nalla vELai he is our beach-nu sollalai!Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangarajan nambi
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nalla vELai he is our beach-nu sollalai!Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangarajan nambi
renounced composers-nA? Mutrum thurandha composers-A? You mean to say IR is lacking in something compared to them? But mutrum thurandhavargaL dhAn will be lacking in clothes comparing to normal people illaiyA?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangarajan nambi
AppO avanga dhAnE lacking in comparison to IR :huh:
These people are Hindi film music composers who might have handled HM like the way Raaja handled Carnatic music . But the cheap song in your view is sung by the stalwart in HM like BMK in carnatic music and he didnt find anything significantly lacking in the composition... Now Nambi i am afraid you have got a serious problem...you have to talk little more so that we can try to understand...Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangarajan nambi
RN,Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangarajan nambi
I always stressed on "Compare apples with apples".You want to compare Naushad with IR? Is it just? Both belong to different cultures, eras and ethos. You can compare MSV with Naushad and debate, but not IR with Naushad. It is like comparing Pt. Ravi Shankar with Veena Gayathri.
From what i can understand, you are trying to say that IR has not given a pure Hindustani Classical song. Something on the lines of "Albela Sajan"(Hum Dil De Chuke Sanam), for example(i am just suggesting the example so that we are on the same page, to understand the genre and the depth of classical music you expect IR to cover)?Right? Then let us debate by digging out his compositions. Calling "Har Koyi Samjhe" as Cheap is not done.
I urge you to explain what exactly is the kind of Hindustani Music you are looking for in IR's repertoire. Quote some relevant examples and we all will be eager to discuss after searching the whole work of IR.
This discussion using just "Hindustani" seem just keywords. Please indicate what exactly you are trying to say.
Some more genres IR hasnt covered - please feel free to belittle IR based on these
albanian gospel
african marimba chorus
ethipopian elegical elipathayam
guntur ghongra
koyambedu petta rap
raagas,
Comparison ae thappu...
adhuku than - IR mahdiiri - Shankar Ganesh and Deva
ARR madhiri - HJ etc...
kaeka nalla iruka...
Kelvi kaeravangaluku enna idea.....
Oru Naushad ..
Oru MSV
Oru IR
Oru ARR
Idhai purindhu kolla mudiyadharvargalal - epadi
Isaiyai purindhu kolla mudiyum...
Rangarajan Nambi,
Will you also say that since Naushad has not composed in pure carnatic music, he is lesser music director? If you do, there is no need to argue with you. If you don't, then you will see why your argument about Raja and Hindustani is stupid. Either way, you lose. It is just a question of whether you lose gracefully or you down kicking and screaming.
Suresh,
Hindustani yaga irundhalum - ADhuuvm Raaja Hindustani ya thanae iruka mudiyum........
adhai than blog solradhu.........
Raajavai aagadhavargal - Avar isiayai kaekadhavargal...
Nam muyarchi ellam - Vizhaluku yiraitha Neer pola waste Suresh...
vidungo Suresh..
ealge asaiyai niraivetrunga Suresh.........
Pl continue the posts about Raaja's 4 decades.
indha sandaila enakku kudukka vendiya 2000 roovaaya marandhuraadhenga.
Usha,
It is clear that our Nambi is not interested in music but generally wants to give his opinion. We have taken cognizance of the fact that Nambi is not impressed by Raja's oeuvre as far as Hindustani is concerned. Now that we have registered Nambi's opinion, let us proceed with the actual topic.
Earlier I had asked as to what has not changed in Raja's music in the 4 decades. One of them I mentioned was the emotional factor. Raja never seems to think that it is path breaking to give a sad song which actually sounds happy or a happy song which actually sounds sad !!! The intended emotion of the song has to be conveyed. The range of emotions that Raja deals with is very wide. Be it the song about Mother or be it a song for a child, be it the expression of innocence of a young girl or the unbridled passion of the youth, be it a delicate love song or a harsh philosophical song, every tune conveys the intended emotion unerringly. The orchestration may have changed, the style may have changed but this communication of emotion has been intact.
Second has been his steadfast belief in the song must be aligned to the on-screen happening. The song and the instrumentation were done keeping in mind. People nowadays tend to call these songs as 'situation songs'. Raja must be laughing at this phrase. For how else can the song be if not for the situation? Plum used the phrase 'narrative integrity' and this has been the base on which Raja has done all his experimentations. When you view it through this prism, the colors he has given will look even more spectacular. Even for the latest Telugu film 'Om Shanthi', the director in his blog wrote that 'Chinna Polike' conveyed the whole essence of the movie and that he was stunned !!
