Anniyan - Patriotism

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Originally Posted by UnlimtedMeals

Maddy,
It Sounds Unbelievable and Untrue :P

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Well, maybe true but definitely unbelievable w/ respect to Big Bad Bbay! :shock: :D
Quite contrary to wat its portrayed as in most media, not to mention the popular old Hindi film song "A-dil hai mushkil jeena yahan, zara hatke zara bachke yeh hai bum-bai meri jaan......." :wink: (hope all here can understand this or ne trans. required...?)
Neways,

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Originally Posted by Maddy

1.in signals and roadcrossings, motorists,car drivers wait till pedestrians cross the road and in my 7 yrs mumbai life i have never heard "Veetla sollitu vanthutiya" while accidentally crossing the road,

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I didn't really get tat saying.....but reg. pedestrian behaviour, I rem. reading articles in Auto India & other car mags. tat many pedestrians in Bbay for sum reason, decide to cross only when the signal turns green & callously waddle across the road then, making the oncoming vehicles wait more than nec'ry....esp. the cars ahead, whose owners suffer the most as the more impatient Auto drivers try & squeeze their way thru the gaps, bumping & scraping the cars along the sides in the process! :(
R traffic lights in Bbay equipped w/ flashing lights/symbols signalling pedes. can/cannot cross?? I noticed they were (are?) present in Madras......

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Originally Posted by Maddy

3.Rickshaw/Taxi drivers are so perfect in charging the customer.....chennai's auto drivers shuld be taught a lesson in mumbai.....

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Better include Hyd. ones as well........they seem to be taking a cue from their 'Madrasi' counterparts slowly but steadily.......!

I am not trying here to develop india through "valid arguments". I am just trying to inform the mis-informed souls on the developed worlds as well as India.

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Originally Posted by lordstanher

Amazed to find this raging discussion on the socio-economic status of India stemming from a discussion on a film.....!
Well, I havn't seen Anniyan yet so as to speak abt it.......but glad to find the discussions this film has aroused! :D
I feel tat Cinefan (as always!) & Unlimited hav the right idea abt wat India's situation actually is today, & I support their arguments rather than blindly hum the "India shining" song! :D
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lord,Thanks for your compliments.

And a :thumbsup: for the rest of your post.

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Originally Posted by ganesh79

I am surprised that no one has brought China into our topic or did I miss them? In fact, it is the apt country to compare India with, if at all we want to compare. It is similar in the way it wants to grow genuinely and indigenously (of course, every country will have its own quota of fraudulence) into a super-power. Only that we are striving to be a developed nation, while China is striving to be a super-power.

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Ganesh China is a COMMUNIST Nation.Theres a huge difference between Democracy and Communisim.Its not fair to compare India with China.India does not force you todo things.She relies more on her people doing the right thing.China on the other hand forces her people to do the things she wants.Do you know that there are restrictions imposed on even browsing the net??Any site which is not approved by the government cannot be visited by any browsing person.Even with so many restrictions and impositions it has not grown as much as expected.India on the other hand will grow much faster if only our people realise that we have issues and work to correcting them.A lot of us Indians are like Alcoholics...our main problem is denying that we have a problem !!

Well said Sanjinika!

Unfortunately it requires much effort and argumentation to convince our people to see that.

http://www.indianexpress.com/full_st...ntent_id=73907

I thought the above link would be appropriate in this thread. There is a photo of a 97% carrying a 3% on his shoulders.

" India’s national leadership must see in the photograph of Vadodra’s joint commissioner mounted on a constable, a mute but vivid symbol of the disastrous state of the national administration. "

Sad but true..

guys, when u ask ppl. to identify the problems within the country , then it is also necessary to review the things that we are doing good.........y dunt u guys bring 1 article abt India doing good in some field or the other........u guys for the past 1 week have discussed in length&breadth abt. India's weaknesses, now y dunt u say something good abt ourselves......

u know, when my team was doing bad, my manager not only pointed out our mistakes/problems but he also xpressed hope and pointed out our strengths as well.......rite now we r the most performing group in our firm..... :D....
similarly,express some hope abt this gr8 country doing well.......image India as a strong nation by 2020 , it will happen as abdul kalam says........

unga postellam paartha US Human rights commsion reports on India and 20 satyajit ray padam paartha mathiri irukku.....cheer up guys.......dont paint the picture so black...... :D ...u guys r generating so much negative energy which is not good for our country..... :D

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Originally Posted by Cinefan

And a :thumbsup: for the rest of your post.

