought they should have made it for kids, too. I read it, you didnt so I dont expect you to understand where I am coming from.
This comment is meandering so let me try to add more later
Everytime a film gets appreciation in a film festival, 10 minute standing ovation etc is reported. In tamil magazines, this happened for Paruthiveeran/Ram, when those movies won those awards - sarvadesa pada vizhavil 10 nimida AravAra kaithattal etc. For bollywood, the same kind of reporting happens in English. avLO dhaan difference. IdhaiyellAm, naan appovum(PV/Ram) serious-A eduthukkala, ippovum serious-A eduthukka mudiyala.
Next kamal-directed movie varattum, appo pEsalAm.Quote:
Originally Posted by P_R
Hey Ram vandhappO, bollywood was being sandhi sirichufied at(Rani Mukherjee gave an interview - in the last 3 years, each year I have acted in milestone movies, 1998 - KKHH, 1999 - Hey Ram, 2000- Bichooo :rotfl3:). For every Dev D, there is a kaadhal. best vs best discussion goes nowhere. The important point(which only PR makes here among the bolly gang here) is that the average bollywood movie has better writing.
Aaa Ooo-nA Kamal... Kamal... Yes, I agree he's a good writer... But, avar-E Hindi padanggaL-a "remake" pannumbOthu, ingga sila pEr, seri vEnA vitturuvOm... Cheers to all :)
OhO - ippo Kamal kooda bollywood pichaila dhaan vAzhurArA? :lol:
Kaminey - idea by a nigerian film school student, large parts of his script retained
Maqbool, Omkara - Seshappa Iyer remake :-)
Love Aaj Kal - remake of thousand Yash Raj movies with some hollywood romantic drama thadka added
Ipdi sollikittE pOgalAM/
What can you say to people who question Kamalhassan's creativity?
Thats ur own allegation(s). I didn't say Kamal Bollywood pitchaila vAzhurAr etc etc bulls**t...
What I was trying to say is what make the great Kamal to notice A Wednesday and remake it in the first place??? Writing... Exellent writing... On top of that, class performace by Naseer...
I completely agree with this point :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Plum
A Wednesday - writing is nowhere near a "Hey Ram" or "Virumandi". Kamal fans had wanted to see his own written/directed film rather than remake "A Wednesday". I suppose "Marmayogi" didn't happen. So he went ahead and did this. Next (fingers crossed) should be his own film, not necessarily a big-budget film (like Marmayogi).
Plum, amaidhi amaidhi :thaNNi theLiching:
I brought bharadhar into this. So perhaps I should try to do a little bit of plain talking.
Till Kaminey I had my doubts about Shahid. But what he did in that movie is better than what Bharath has done so far. I am not exactly sure how to subtract the VB effect,
Sorry, it was too juicy to resist. I should rein in. Second warning today for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Plum
Anyway, while I agree opportunities are lower for Bharath, but I have no reason to believe he would have been able to pull off the performance that Shahid manage to in kaminey.
Now for the reverse comparison. Kadhal - Shahid can't do - seems screaming obvious to you (plural). I am not so sure of that. Along with pattiyal, Veyyil is perhaps the other movie I like Bharath best in. Even that I don't see beyond the reach of Shahid. And yes I am saying all this based on 'one' performance directed by an ace director. We will see in a few years how things pan out.
It is my humble opinion that even in the acting department, lack of opportunity, market etc. is the lesser of the reasons.
I have noticeably skirted the 'comparison of averages' argument. Simply because I don't know about indhi averages. But I have to say that there is noticeably average acting even in the best of our directors. We can start right from Naan KadavuL.
Bottomline, I continue to have to grant a 'handicap' to enjoy a Tamil film. I see I have to do that less and less for Hindi films. Heck, I see an ordinary film with cliched moments, like Dasvidaniya, and good or bad...it is in a completely different universe. That is all I am saying.
Yeah, k-g, the sad thing is a Marmayogi or marudhanayagam cannot be made here. While people get to burn 60 crores on 2050 Love Story in Bollywood. Appuram En adhu better-A irukkadhungarEn?
I can't understand why u make assumptions all the time??? :huh:
We (as per you, the Bolly gang) never went around promoting movies like Love 2020, Yuvraaj etc etc and say Bolly is better because of those craps...