Third, he never stopped experimenting. For many people the word 'experiment' started meaning a different thing once Rahman came to the screen. The trend shifted from music and originality to sound and samples. So in the late 90s many thought that Raja has stopped experimenting. But listen to those songs again and you can see a mind that can never be still. Be it the mammoth 'Guru', the magnum opus 'Tiruvasagam', the quirky 'Mumbai Express', the stunning 'Virumandi', that blast of an album 'PazhassiRaja' , the overpowering 'Naan Kadavul' all the way till 'Edeya Bagilu' experiments never ceased. All of them underlying had the stamp of originality and the amazing way in which he genre was digested and re-formed into a new mold. (For sake of our dear Nambi, check out 'Maa Ganga' from Nan Kadavul. As touching as 'Maula Mere Maula'.) Even in movies that didn't deserve any sort of music, like 'Madhiya Chennai' and 'Kannukulle', experiments abound. All you need to do is to open your ears and your mind.
:rotfl3:Quote:
Originally Posted by jaiganes
Jai,
evvalu perukku than 2000 roobayum 200 milli vodkavum kuduthundu irukka mudiyum? idhu kattupadiyavadhu.
Oru Kaunder-Senthil comedy la kari kadai bhaai sangeedham kathukka aasaippaduvaaru. Annan kitta vandhu kathuppaaru, in exchange for kari. He will give his own spin to "Ninnukkori Varnam" - oru velai adhai Hindustani nu nenachu andha madhiri costly-a edhirpaarkaraaro Rangarajan Pambi?
Bala,
The scene runs in my mind screen. The bhai is perfect for Hindustani :lol:
idhu naan munnaadi post panninadhu -Quote:
Originally Posted by jaiganes
paasam apdingra vishayam vadhuttaale raasappu ella technologyayum, overtones undertonesayum adakki vechu - from the moolaadharam - manasa thodara maadhiri oru paattu podraare- adhu annikkum sari innikkum sari maarave illai.
summa oru samples nnaa
1. oru thanga radhathil pon manjal nilavu - annan thangai paasam
2. naanaaga naanillai thaaye - amma pulla paasam
3. snehaththin poonjolai theerathil - appa pulla paasam
4. so many dowsar paandi songs - amma - pulla paasam
5. so many raj kiran songs - purusan pondaatti, amma pulla, kudumba paasam
6. enge sellum indha paadhai - kaadhalan kaadhali paasam
7. yaaradhu yaaradhu - pithamagan - nanbanukku varra paasam
kannukku theriyaadha kadavulayum, paasathaala koopidra idangalil, matra isai korvayai(which is universally identified as his strength) pinnukku thalli vaarthai, bhavam, elimai tuneil varum sogam - idhellaam decades maarinaalum maaraadha thavaraamal jeyikkira vishayangal from raaja.
Jai,
Worth including the 'endhu paranjalum' song in your list. As well as 'alli ilam poovo'. Both of them depend fully on their emotional content and they do touch you. Ofcourse these are just specific instances. What you have been saying covers a lot of instances and it would definitely be worth discussing about that.
Though not rendered by IR, Aarariro Paadiyathaaro from Thaikku oru thalaattu can be added to your list Jai.
One of the very few songs that depict sorrow to the extreme and is guaranteed to bring tears anytime you listen.
Hi
Some classics . Just a drop in an ocean. Listen and you will realize why IRaja is still not a master of HM .
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/p/d/...my=false&wmv=0
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/p/d/...my=false&wmv=0
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/p/d/...my=false&wmv=0
Listen in isolation & feel the greatness. HM is soulful. Cannot be learnt through books .
I see many beginners to music here. Its time some quality music is heard. Not like a frog in a well !
The list given by Vicky is just simple stuff. Even a moody Ismail Durbar ( just an example ) will blow away Raja in no time.
repeat, IR is a Maestro on WCM , not on HM. Probably ARR is ahead of him in HM.
Happy week end :D
Nambi,
Nice try again but you haven't answered my question yet. What do you think of Naushad and S D Burman since they have not given any carnatic music and Deva has given lot of carnatic music, some of it moodily. So your conclusion: Deva blows away Naushad and S D Burman?