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Tks Cinefan! :)

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Originally Posted by Thiru

" India’s national leadership must see in the photograph of Vadodra’s joint commissioner mounted on a constable, a mute but vivid symbol of the disastrous state of the national administration. " Sad but true..

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Aside, this is also I daresay a literal eg. of a system where one climbs over/pushes down another to get over to the top! :wink: :lol2:

here's an interesting article on our Economy :)
http://us.rediff.com/money/2005/jul/13gdp.htm

To all our Tidel Park-Cofee Pub sophisticated techies:

An excerpt from World Bank WDI for South Asia-

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Despite high tech hotspots, low access to PCs and Internet

Modern information and communications technologies are increasingly recognized for their contribution to the development
process and links to growth. Despite the new technology centers that have sprung up in places such as Bangalore, the
South Asia region, home to more than 20 percent of the world’s population, has the lowest Internet use and access to personal
computers among developing regions. With 10 Internet users per 1,000 people, South Asia ranks well below Europe and
Central Asia (160 users per 1,000), Latin America (106 per 1,000), and Sub-Saharan Africa (20 users per 1,000). Access to
PCs is also low in South Asia compared to other developing regions. With 7 PCs per 1,000 people, South Asia is behind East
Asia and the Pacifi c (26 PCs per 1,000), the Middle East and North Africa (38 PCs per 1,000), and Sub-Saharan Africa (12
PCs per 1,000).

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will u stop it unlimited meals?????obviously west doesent like India and they have trillions of articles on web degrading India, that doesent mean they r all true and u need to post them here......there's a limit for everything..........u know foreigners also access this forum, still u make so many criticisms against India???/very bad.....and it is so disgusting to see so many ppl. criticising India..........criticising India is like criticising urself.....y dont u realise that???it is also very sad to see younger generation with so much of pessimism abt. India.......

jai Hind.....

That article is in no way pessimistic. It is an appraisal of World Development Indicators drawn by World bank and was taken directly out of World Bank's website. It is a fact and goes to prove what some of us have been trying to say here. Tech advances have infiltrated only the cities.

Maddy, I believe you are reacting unneccesarily. Foreigners don't look down on India's lack of certain facilities. You need not be ashamed of such statistics. Give the nation some time and not only will it catch up but will grow at a rate unassailable by the others.

World over, the belief is that India and China will the super powers of the future.

Number of TVs per person, cars, GDP, etc are beyond the control of the ordinary person and is dependant on several issues.

What I would be worried about is one thing (ironically raised in Anniyan) - people's attitude. Change has to begin there.

Denial won't help.

NOVji, i accept change shuld be from minds of common man and not just politicians.....accepted but did u see some of the posts here which were only abt. weaknesses/bad points abt. India.....y dont they look at the brighter side also????we shuld be optimistic also not just sit and sulk.......

Guess, people already are aware of India's greatness and just want to highlight the weaknesses.

Maddy, latest news is that Anniyan is now going to be dubbed into French for foreign audience (yet another first!) - what are your thoughts about this now? ;)

that's gr8 isn't it??? but again wat will french ppl. think of India when they watch this movie :D .......

hey is it really true NOV???

Thats correct.

I dont think we all come here to write things we know are already good about India and write stuff in general that makes us feel good. It is not about feeling good but its more about raising awareness and boldly stating bare facts that we in the cities choose to ignore. Being comfy is easy, to change needs some steel

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Originally Posted by ssanjinika

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Originally Posted by ganesh79

I am surprised that no one has brought China into our topic or did I miss them? In fact, it is the apt country to compare India with, if at all we want to compare. It is similar in the way it wants to grow genuinely and indigenously (of course, every country will have its own quota of fraudulence) into a super-power. Only that we are striving to be a developed nation, while China is striving to be a super-power.

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Ganesh China is a COMMUNIST Nation.Theres a huge difference between Democracy and Communisim.Its not fair to compare India with China.India does not force you todo things.She relies more on her people doing the right thing.China on the other hand forces her people to do the things she wants.Do you know that there are restrictions imposed on even browsing the net??Any site which is not approved by the government cannot be visited by any browsing person.Even with so many restrictions and impositions it has not grown as much as expected.India on the other hand will grow much faster if only our people realise that we have issues and work to correcting them.A lot of us Indians are like Alcoholics...our main problem is denying that we have a problem !!

