ARR Vs YSR Vs HJ

So what did I miss??? Loooks like the war is here to stay ... :-)
My two cents: ( that means entirely my opinion no FACTS)

Comparing two MD'S will never stop in this forum but will try to keep it simple. If you want to compare two people, put them within the same yardstick. Comparing old ARR with new Yuvan as suggested by some people is not the way of looking at it. But then are these two people really need to be compared? I don’t think Yuvan is in the same league of ARR to be compared. But then this comparison is just based on the current playing ground. No past credits!!

The sudden rise& rise of Yuvan, can be attributed to the fact that (quite recently) he started working with directors not so hot and to his good fortune the movie became hits. By working with stars (3 stars or less) and directors (2 stars and less) he has ultimately made the media to pick his songs as a main reason of success of those movies. I am not discrediting the fact that his music/bgm is good.

Movies AA, TT, Pattiyal, KK , Manmadhan, 7G owes its success to Yuvan more than anybody else. The media when writing about these successes HAS to talk about Yuvan. There is no other way out. Whether it was a deliberate ploy not to work with upscale stars and directors or it just so happened, we would not know. But the very fact that Yuvan figured in these movies suddenly shown a 'new superstar' to the media.

Now does ARR has that kind of luxury? He is too pricey for a new comer. Working with top notch directors and stars worked both to his advantage and 'supposed' fall from grace. Take RDB for ex. How much of its success actually goes to ARR. Hardcore fans would say about 30% while the media would play it down to 20% or would conveniently have just a line or two. The advantage is ARR has a hit under the belt. More people would buy the album and increase his saleability. The same is the case with movies like Muthu or Padayappa.

Did ARR enjoy the benefits Yuvan has now? He did once not anymore, when he worked on GentleMan, Kadhalan (Shankar wasnt a big name to deal with then), Kadhal Desam etc. He made the main reason for success point to him. The other fact that he was the new phenomenon and that He DID introduce the new sound and that everybody was fascinated by him need not be delved into that this time.

I am still perplexed by the fact that Dile Se – probably with the soundtrack of the decade flopped while Yuvan made AA a hit. The quality of these movies are more or less the same. Was it the hype that killed it? You never know.

Will ARR ever get chance to prove that He still can bring the crowds with the strength of his music, I don’t know. With music by ARR it has to be with top notch stars and probably he will only get the last piece of the success pie. I hope ARR works with a lot of new comers like what IR did at one point and stand out rather than being one among the crowd.
That’s all folks.. later

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Originally Posted by sloshed

The sudden rise& rise of Yuvan, can be attributed to the fact that (quite recently) he started working with directors not so hot and to his good fortune the movie became hits. By working with stars (3 stars or less) and directors (2 stars and less) he has ultimately made the media to pick his songs as a main reason of success of those movies. I am not discrediting the fact that his music/bgm is good.

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:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: I totally agree with you sloshed. HAH, even sloshed can talk sense, well that is NEWS to me. But I think you are crediting Yuvan more than necessary for the success of the films u mentioned.

Selvaraghavan films are a class apart. They would have been a hit anyway, but sure, yuvan's BGMs were the lifeline for the film. Vishnuvardhan is a different kind of masala director who knows how to make a film hit. The peppy songs in the film were just to enhance the entertainment, just like VS songs in dharani's film. By no stretch of imagination, they bring the crowd to theatres. Manmadan may actually owe a little more to yuvan than any of these films, but the fact is that its audio released long back b4 the film released and it was almost forgotten. Even b4 the film released, when i asked my friend to play Manmadan song in the car, he used to say"dei athu pazhaya paattu, ethanai vatti keakeradhu". I dont beleive the songs brought the initial crowd to the theatre. I think the cool promos and stylish photography created the initial hype. But sure it helped to retain crowds, bcoz it was a critical part of wholesome package of the movie, which otherwise had nothing to boast.

I am not discrediting Yuvan's part in the succes of any of these movies, but to say Yuvans songs were crowd puller wud be a bit too much. In recent times, the songs that actually made a film hit are the craps like "manmadha rasa" and "O podu". whole TN was crazy over such songs when their movies released and they definitely brought the crowd to theatre. without manmadha rasa, there is no reason for a film like "thiruda thirudi" to become a hit (dont tell me it is due to the star power of Dhanush :rotfl: .

