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:clap:Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
adhuvaa ? ellaa pugazhum .... :DQuote:
http://beta.thehindu.com/arts/article79741.ece
என்னப்பா ஆச்சு ராசாவுக்கு? இந்து பேப்பருக்கு இன்ட்ர்யூல்லாம் குடுக்காரு?
Dont know why everyone has to work with western musicians! British left us more than 60 years and we still couldnt come out of their influence.Quote:
Originally Posted by baroque
BMK is a classical carnatic ocean and we can take ample peals in it. He dont need to work with Western musicians. Same with IR. Remember, we all liked him because of his work in TFM, not his work with any westners.
நாங்க எல்லோரும் அடிமை புத்தியோட இதெல்லாம் பேசலை ....
Ir is a gifted artist, let the world enjoy his music.
We want him to work with the finest musicians from west, east, north, south .. whole universe!
Robert De Niro & Edward Norton waiting for me. :swinghead:
bye bye :wave:
vinatha.
I am affraid its too late. Even the man who honored him "Isaignani" title had asked ARR to score music for new "Tamil Thai Vaazthu". MSV had the honor before and now ARR.Quote:
Originally Posted by baroque
He has enough money now that if he is truly a musician, he shouldn't wait for sponsor to do music. He can do thirukkural, Bharathiar Songs, give different music to Abhirami Andhathi etc etc.
He dont have to release album. He just have to release the notes. There will be plenty of takers and will start playing his music. I am sure many of this fans will also start playing, just like the way Tyagaraja Aaradhana is happening, we would be having IR Aaradhana.
njv,
I agree with you fully. I personally cannot comprehend this desire for 'international' recognition. I can't understand why we don't take our own opinion seriously and need some 'foreigner' to certify our greatness!! I mean we are giving the authority to certify what is good or great to the west, freely!! I fail to comprehend how the opinion of a guy in Salem, USA about our music is superior to a guy in Salem, Tamilnadu? Each music system has lot of culture built into it and Raja's music is no exception. That is why it reaches a lot of people in the hinterland of Tamil Nadu. Once you 'globalize', your music reaches a different audience. I personally feel that Raja should continue reaching audience in Vijaywada or Kakanad or Madurai. Maybe it is a frog in the well policy but I am very certain that no matter how hard anyone tries there are certain things that cannot happen. You won't get some westerner to appreciate 'sendhurapoove' or 'chinna kannan azhaikiran'.
Tyagaraja and Dikshitar will remain our icons. The west will not put them on the same pedestal as Bach and Beethoven and that is fine with me coz I have Tyagaraja and Dikshitar on a much higher pedestal than Beethoven or Bach. Same with Raja. I listen to innumerable rock and blues bands but I have Raja on a much higher pedestal than all of them. I am quite confident about my aesthetics in music that I don't require someone else telling me that Raja is good.
Suresh,njv
I partially agree and partially disagree.There is a slight disconnect in the discussion here.I think the discussion started with "International collaboration" and moved to "international recognition". I fully agree that we do not need some foreigner to 'certify' IR.
Coming to collaboration - IR has vast knowledge on western music and musicians.A brief look at some of his inspirations or his own speeches where he quotes some artists there, reveals that.So,knowledge-wise, he is not a frog in the well.I think it would 'interesting' if he collaborates with artists there,not for recognition,but only for creating something exciting.The motive can be pure creativity.
Pt.Ravi Shankar was already popular in the west and he collaborated with Philip Glass, because he liked Philip's work and wanted to see what they can do together. Same applies with Zakir Hussain teaming up with Mickey Hart. L.Subramaniam divides his time between Bangalore and US. So he could exchange his thoughts with artsists there which led to his collaborations with the great legends such as Yehudi Menuhin, Stephane Grapelli.
We cannot draw parallel to Balamurali Krishna, because we must understand that he is into vocal music and vocal music,being language driven,has its own limitations, when it comes to collaborating with people from other regions.That is why you do not see vocalists collaborating with vocalists much.But then some vocalists did collaborate with instrumentalists (example: R.A.Ramamani collaborating with Charlie Mariano).I think Balamurali krishna's example is not suitable in this context.