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Please name a single country that accepts or accepted or will accept its mistakes and deeds. You are talking as if only Indians are alcoholics, while most part of the world is submerged in alcohol, both literally and metaphorically. Every civilization has its own faults. Why do we want to project ourselves in bad light while the real criminals are projecting themselves as Mahatmas? How long are you going to complain ourselves, our government and our citizens, while in the other developed nations people (falsely) complain "other government", "other citizens" and "others" (what they call aliens) for their problems ?
Both self appraisal and self happiness are required together for success. Just like we have the right to criticize ourselves, we have the right to acclaim ourselves too. Aren't we thought in our respective schools that right projection is the first step to success? What do you first tell about yourselves in a job interview? The mistakes you did/do/will do?

Have you ever looked at how US tried to cover up the scams like Enron, MCI/Worldcomm, US 2000 presidential elections. How many movies have been taken centered around these scams? (except a documentary called Farenheit...). In how many movies you see people criticize about these scams. Why don't you take a cue from these countries? May be this is how they really developed - Cover up all the mistakes. I believe there were many more such scams that didn't even show up. I know even people who disregard Enron as a scam and say it is some "corporate issue". But I have read about some families that came to streets after the Enron scam.

Who says China hasn't grown as expected. May be the west spreads such rumours. And moreover, China doesn't boast/market itself like the west and doesn't use any flowery languages either. And btw, India was meant to be only semi-democratic.

And I do know that emergence of china as a super power is not a good news for India.

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I think that too is a message in the film

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Shankar gives a message to Indians through Anniyan! That is news to me! I have seen some worthy serious message in movies such as KaruththammA, avargaL, kutty etc. They do have very serious messages to the society and for the middle-class people especially.

When Shankar comes up with a message through "one-day CM" and "stranger" and the "punks" (boys), it only cracks me up!

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When people from our country can go in mass to countries like malaysia and behave responsibly why cant they behave the same way in India?

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Please, go and watch our fellow indians, when boarding Air-India in north america (Dallas or Chicago or New York) how the Indians follow the "rules of boarding". It is a shame! The cheap, unprofessional attitude of Indians never change no matter where they live. The same Indians will be responsible and do their job perfectly when boarding with majority of white-passengers when boarding in an AA or United or Delta.

It is nothing but a joke if someone seriously believes that Shankar is working on fixing the society through his movies. But, he is, sure, entertaining people by painting the mountains and inspiring Hollywood flicks like Matrix. He is surely helping Kunjumon, A M Rathnam and Oscar to make big bucks.

Is he sending a serious message to the society through his movies which will ever get to the people???

A big NO!

That is of course my humble opinion! 8)

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Originally Posted by stranger

Shankar gives a message to Indians through Anniyan! That is news to me! ..............When Shankar comes up with a message through "one-day CM" and "stranger" and the "punks" (boys), it only cracks me up! .........Is he sending a serious message to the society through his movies which will ever get to the people???

A big NO!

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Well, I'm yet to see Anniyan (btw, I think Vikram looks much better in tat Iyengar garb than he does in reality! :wink: :lol2: ).......but I've noticed tat altho such films (Mudalvan, Sami r other eg.) r made by & large w/ the idea of 'enlightening' the masses abt issues affecting our society & seem to carry a message for ppl. in them, tat effect is all usually marred by including of mostly cheap-ish, vulgar dances in the songs of most o these movies......!
Its like, the entire seriousness of the 'message' tat these movies r meant to carry is lost w/ all these unwanted, giltzy gimmicks! :x

Ppl. tend to like watching these films mainly for this stuff & miss out on the original idea the movie was made for.......so it eventually jus becomes another action-romance-song-dance movie to entertain & fill up the box office.......tats the main reason even such films fail to make the imapct on ppl. tat they r expected to.......tks to being diluted w/ such cheap commercially oriented gimmicks!
IMHO, twud've been better if there weren't songs/dances w/ such levels of vulgarity in them, which tend to deviate the minds of many ppl. (read male audience!) from the main message tat is being rightly conveyed in the story.....!