Things were getting quite heated here. It was time some comedian like you came in to lighten the mood. So from all of us, thanks for keeping us entertained. :notworthy: 'ungal sevai intha threadukku thevai' So keep posting such comedies so that we don't take ourselves very seriously. As Plum as indicated maybe you should search for some African wedding songs and prove that Jumbalakadi Pamba is a greater musician than Raja and can blow away Raja anytime. Moodily. :lol:
:rotfl:Quote:
Originally Posted by Sureshs65
Suresh,
RN in vaarthaigaluku artham enna theiryuma...
1. Avruku HM romba nalla thieryum - IR ai vida...
2. We - IR fans - ipo, inga Rahman music ai pazhikanam...
or Rahman ai pazhikanam...
idhu dhan artham..... :lol:
RN,
IR ai patri solvadhal ungaluku ondru
solli kolla virumbigiren..
Rahman ku paaratu vizhavil,
IR pesinadharku piragu, ARR pesi irukar...
Ungalai pola - thannudiaya Fans kaga
Unmaiyana ARR fans - NIchayam avaroa pechai
Respect seiveenga nu nenaikaren...
Nambi sir - IR's music is context-driven - when HCM flavor is required, he would definitely use it - best example, the use of Hindustani style 'aalaap' (perhaps in the Hindustani counterpart of Keeravani style ?) in the song, "unnai naanariven" from Guna -that 'aalaap' was quite relevant for that visualisation of the dingy slum area of that part of hyderabad city - the situation is described, IR understands the requirement and includes the 'aalaap' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OrshDfJsGk - listen from 2:31 onwards to 3:31 - not only does it gel with the scene, it continues the poignant strain of the original song as well and slowly transitioning to the 'oyilalo' dappanguthu part! perhaps the use of 'ri' is slightly jarring, as HCM does not use 'ri' much and its equivalent is 're'
even the 'maa ganga' from Nan kadavul is HCM flavored bhajan and not some 'paal kavadi panneer kavadi' style south indian style bhakti paadal! IR gave that for that situation
for India 24 hrs, there are 'n' no of motifs that have HCM flavor and hardcore HCM as well, coz, the album most likely used images from north india that demanded such usage!
'composers breath' from Nothing But Wind employs HCM flavor as well
music fidelity to a film's context, thy name is IR! throw up a situation that requires HCM, am sure IR will deliver the same - how many 'paal kavadi', or 'amman', or 'janani' or a 'salangai oli' style songs have been given by SDB or a Naushad ?? IR can do this and that with relative ease, if he got the window of oppurtunity from a film's context!
I love the song "Nilave mugam kaattu" from Ejaman. It wonderfully depicts the tragedy that Rajni and Meena are going through...the melancholy feel of that song is awesome.
Panner pushpangalae - Aval Apadi than....
Kai vennaiyai yendhum - Vietnam colony
When have they ever been required to provide SI style music in a film?Quote:
Originally Posted by irir123
Salil Chowdhury composed many classic songs in Malayalam.
kootathulae kovil pura
ellam enna - Raajavin HIndustani.......
Meetadha oru veenai - Poonthotam
Ellam Hindustani dhan.....
IR factory la irundhu vandha orignial products.........
so, IR muthirai irundhae irukum........
illamal varadhu.....
Usha,
I can understand your anger with people deliberately talking ill about Raja. My sincere request is that you don't take this too much to heart. I personally feel that Nambi's argument requires nothing other than ridicule. His argument is pathetic and let us leave it at that.
I don't think any good Raja fan ever claims that Raja has done everything in the world. We just feel that his repertoire is vast and he has done more than any MD in India. His output will remain unmatched for a long time to come. So what if he has not done some work in some genre!! Unless anyone else quoted against him as such a wide repertoire like Raja, there is no use comparing.
Dragun,
That is exactly irir123's point. If Raja is not called to give Hindustani music for situations, why should anyone talk about his capabilities or lack of it in that area? To rephrase your question and address it to Nambi, "When has Raja ever been required to provide NI style music in a film?"
suresh,
Thanks for the understanding...
Paatai pathi sandhoshama pesa vidama
ipadi disturb panrangalae nu dhan kobam.....
:shock:
Enna oru Good Manners........
inimelavadhu - nimmadhiayaga pesa muidyuma..
parkalam.......
நாட்டுல இனிமே நிம்மதியா பேசனும்னா தனியா கண்ணாடிய பாத்து தான் பேசனும். பைத்தியம் மாதிரி பேசறத விட பைத்தியத்தோடவே பேசிடலாம்.Quote:
Originally Posted by tvsankar
is it? please tell me 5 HCM scores of Ismail Darbar excluding mentioning Hum Dil De Chuke sanam and Devdas. just 5 plzz?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangarajan nambi
Suresh,Quote:
Originally Posted by Sureshs65
Rambaraajan Pambi just reminded me of the "somersault adikka theriyuma?" line from PKS.
Sms from kulothunga chozhan:
He is looking out for a rr nambi for deivanindanai.
Nambi is advised to go underground.
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bala (Karthik)
hey namratA kE sAgar... comes to mind when my mind suddenly becomes a hindustani!
Raaja from 70s to 2010s
jaiganes,
Neengal sonnadhai pola - Raaja - Situation, character and the feelings endru - irundhalum,
Culture and the period - idhilum gavanamaga than irukirar.....
Nammdiaya kalaiyan - artham enna...
Nammudiaya kalacharathai , veli ulgirku
unarthuvadhu.......
Idhil - Raaja Raaja dhan.....
IR - 70 to 80s
indha varudangalil, TN, Kerala, Karnataka and Andra ena
anaithu maanilathin - vaazhviyilaiyum, appodhaiya UNARVUGALAILYUM Unarndhu kolla mudiyum.........
idhil matrum oru vishayahtaiyum serthu kolla vendum.....
MGR, Sivaji = MSV - idhu miga periya kootu amaipu.......
MSV isaiyil - MGR um Sivaji yum adaiyalam
kolla patargal..
adhai pola, IR in isai payangalil,
70 to 80s - indha varudangalil,
Pudhiyadhaga arimugaiya nadigargalukum
isaiyil oru adaiyalam koduthu,
andha Nadigargal vetri pera, vetri pera,
Avarugaluku endru oru style ena
isaiyil kodutha oru Isai Amaipalaraga irundhavar Raaja...
ஐந்து வயது சிறுவனாக இருந்த போது, ஒரு நாள் அருகிலிருந்த வீட்டு திருமண விழாவில் புத்தம் புதிய பாடலொன்று கேட்க நேர்ந்தது. முதல் முறை கேட்டதுமே அந்த பாடல் என் வயதையொத்த அனைவருக்கும் பிடித்திருந்தது. மைக் செட்காரரிடம், "திரும்ப ஒரு தடவை போடுங்கோ மாமா" என்றான் அருகிலிருந்த எனது நண்பன். நேயர் விருப்பத்தைத் தொடர்ந்து அவரும் மீண்டுமொரு முறை "நம்ம வீட்டுக் கல்யாணம்" என்ற பாடலை வைத்தார். நாங்களோ மகிழ்ச்சியில் "நம்ம வீட்டுக் கல்யாணம்' என்று கூடவே பாடிக் கொண்டிருந்தோம். அப்போதெல்லாம் இசையமைப்பாளர் என்று ஒருவர் உண்டு என்பது கூட நாங்கள் அறிந்திருக்கவில்லை. பின்னர் கண்ணோடு கண்ணு, நான் பேச வந்தேன்,ஒரு நாள் உன்னோடு,விழியிலே மலர்ந்தது, காலைப்பனியில், சின்னக்கண்ணன், குயிலே கவிக்குயிலே என்ற பாடல்களை இருவரும் கேட்டு ரசித்திருக்கிறோம்.
அந்த நேரத்தில் வெளிவந்தது 16 வயதினிலே. அனைத்துப் பாடல்களையும் ரெக்கார்டு தேய்கிற வரையில் கேட்டுக் கொன்டிருப்போம். முதல் முறையாக இசையமைப்பாளர் என்கிற ஒரு அர்த்தம் புலப்படுகிறது. இந்தப் படத்தின் இசையமைப்பாளர் இளையராஜா என்பதும் தெரிய வருகிறது. அன்று தொடங்கிய எங்களது இசைப் பயணம் நமது ராசாவுடன் இன்றும் தொடர்கிறது.
தொடரும்......
70's - School days
80's - College days / Bachelor days
1990 - Last part of Bachelor days
90's / past 2K - mature, married days
To me the best of IR happened in 70's & 80's :-) More opportunity to listen / focus on music. After marriage, the priority gone down many steps - lot of albums never heard even :-)
Between 70's and 80's, very difficult to choose.
One thing, the access to music was much better in the 80's than 70's when it was simply radio / festivals / functions / tea stalls / buses / cousin's player for IR. 80's was the walkman era where I could listen to bits and pieces for hours and hours.
That way, I cherish IR of 80's more :-)