Ilaiyaraaja is a film composer. And we cannot draw parallels with classical musicians, since they have different commitments and artistic explorations. Added to that, the advantage they have is that they travel a lot, for concerts and develop friendships and collaborations out of their experiences. We cannot expect ilaiyaraaja's path also to be the same.
That said, i feel it would be interesting if Ilaiyaraaja collaborates on instrumentals/non-film albums.He already collaborated with Late.Bach in How To Name It :) And it was fantastic isn't it. So, it would be interesting if he collaborates on albums like those. Not that it is a must for him. but just to see what exciting stuff can be created by exchanging in a musical dialogue directly with some very good artist out there. And not just there, but even within India. I mean, I would definitely like to see IR taking collaboration aspect to compositional level too, instead of just commissioning artists(he did use services of Hari Prasad Chaurasia, Budapest Philharmonic,Pt.Bhimsen Joshi and many more) to play/sing his compositions.
But this desire of mine comes 2nd.The 1st is - IR himself doing a complete instrumental album such as HTNI, NBW or Thiruvasakam(in instrumental).
And for those who think Balamurali Krishna didnt collaborate beyond Bhimsen Joshi, see this:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGdfwlNNjbk (it has western elements).
Bottomline: "Each one works according to a requirement" - Ilaiyaraaja in that Hindu article :)
raagas,
I don't think anyone will have a problem if Raja collaborates with a western musician but what I see from many posts is that people see this as a way to get 'international' recognition.
Having said that, I feel Raja may not be the best collaborator per se, given that he always comes up with an unified structure by himself. So the best option would be for Raja to compose and a good set of musicians / orchestra to play what has been composed. It can turn out like 'Tiruvasagam'.
I salute the Maestro for these lines: :victory:
“It is not our duty to worry about trends. We cannot criticise anybody’s music. Each one works according to a requirement,” and it was not necessary to sit in judgement over music. “If some prefer fast food, what’s wrong?”
"Theory or vidwat might appeal to the intellect, but it is what you experience that will touch the heart…no one can form any rule for the arts. It’s all in the way you look things.”
"When you listen to a song, it should make you sit up and wonder, “Hey, what is this!” or give you an inexplicable feeling of joy or relate beautifully to the music in you. Without any of these three, it would be sheer noise.”
Absolutely well said.This is remarkable!
So many changes in him? He is no longer complaining about "other's popcorn music" and in turn says "lets not set up ourselves as judges".He is talking to press frequently. Attending various functions such as Pazhassi raja release, Paa movie premiere, Lakshminarayana Global Music Festival,Om Shanti release,Womens college gathering....
Suresh,
I think this whole thirst for 'Recognition for our idol' - is born out of insecurity. I do not see any reason why people should be insecure,when IR is still musicially rich and talented. One should feel insecure, if he is running out of steam,musically. But he is not. He is going great guns. Then why do some people/fans feel so bothered about international recognition. It will come as by-product, if IR chooses to collaborate with artists firstly.
And as you said, his style of work is such that he might not be best in collaborating. This why i said it would be only 'interesting'.I only meant to sound curious about it and not that I would desperately want him to. If he collaborates,he would have make some compromises in his way of working,style,usage of thought etc and IR is known for sticking to his thought till the finish.So, he wouldnt be comfortable for sure. But then, thats exactly i am curious about - What would shape up, if he comes out of that comfort zone and collaborate with some good artist? I am plain curious! :)
raagas,
Thanks for the you tube.
I hear rap & jadhi followed by Sri.Balamurali Krishna is singing the composition in the same jadhi with orchstra inbetween.
Can you explain the western elements in it?
vinatha.
baroque,
Firstly, Balamurali sharing same platform with rapper Suresh Peters was unthinkable.
The song as such, in Shankarabharanam, has so much western classical touch to it, probably in the tune or in the treatment given in this clip. Shankarabharanam exists in WCM as Harmonic Diatonic scale -- C Major (according to a page in internet)
When the flute plays, we can hear a harmony behind the flute, probably chorus and i was following that tune. the melody, though in shankarabharanam, sounded WCM to be, when it got into background, a layer of harmony.
And the way Balamurali finishes it,i could feel that he was singing some symphony piece for us, as if to demonstrate.
Overall, dont you think there was some difference in the presentation of this Shankarabharanam and other more traditionally sounding shankarabharanams. And that, with rap thrown in :)
Njv,
That's nice Rahman is doing the new Thamizh thaai vaazhthu, Congrats ARR, He will do a wonderful job.
adhannaley enna?
They have several professionals IR, vidhyasagar, yuvan shankar raja ,karthick raja etc..to choose, they choose to work with Rahman. Simple.
Ir kittadhaan kudukkanumnnu yerukka?
I don't see anything wrong in it.
It is not a snub to IR.
"He has enough money now that if he is truly a musician, he shouldn't wait for sponsor to do music"
Even if he has lots of money, he can always try to get/wait/look for producers like any other professional. Working with high profile artists is an added advantage, they may bring producers to the table too. It makes the job easier.
yeah... Shankarabaranam has its own bhaavam.
Omkara nadhanu
I check with some other compositions in that rag in that jadhi tomorrow morning.
thanks,
Vinatha. :)
அனைவருக்கும் இனிய பொங்கல் நல்வாழ்த்துக்கள்
I doubt it. This kind of work needs a profound understanding of Tamil - the language & Tamil - the culture. Once he butchered 'Thirukural' in his connexions album. Atleast Let Manonmaniyam rest in peace :)Quote:
Originally Posted by baroque
மற்றும் தமிழ் புத்தான்டு வாழ்த்துக்கள்!Quote:
Originally Posted by Punnaimaran
ஆம். மறந்துவிட்டேன். :oops:Quote:
Originally Posted by rajasaranam
rs,
It's not going to be manOn maNeeyam but "mu-kA maNeeyam" :-(
Also, the fellow who decides what should be played in TN as ThamizhththAi vAzhththu is Kalanidhi Maran
:shock:
(I've posted a link about this in the "funny things in politics" thread in the current affairs forum)
ARR is definitely a good choice (the next best after IR) and can inspire the song into the minds of youngsters even better as of today!
OTOH, mu-kA shouldn't indulge in rewriting this. Absolute nonsense, IMSO!
The way things are going, looks like very soon it will be "TN = Sun TV" - absolutely undesirable!
Politics apart - I always hated the tune. Some one should have changed it long back.Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
Glad it is getting its facelift now. Would have been very very happy if it was IR, Still happy that Rahman is doing as long as he does not bring in Blaze and thousand other monkeys.
jaiganesh,
As I said earlier, it's not the original song that's getting a facelift ( and personally, I love the MSV / TMS / PS / Chorus version - superb / touching and would prefer to have it let alone).
This is a new song - penned by mu-kA, composed by ARR & Shankar is supposed to do something (visual version / stage version for chemmozhi mAnAdu etc). While there's no question about ARR & Shankar being best in their respective roles, I very strongly feel mukA is not the top one in the poet role.
இந்த தாத்தா- மாமா- பேரன் - மகன் இத்யாதி ஈக்வேஷன்கள் எரிச்சலூட்டுபவை! Why, if they don't want classical literature but some contemporary poem, they can still go to the tons of specialist poets active in the field - even their own fav VM is around, isn't it?
தமிழ்நாட்டில் என்ன முடியாட்சியா நடக்கிறது? அப்படியென்றாலும், மன்னர் தாம் கவிதை எழுத வேண்டும் எனப்பேரன் கட்டளை இடுவது வேடிக்கை தான் :-)
I find app_engine's observation amusing... if you are ok with ARR and Shankar whats wrong with MK writing lyrics...... he wrote many poems not all of them can be called great of course... but he is not some novice either...
eagle,
Personally I'm not in favor of the whole idea. I love the existing vAzhththu.
If the gov has a lot of money to spend on something like this, and they are insisting upon the best in the biz (no MR, no IR it seems only ARR / Shankar), then why should it be mu-kA?
I'm only going by the "sun-tv, kalAnidhi logikku". Even by their own logic, mu-kA is a comical choice :-)
My last post on this digression -
I know well about mu-kA's prose writing capabilities. Read his kuRaLOvium etc. Decent skills!
Also, he is one of the best orators, no question there. I don't know about current situation, but at one point of time, he was the top! Personally watched and was amazed during school days!
But, kavidhai? Songs? Absolutely no great track record, sir! Don't dig around some sponsored publications and list how many books he has printed etc - nothing ever had a wide reach or acclaim!
(p.s. I'm wondering whether there'll be some younger xyz-nidhi performing nAttiyam in the visuals)
/Dig
app_eng,
It proves that if you want to have everything your way, you need a lot of 'nidhi' :lol:
/End Dig
thamizh puthaandu naalaye maathiyaachu - apram enna kedakku. mathhiyose dhaan.
though i say this, I am personally proud what Karunanidhi and Jaya have done with the healthcare and the track record of bringing the IMR (Infant Mortality Rate) is a great achievment and a definite pointer to rising standards of living in thamizh naadu.
suvasthi suvasthu sumugoortham
sumangalibava manavaatti..... couldn't get the BHIMPALASI out my head :musicsmile:
( Rahman, please note Rajasaranam's concerns, rock it catchy) :)
HAPPY PONGAL!
vinatha. :musicsmile:
Rasasaranam solli dhaan Rahman compose panna poraara enna?Quote:
Originally Posted by baroque
illai Avarai neenga inga kootiyaandheengala?
ellaam vidhippadi dhaan nadakkum.
விதி is shining bright. :redjump:Quote:
Originally Posted by jaiganes
Thamizh Thaai Vaazhththu... is in safe hands of A.R.Rahman.
He understands his responsibility, it goes down in history.
Now, let me grab Loving RAHMAN'S TRIBUTE TO THE NATION - soul stirring musicals... hit the freeway for swim class.
Vinatha. :)
saringkka. neeenga idhai appadiye poi ARR threadla podungo...Quote:
Originally Posted by baroque
nice you agreed .
Definitely...
while some of us look forward to the music video with enthusiasm/mixed emotions let this thread get back to ilayaraaja.
vinatha.
This is where IR is stuck. If IR want to leave a name behind him for years to come (like Thiruvalluvar, Bharathiyar, Raja Raja Chozan, Kattabomman etc), he shd let start writing down his composition, specially when it "flows thru".Quote:
Originally Posted by baroque
May be he is.
He is already in the history of Indian Cinema music.
may be :)
May be he writes and saves the scores .
If he has some unknown compositions with him already (not used in films/private album, bgms etc..), he releases them, it will be AWESOME too. (Producing with his money, others money, leave it with him. நம்ப அதெல்லாம் சொல்லக்கூடாது ) :)
Remember Late Madhan mohan's Tere Bagair (15 unrelased songs)-Yash Raj films.
vinatha.
Vinath, madan mohan's son heads hmv's content group. That's how mm, notwithstanding his huge talent, got leverage. Indha ulagathula talent is one of several factors dhan. Unless yateeshwar grows into a music distribution moghul, I don't see that happening ;-)
Vidunga
Hope for the best!
One more Interesting Ad of 'Thaandavakone' . No News on Audio :|
Evolution theory in Thiruvasagam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsN-CCcBE9A
Raagas,Quote:
Originally Posted by raagas
Any major scale (which goes like tone-tone-semitone-tone-tone-tone-semitone) probably can be classified as shankarabaraNam I guess...It's not just C major. Does shankarabaranam follow :sa, re, ga#, ma, pa, dhA#, ni#) ??
SPB shares an interesting anecdote
1. Raja scored for many GKV songs when he was the latter's assistant. This was a contentious issue in tfmpage a few years back
2. Another occasion where a famous female singer once went out of shruti and blamed Raja who was playing the guitar instead. Apparently, Raja stood up and played it again, and asked her to point out where he had gone wrong, with the MD eventually pleading with him to accept the singer's accusation just for the sake of getting ther ecording going to which IR is said to have replied "I didnt make any mistake, sir why should I accept? If you want, I will stop playing and leave".
3. When returning from katcheris, if he gets 10 rs, he used to buy bun and tea for 2 rs and buy scoresheets and music books for the rest 8!