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Originally Posted by stranger

Please, go and watch our fellow indians, when boarding Air-India in north america (Dallas or Chicago or New York) how the Indians follow the "rules of boarding". It is a shame! The cheap, unprofessional attitude of Indians never change no matter where they live. The same Indians will be responsible and do their job perfectly when boarding with majority of white-passengers when boarding in an AA or United or Delta.

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Yea, even I've noticed the same, contrasting behaviours among many of our ppl. while travelling in AI vs. travelling in Sing. Airlines or Silkair....... :wink:

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Originally Posted by ganesh79

How long are you going to complain ourselves, our government and our citizens, while in the other developed nations people (falsely) complain "other government", "other citizens" and "others" (what they call aliens) for their problems ?

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Well, I daresay its bcos in "developed" nations, ppl. can seldom find nething to complain abt their own govt., their citizens, their countries' infrastructure etc. 'cos its all supposed to be developed.....so when they jus need sumthing to complain abt they start talking abt other nations/govts. & so-called "aliens"...... :wink: :lol2:

-Just joking! :D

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Originally Posted by ganesh79

Have you ever looked at how US tried to cover up the scams like Enron, MCI/Worldcomm, US 2000 presidential elections. How many movies have been taken centered around these scams? (except a documentary called Farenheit...).

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Um.......'don't rem. nething shown abt the Vietnam War either :? (which I think was put out by Jimmy Carter?).......one of the longest wars I've known abt!

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Originally Posted by ganesh79

Who says China hasn't grown as expected. May be the west spreads such rumours. And moreover, China doesn't boast/market itself like the west and doesn't use any flowery languages either. And btw, India was meant to be only semi-democratic.

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Um......speakin of China, ne idea y exactly Indian govt. is now freely allowing Chinese goods to flood the market?? After all these years of stiff competition w/ them even in terms of marketing products globally....... :?

Why vietnam? Even the "hiroshima neethano...nagasaki neethano" is fully covered up and no one has made movie about it. There are dozen movies on pearl harbor attack though! And Shankar glorifies this in a song in a Tamil movie.. "Unmeedhu thano en kadhal bomb o". Doesn't know the seriousness of the situaion. Ah. Good job Shankar!

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Originally Posted by ganesh79

Why vietnam? Even the "hiroshima neethano...nagasaki neethano" is fully covered up and no one has made movie about it. There are dozen movies on pearl harbor attack though!

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Yes but then Hiroshima-Nagasaki wud be of more significance to the history of Japan rather than US, rite?...... :?
Vietnam War (which the US then called as War against communism) is significant as itwas poss' one of rthe longest in history.......raged on for nearly 2 decades- from the late '50s to the mid(?) '70s!
My suspicion is tat US is goin 2 repeat the same thing even in the 21st century, in case of the Iraq War (a.k.a War agnst Terrorism!)........doesn't look like its likely to end soon!

Mr Ganesh,

There is no point in continuing this discussion with you. You dont seem to get the point ! You talk about other countries painting themselves as Mahatma when in fact they have a lot of other problems. Just because other countries are stupid enough todo that ,its no reason for Indians todo the same. And FYI WE ARE NOT TRYING TO PUT DOWN INDIA !!! All we are saying is that there is no harm in accepting that we have areas where we need to change and go about changing it. Again I am not trying to blame anyone...each and every one of us as Indians should try to change ourselves first and behave in a irreproachable manner.We can then worry about the world. Andha country eppadi erruku,indha country eppadi errukku-nu vetti pechu pesinde errunda namma urupuda mattom!!

As if I am the person who started the art of comparing with other countries ...

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Is he sending a serious message to the society through his movies which will ever get to the people??? A big NO!

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With this attituide, probably not. But my belief is that there are some people who to a reasonable extent wanted to change and behave more responsible. From your post I understand that maybe I should not count you in as one of them.

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Originally Posted by ssanjinika

Andha country eppadi erruku,indha country eppadi errukku-nu vetti pechu pesinde errunda namma urupuda mattom!!

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It is true but how would you come up a criticism or any comment if you dont compare others and other countries' and the people's attitude you learnt about?

"aduththaaththu ambujaththa paarththELA"- is also needed to certain extent to fix ourselves. 8)

You cant just start from nowhere. Can you? :roll:

What is also funny is that how some are doing a 'Bhai-Bhai' with China. :D

China is in no way comparable to India. I think they are looking over at something bigger than us.