So, P_R, it's you who pattavachufying the Shahid-Barath equation... :twisted:
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Plum
I was bored in the second half of Dev D (looks around for Thilak and ducks). But if kaadhal is the best we have to compare against it :huh: (looks around for Nerd and ducks)Quote:
Originally Posted by Plum
End of day fatigue typing (so I may retract tomorrow)...Kaadhal's endpiece with voice over, ezhuthu, signature a la Bharathiraja, discouraged me from revisiting the film. Elitism alert...I mean how nuanced can such a director be. Good film with greatness being largely incidental than intentional.
TF, its futile as i tell Anoop too.......do u see me talking to ? :PQuote:
Originally Posted by Thalafanz
btw to other sincere kamal fans like Bala - TF didnt mean anything demeaning abt kamal, he just meant writing standards are so good in hindi that even a great like kamal is inspired to remake them........i take it as a compliment to both bollywood and Kamal 8-)
Actually my question was rhetorical as I thought the very suggestion that Bharath could do something like that would elicit a giggle and a "aamaam- le" reaction. Backfired real bad :oops:Quote:
Originally Posted by Thalafanz
Ithai konjam azhuttamA, sathtamA sonnathukku romba nandri. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by MADDY
Naan Anban, CR-kitta ellAm paatu vAngga virumbala... :P
Nah...I like to believe UPO is a quickie he didn't mind trying because he had a gap in his diary. From what we know it is 'ideologically' distant from Kamal's stand. And -something I rue about actually - most of his movies reflect some shade of his political vision - if that's the word for it. I wouldn't read too much into his remaking Wednesday.Quote:
Originally Posted by MADDY
Plum, neenga Kaminey'ya romba thookki vachchu pEsura maadhiri irukku :twisted: It is good... but not great :)
Shahid acting in it id also good... but not great :) ofcourse Bharath cant better Shahid..but there are other guys(say Jeeva) here who can do better than Shahid :)
Priyanka's acting is more than good....great... no current kollywood chittugal can better priyanga (ONLY in acting )
PR, No need to duck. Please continue.
ok, thats wat TF said - i was just reiterating his point.....but i also tend to agree with him a bit - if it was a quickie why not remake slumdog millionare?? :lol2: i mean why pick a hindiwallah's bollywood creation?? i think A. Kamal is not a racist :lol2: B. best available scripts are from bollywood.....Quote:
Originally Posted by P_R
:) That was all actuallyQuote:
Originally Posted by kid-glove
I was going to say the standing ovation would have helped wake up all those who had dozed off somewhere between Abhay Deol first waterwash and second. Then I kind of reined in.
Hey Plum, this Ricky thing is good I say.
This is the problem. And serious-a solren, shaheed performance appadi onnum perusa thonila.Quote:
Originally Posted by P_R
I don't see radical changes here. While we will see better films there, and performances will be overrated, talend attributed to every tom, dick and harry in Bolly. :(Quote:
We will see in a few years how things pan out.
No, sarNA, I didnt. I was underwhelmed by Kaminey, even the LOL moments;Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarna
Yes, I felt the same way too. BS_K is okay, but Chopra was excellent.
Exactly but then you dont have a point to make about bolly's superiority :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by P_R
Excellent point, k-g. Right now the argument seems to be "mere paas Dev-D hai". konja varushathukku munnAdi varaikkum nammaLum, "mere paas hey-raam hai"-nu solli OttikittirundhOm.Quote:
don't see radical changes here. While we will see better films there, and performances will be overrated, talend attributed to every tom, dick and harry in Bolly.
As PR admitted, nobody seems to eb aware of the *average* bolly movie. People are making an assumption that "Dasvidaniya" is an average bolly movie. It isn't. An average bolly movie is Aagey Se Right or Golmaal Returns. And the writing sucks intolerably in those.
again assumptions that we cling on to DevD everytime we have a crisis :lol2:
i'll take Johnny Gaddar and beat the daylight out of Paruthiveeran - anyone ready :lol2:
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by MADDY
Ithukku thAn vvOi, neer vEnum-ngrathu... :PQuote:
Originally Posted by MADDY
:lol: - Johnny Gaddar vs Paruthiveeran. Dev D vs Chennai Kaadhal - looks like mottai thalai muzhangAl comparisons are the order of the day. Or you could say abdul khader and amaavasai, if it is not politically incorrect to say so. Kandinue...