A similar spree of "songs of craze" happnd during initial career of ARR, which helped the films bcome a hit. examples include muqqabla from kadhalan and humma song from bombay. the whole nation (not just TN) was going bezerk with these songs. These were potential crowdpullers but for arguement sake one can say that shankar and MR are too talented to solely depend on these songs. It wud have worked with any other director.

OK all these arguements is just to say that, it is not the quality of songs that pulls the crowd. It seems to be a strange crazy taste of film goers, which no MD has completely cracked. The result is MDs like bharadwaj trying to repeat the magic and end up with suckers like "deepavali thalai deepavali" :lol:

sloshed....surprised :shock: .......gud post man, w/o criticising rahman.....

sloshed, thamizh is rite.....AA, TT, Pattiyal, KK , Manmadhan, 7G wud have been successful without YSR's music also.....now, has he made a bad movie run for his music only??NO .......ppl. will tell even ARR did not make that many movies run like IR did and stuff like that.....but the fact is, YSR has never made a movie run solely for his music.....even harris has that credit in Ullam ketkumae....

he is no way a crowd puller bcos he is not a household name......ARR was a household name after chikku bukku rail song, and for whole India after muqabla, IR was one after annakili itself...... YSR is known by his HC-fans,HC-IR-fans,musical inclined ppl. and ofcourse the film buff who wud even say which year was the first black-white movie released.......

u asked like whether ARR can bring crowds with his strength??well, i saw RDBasanti in both b'lore and chennai.....tell u wat ARR got more applause than Aamir khan's name during th title....

last thing, u told that AA is equal to Dil se??? mannn, i wud have been happy if u had told AA is better than Dil se cos i wud have dismissed u as one amongst many who have rejected Dil se but u knew the value of Dil se but stilll wanted to place it along with AA....bad....

Tamizh and MADDY,

Some of your points hold good and some dont. AA was a HIT becos of Yuvan. There are no two ways about it. That movie would have gone to the dumps if not for the
hysteria created by Yuvan. He was the biggest USP for that movie just like ARR'S chaiya chaiya was. That is why there was an apparent comparison with Dil Se.
Maddy I am not comparing the songs of these movies per se but just the results of these movies.
I made a statement that ARR cannot bring in the crowds on the strength of his music becos ARR isnt the only strength of the movies he is
working with. Unless ARR gets back working with new directors/stars he is never gonna get any credit. I cannot dwell on the topic that ARR got more whistles than Amir Khan. That was very naive statment to make.
Tamizh I dont buy the arguement that those movies would have been a hit anyway. If thats the case, you can equally argue all the Hit ARR movies would have been hits anyway even if there is no ARR.
With the possible exception of Kadhal Desam&Taal , movies like Gentleman,Indian,Roja, Bombay, Alaipayuthey,KK would have all been hits anyway.
My main contention was Yuvan is going through what ARR went through a decade ago. Yuvan is slowly becoming a household name. This may also well do with the fact that ARR was away from tfm for so long.
As far as comparing the quality and the likeabilty of the songs thats an open debate.

Having said that I think the tastes of the public have changed dramatically, they need more than a good music to make a movie a hit. Off course you can count out the once in a life time songs like
Vazha meenu, O Podu, Manmatha Rasa. By now all the MD's have realised that its the Box Office that determines the fate of their music. But we at tfmpage go beyond the box office ....
In Hindi ARR is King, but in Tamil ARR has to fight it out. His associations with SJS/KSR didnt help in big way. I am really hoping with JOK ARR can take his fort becos Shivaji will be a Rajni movie. Period.
I still maintain the fact that Yuvan has a long way to go before we start comparing him with ARR.

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Originally Posted by sloshed

I made a statement that ARR cannot bring in the crowds on the strength of his music becos ARR isnt the only strength of the movies he is
working with.

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Exactly my point dude. And by the way forgot to mention abt Rhythm. I beleive the film ran for its music. Haiyo pathikuchu was an instant hit. I would personally attribute the phenomenal success of rhythm album, to the "outta the world" Alaipayuthe, which resulted in such an hype for Rhythm :)

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In Hindi ARR is King, but in Tamil ARR has to fight it out. His associations with SJS/KSR didnt help in big way.

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:thumbsup: :thumbsup: In hindi, ARR is the king not bcoz he is doing many projects there, mainly bcoz his name is among the first to be written down (or atleast sought) before finalizing the crew for any big project or supposedly a movie for international audience. The truth is in both the film industries, ARR is rejecting more films than accepting. This gives ppl an illusion that directors dont go behind ARR, and that he has lost his market.

sloshed, u r being prjeudiced against ARR here...u dont want to talk abt ARR's role in making RDB a hit in south......RDB is HIT due to ARR in south......there are no 2 ways abt it......also, u r safely crediting shivaji's success to rajni and exclude ARR now only....that's not true.....and ur placing ur bet on JOK which might flop big time.......

moreover ARR became a household name in 1 year, YSR has been here for 8 years, still trying to be one,do u mean to say they are equal???

ARR bought in a new sound, new recording style, world sounds(now dont tell me he copied them),padmashree in 6years, 2 NA in 6 years, rocked whole India....infact for kadhal desam they had bigger cutouts for ARR than vineeth/abbas/tabu......

i wud like to conclude ARR is a phenom, YSR is a music director....

slosed you just talked my mind in two of ur earlier posts...i wud really like to quote, but i wud end up quoting the entire two posts :)

I would like to add on some more what u've said

Trash films that ran solely bcoz of ARR's songs

(1) Kaadhal Desam - havent seen a movie with a crap of a screenplay than this.. Best music of that time from ARR

(2) Kadhalar Dhinam - better than Kaathal desam, but still a nothing movie except ARR's music

(3) Kaadhalan - Average movie, but superhit bcoz of ARR

But ARR also had given some excellent music to some films which still flopped

(1) Sangamam
(2) Vandicholai Sinrasu (except two damp squibs in parotta parotta and eh kutti pappa)
(3) Tajmahal
(4) May maadham
(5) Kangalal Kaidhu sei

and many more esp in the Post 2000

So the bottom line is songs or a MD alone cannot make a film hit. It also depends on the picturisation. Kathir and Shankar excel in that and the same goes for Vishnuvardhan, Selvaraghavan etc.,

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Originally Posted by rsubras

Trash films that ran solely bcoz of ARR's songs

(1) Kaadhal Desam - havent seen a movie with a crap of a screenplay than this.. Best music of that time from ARR

(2) Kadhalar Dhinam - better than Kaathal desam, but still a nothing movie except ARR's music

(3) Kaadhalan - Average movie, but superhit bcoz of ARR

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rsubras, wat abt Minsara kanavu,jeans,taal,Indira, duet, en swasa kaatre, ratchagan, jodi........he also desperately tried to save Boys but even god cannot help that movie.....

It is not only the picturisation, but the type of music also that drives the public. we may call the taste of public as poor, call the songs trash, but wat the public wants in the theatre is entertainment. We wont feel the pulse unless we experience it.
Cine goers would like a song to be pacy, with a punch, so that they can dance to it. I myself have experienced similar feeling during my college culturals, choreo nite. we had a gr8 nite that day, all racy songs , gud dance by the participant. some of the songs that made me go bezerk then were naattu charakku, manmadha rasa, yei aathaa aathorama vaariya and so on. no cultured music feast can equal that wild dance and fun i had that day. At times u gotta come outta ur brain and feel the animal in u, that is raw enjoyment :)

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Originally Posted by thamizhvaanan

It is not only the picturisation, but the type of music also that drives the public. we may call the taste of public as poor, call the songs trash, but wat the public wants in the theatre is entertainment. We wont feel the pulse unless we experience it.
Cine goers would like a song to be pacy, with a punch, so that they can dance to it. I myself have experienced similar feeling during my college culturals, choreo nite. we had a gr8 nite that day, all racy songs , gud dance by the participant. some of the songs that made me go bezerk then were naattu charakku, manmadha rasa, yei aathaa aathorama vaariya and so on. no cultured music feast can equal that wild dance and fun i had that day. At times u gotta come outta ur brain and feel the animal in u, that is raw enjoyment :)

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i double on that man....its just when u need to enjoy with ur frens...not thinking bout quality all....its great to just dance to appadi poodu,etc etc....but its sad this masala songs's fame is making the music dirs called as Music Genius :lol: ARR could make a very punch song with its quality not beein degraded down....same thing on YSR...i only manage to see this in YSR...his THeepidika is just hot music with quality not beein down.Hj falls down on this part.His cheap songs like Kokku Meenai & Kalayanam than kathikithu odipolama is just errmmm :shock: Randakka would have been something like that...thank god it had Shankar to save the makkals.... :lol: was the lyric by Vairamuthu??? :?