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Please, go and watch our fellow indians, when boarding Air-India in north america (Dallas or Chicago or New York) how the Indians follow the "rules of boarding". It is a shame! The cheap, unprofessional attitude of Indians never change no matter where they live. The same Indians will be responsible and do their job perfectly when boarding with majority of white-passengers when boarding in an AA or United or Delta.

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Okay.... so that still does not bode well for us, right? In Anniyan isn't that what he shows? "Manushaalukku Manushaa mariyadhaiye illiya?" You just gave an example of how shankar was right!

What I wanted to say in this original context was that we Indians will not drive on the shoulder, will not throw a cofee cup blatantly on the pavement in the US because we will be screwed here. But things are easy in India, and the "kindness" the society imposes drives people to have the arrogant feeling that nobody would care(or would kill us) if disrespect civic manners. The same guy who would follow the rules in India would land in our place and start becoming carefree. Because it is after all India, who cares?

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Originally Posted by UnlimtedMeals

You just gave an example of how shankar was right!

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Give me a break, here! Will you?!

Then what was Shakar right about, when those punks bringing a "motherly" prostitute in their own home when the parents are out of town-where their mom and dad are living???!!!(in BOYS)

Is he trying to fix the society then?! Tell me how?!

Why did he by-pass the "A" certificate in that movie, which was very well deserved???? For helping the society?! :roll:

To help all the punks in India by showing a new way to get infected with a strange virus??? 8)

Anniyan itself was given life with only black money, I suppose. Movie makers are the biggest tax defaulters. They criticize the fellow citizens? Movie makers after, "adjustment" with heroines and minting money, complain our own land and people. Anniyan should have killed them first.
Half the movie makers are school dropouts, drunkards, womanizers and they comment on India's economic policies. Nice joke. No wonder they eventually enter into politics, with die-hard fanatics supporting their views. This is the first and foremost bane of India. Now do you agree that I too criticize India?

there's no point in defending Shankar UL....he is not serious with his msgs...they r so kiddish :D .......just enjoy his movies and that's it......infact Mani is more serious comapred to shankar while giving msg movies........

ssanjinika, every country have their prejudice and predetermined notions....India is no different........infact sometimes ths prejudice is measured as patriotism.........so i wont accept everything is wrong with India.........it is not true as well.....u and UL shuld understand that times are changing.....i dunt know how old u r but if u r in ur twenties i promise that our kids will see THE superpower India cos:

1.India is the 10th most powerful economy in the world
2.Indian economy grows thrice as fast as Japan,Germany,UK
3.Indian IT and BPO industry will touch 25 billion$ mark by 2015
4.Indian consumer market is huge and all major foreign players are now dependent on Indian consumer.....
5.India is also doing very well in tradional industries like steel,cement whereas western countries see their IT companies doing better than Steel,cment industries.....

still u think India is bad and we r dying then pls go ahead....there's no one to stop u.....not even the admin :D

Maddy,

In fact I think it is good India is projected in bad light. So we can develop silently, unlike the west, which is getting ruined by itself without its knowledge. Let us remain ignorant "makkans", in the eyes of others. Let's see how the next generation of developed countries are going to be, with half the teenagers already succumbed to drugs/hiv and literally no show of them in science/math/tech/medicine degrees in universities. Let them paint the India black and elsewhere in colors. Let them think we are fools and consider themselves intelligent. As they say "he who thinks he knows, but knows not is the ultimate fool" and vice-versa. In fact this is the right strategy to develop ourselves. Paint ourselves black.

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Originally Posted by ganesh79

Maddy,
Let us remain ignorant "makkans".

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:rotfl:

Man! That aint a good idea for sure! :lol:

Apparently, ganesh, You dont seem to know about us! :rotfl:

Read again please.

NO need!

Relax!

I know what u mean.

You mean let us look ignorant to the ignorant west!

But we are indeed ignorant. So it aint going to work, ganesh :cry:

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Originally Posted by MADDY

there's no point in defending Shankar UL....he is not serious with his msgs...they r so kiddish :D

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:thumbsup:

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every country have their prejudice and predetermined notions....India is no different

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This is tricky, if the range is between 1 to a billion!

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infact sometimes ths prejudice is measured as patriotism

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That's news to me, maddy!

And the unit for such a measurement is? :)

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there's no one to stop u.....not even the admin :D

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:notworthy: