Wow! I thought I am alone to like and put bavani varugiraa at the top in PS. Good to see thumburu also lists as her most favorite. This song is totally new, fresh and most of all young as you pointed out. :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by thumburu
Scanned through the samples of 'ponnar-shankar'.
Instantly catchy!
I don't care for 'period' business or 'whether apt instruments' biz anymore, even if I did at any point of time in the hub, now gone back to the original days of IR when he had all kinds of WCM / Shenoy kind of non-native instruments for TN folk, so how does it matter if he has synth for sariththirappadam.
Another thing, who complained when IR used synth for 'kodiyilE malligappoo'? :confused: So, if he has sufficient ingradients to please and limited ingradients that irritate, who cares if synth or natural gadgets?
Should listen more to pick favourites :-)
its like comparing apples to oranges!Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
'kodiyile malligappoo' might have had synth usage, but, as a whole, it does not take away the organic feel from the song!
similar is the case with say, 'unna vida' from virumandi, or 'karugu mani' from azhagar malai both of which must have used synth keyboard etc, but the organic rustic feel is intact!
it is when the synth effect overshadows the 'soul' part of a composition, it irritates
irir123,
I think me too telling the same, in different words :-)
-deleted wrong thread-
request to moderator
i think its high time a new thread is started , we are in 2011 ,it is as if we are still discussing 2009 songs. what do you all think?
thumburu,
'bhavani varugira' is one of the four melodious songs. So you have touched the first one. Check the others as well. I am sure if you liked 'Jaganmohini' songs you will like 'malarvillile' song as well.
Some more explanation on the 'period-should-not-have-synth' myth...
#1 One can definitely question Raja on the use of "loop" / "samples" etc on the basis of his "pop corn" "not a composer" kind of statements:-) Can even tell that it's self-contradiction / hypocrisy etc
#2 One can also dismiss use of certain gadgets as "I didn't like it, it irritates me a like Rajaraja Chozhan wearing a ray-ban glass or driving a Mustang"
# -1 OTOH, none can say "hey, this is for BC 1st century, how can there be drum pad / bass guitar". By the same token, they should dismiss the bass guitar / violin score for 'manjakkuLichchu aLLi mudichchu'
That's all your honor :-)
Ahem! This has been my point since long time.... but then... :-|Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
anyway, lets enjoy the album and lets await the next one too - Happi!
One best thing about the whole PS soundtrack is the chorus section is back with a bang. Almost in every song, we can see chorus backing up so beautifully, sometimes they even come to the front, which makes this soundtrack very rich. But again as Sunil pointed, there are some teasing moments. In Annanmar kathai, the starting haunting chorus definitely is a teaser. It is no way related to the song coming up, but for first few seconds it comes and go, but gives a lasting impression. I had a feeling that why it suddenly stopped? It was so beautiful!
On another note, In 'Thedi vantha' song, Kunal's tamizh diction was surprsingly very good compared to udits and sukhwinders. Only his voice shows he is a northie, but he did this song amazingly well. Is this his first tamizh song? If so, tremendous performance. :clap:
I am having great time with Ponnar Shankar songs. Bavani Varugira, Kannai Padithen, Malar Villilae are most listened songs for me. Thedi Vantha comes next and Annamar Kathai comes last (although it is an out and out IR folk song).
Count me in folks! Incessant Ponnar Shankar-ing today! Bhavani, Annamaar and Malarvillile top my list. The two romantic duets come in next (the 1st song is non-existant for me). The length of the songs is another welcome change in this album.
My mind can now automatically sound-engineer and fade-out the out-of-place synth, ganjaphlow, madhu balakrishnan, stock loops, etc, and bring to the fore, dheivakuralazhagi Shreya and those rocking native percussions. Most of us get so sucked into the sythbharavi gloom that we tend to overlook the power-packed thavil, urumi, thappu,etc in the songs.
Shreya, undoubtedly, is the crown jewel of the package. Beautiful, absolutely beautiful singing and hassle-free job in the pronunciation front as well (yuvan & co, you guys can only hang your heads in shame I guess? Other non-thamizh imports, here’s your role model!).
Hendrix, had he heard this girl, would’ve probably made a ‘folksy lady’ for her!
KV,
Well said and that has been my stand as well. The ears filter out the synth and only take in the idea!!! And the ideas are superb. And of course, Shreya is the queen of this album no doubt. Wonderful voice and a nice diction.
V_S: Yes the chorus is back but it was present in songs of 'Jaganmohini' as well.
While it is indeed synth, just observe the accompaniment during the last two lines of the charanam of 'kannai padithen'. Whatay louly, as P_R would say. Similarly I have no complaints on the synth violins in the interlude. Wonderful Hamsadhwani. The interludes in this song are class, synth or no synth.
Another trend which I am watching in Raja is taking some old Hindi melody and giving it a totally different shape. Can't figure out which is the original melody but you can clearly hear the old world charm in them. Examples I can think of are: 'swapnangal' (Bhagyadevatha), 'yaaro paadunnu doori' (Katha Thudarunnu), 'poovakaelu' (ASK) and 'kannai padithen' (Ponnar Shankar). I love each of these melodies. Hope the trend continues :)
Ridiculous accusation. If you care to see Raaja's "Making of Thiruvaasagam" episodes, he clearly explains that loops are huge "time and money savers" for today's music production.Quote:
Originally Posted by raagas
He explains that "though loop usage" is inevitable, music composers should use their imagination to "hide it" and amalgamate it well in their creations. He has never said "NO LOOPS" at all. He lashes out only on "ONLY LOOPS" music composers - whom according to him are just pretenders competing with the genuine composers in the market today, standing on the notes composed by some one else. He reiterates this in the BBC interview as well.
The loops used in PS are minimal and are hidden away well .
Suresh, yes, the violins and flute interplay in kannai padithen interludes is very nice. With Padithurai and Happi round the corner, some quality melodic stuff awaits us I imagine.
Unbelievable and unlikely as it may sound, we seem to be seeing a formation of an impressive combo in the form of IR and MuKa! (some might associate Thiagarajan with Ponnar, but I think MuKa ranks much higher in the mariyadhai/gauravam prospects of a project).
Regardless of the quality of the film, IR appears to be inspired enough to give some very good music.
Uliyin Osai was a stellar album; heavy-weight category classical; a melodic, carnatic feast!
Ponnar Shankar, an ingenious amalgamation of high-voltage folk, WCM and melody; a contrasting beast!
I’m already looking forward to this combo’s next!
If only one suitcase, just a tiny one from the seemingly Himalayan heap, can make it to the project, the Budapest contingent can get some buvva and we folks, fodder for a lifetime!
KV,
From what I read in the media, Thiagarajan was an official in the Polydor (audio) firm, known to be far superior to the audio firms TFM used during initial days of IR, like inreco / HMV etc. The first-ever TF album by Polydor was alaigal Oyvathillai (Thiagarajan was possibly given back the favor by being chosen to act as villain).
That, seems to be quite a long time association between IR & him. (Recall the fantastic work IR did for malayoor mambattian too).
OTOH, IR's relationship with mu-kA seems to be so-so only (e.g. semmozhi mAnAdu anthem was by ARR, none of DMK big budgets had IR, even the recent mu-kA written iLaingan was not IR).
In general, IR seems to be not aligned closely with political groups, though he had worked on a few mu-kA scripts. That way he did do a Jaya TV concert, his most famous by far. (Though there was this IR-GV row w.r.t. JJ function and some court draggings related to IR / GA properties and Sasikala goondaism.). Then there were Congress minister / Vaiko during TbI launch.
So, ponnar-shankar "extract credit" should be given to Thiagarajan, IMO.
I cannot listen to 'Thedi Vantha Devathai' too often just because of Shreya's singing. I get lost most of the time. When her voice breaks when she sings the lines, especially the underlined words, my heart breaks too!
un tholil saanju kattikitten parai mela ottikitten
naan aalillaatha neram paarthu kattikitten
vayasu pulla nee enda theeya vechcha
en manasukkula theriyaama kaiyya vecha
kannathai nee kanavil vanthu kadichchu vachcha kalavaniya
Beautiful when she extends and really asks a question with "Nee Enda"
oorukkelam neethane kaaval thanthe, enakku mattum Nee enda kaadhal thanthe
Is this the first song she sings in this mood? This song is totally contrasting compared to her other three songs. Also I really don't know if she really knows the meaning when she sings, I assume she will know about the overall mood of the song, not every word and line. But the way she emotes every word, I feel she is not very far from SJ. Also added to that, definitely her beautiful voice (compared to SJ) adds to the mood so easily. Amazing how she manages various kind of moods in each and every song in every language all round India, as she is the most sought after singer. Even if we take SJ, she is popular down south mainly, similarly Lata/Asha were popular in north mainly, eventhough they have sung songs outside their region (still they were not quite good in diction), but very less. Shreya in that sense is becoming versatile! Only concern is she should get good compositions to sing like SJ or Lata!
I know it's very early, but eventhough still a long way to go, I certainly feel A legend in the making!
V_S, 'majaa majaa' from 'Sillunu Oru Kadhal' is another 'mood' song, by Shreya Ghoshal. Nice song and nicely sung too.
Thanks Aravind:). Just now listened to this song, brilliant song by ARR and great singing by Shreya as usual!
Jaiganes,Quote:
Originally Posted by jaiganes
Fair enough. Let me put forth my thoughts outside the context of Ponnar Shankar because it is generic. I cant recall IR calling loops as time & money savers, but i remember one video on youtube where IR demonstrated a loop rhythm generated by a synthesizer and questioned or ranted about how this can be called as composer's creation. I am unable to locate the exact video that I saw originally but I found a video in which this interview is being captured (on tv channel): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xg8vJG02LS4 Please note that I never questioned his claim or opinion. He is right and I am with him till there. I cannot understand tamil, but from whatever little I understand I think IR is expressing his displeasure over the usage of preset loops, by modern generation composers.
Now, coming to ONLY LOOPS argument. From what I understand, you mean that IR wants composers to work on the loops creatively and experiment in creating new loops, instead of using 'off the shelf' loops that are available for few US$. Right? Or is IR OK with "off the shelf usage" too? If he is ok with it, then please skip all the thoughts I am writing below. because if he is OK with preset loops, then probably he is complaining about the "melody" and that is a different sphere altogether. But the video above seems to be about preset loops. And my thoughts are totally about his complaints about loops and usage.
Now, I have listened to a handful of Ilaiyaraaja songs (that came in the period 1998-2004) in which "off the shelf" loops are used directly, without any modifications. I cant recall each and every song but I remember me springing out of my office chair, while listening to some song (during my work hours) that I never heard before. I remember exclaiming myself - "But this loop is exactly same as the one in that song by that composer X". A very quick example I can give is "Sutraadha Bhoomi" from Nilave Mugam Kattu - Particularly the charanams. It is a classic example I think. Fantastic song no doubt and I enjoy it myself. and i dont bother about the loop, qualitatively. But objectively, I didnt expect IR to use a preset (& very famous) loop directly. Next time, I will remember to post my similar findings here on the hub, when I listen to something like that but trust me there are atleast 8-9 songs that spooked me totally. So... i often continue to wonder - why succumb to loops? and why complain?
About loops in general: There are a billion loops out there in the market. And if few hundreds of them are already used (by various composers), we are familiar with them. But there are lot of loops unused that every composer is using today. So, a new loop doesnt necessarily mean that it is a creatively-reworked one. It also doesnt mean that it is not a creatively reworked one. It is just that we have no way of knowing if the loops are preset or customised (by composer). All we music buffs can know is just that if something is a loop or not. and with the progress of technology these days, I am afraid we cannot even know that. This is exactly the reason why I have come to terms with the usage of loops - because it has been in practice since 80s (in western pop.. and indian film music embraced it since 90s) and the lines between loops and acoustic sounds & customised synth sounds are blurring day by day.
And lastly, "hidden away well" is a subjective point. for we laymen, it is hidden because we are not exposed to that loop before and for another small time composer who has access to a synth bank with that loop, it could be familiar. The only way IR can avoid all this is by using the real instruments in organic way (with minute human errors being audible or generating the feel that we get when we are in a live concert of say, Tabla for example). But thats not the order of the day. Fair enough. Use loops... like other composers do. But once using - whats the point in "fastfood" talk?
I didnt/dont intend to offend anyone's views. Just put my thoughts/observations - which do not come in the way of my respect for Raaja or his work (despite the issues I have with him).
I completely agree with suresh and others here - PS belongs to Shreya Ghoshal, after Ilaiyaraaja.
And this is the first time I am listening to a kunal Gunjawala song so many times in a day. I would rate Thedi Vantha higher than that erotic mood song in JaganMohini (no, it is not because of my bias towards Shreya, although i dont rule it out totally ;-)). The guitars that come in the background during the lead lines (when she sings vekkapatta vekkapatta vekkapattaaaa) portions - KILLER. IR cant get more classically contemporary than this. Period!
Iniya Tamizh Putthandu Nal Vazhthukkal…(phew! i hope i got it right) to all the tamil based fans here..
Singer Chitra, who is in Dubai for an ARR-themed concert has tragically lost her only daughter Nandana aged 8. The little one apparently fell into the swimming pool of the villa that the family was staying at.
May The Almighty give Chitra and her family the strength and resolve to bear this irreparable loss!
Oh God!I read that news and got a shock!!! How can fate be so cruel??She had to wait for 15 yrs to get a daughter....May god give her strength to bear this!Quote:
Originally Posted by SVN
Chaala thanksu Raagas gaarandi! (don’t worry, you nailed it right!)Quote:
Originally Posted by raagas
Hmm, I do agree with most of what you’ve said on this ‘loopy’ topic (which as though being loyal to the name, keeps looping back, resurfacing every now and then, doesn’t it?)
From what I understand, one of the reasons for this debate to persist here (doesn’t seem to happen in any of the other MD/music threads) is, I think, Raaja not adhering to the adage ‘practice what you preach’. He would lash out at the current music scene, spew his usual popcorn, fastfood accusations, but then go on to take a bit of it, himself. From the way I see it, this could be resulting from him being, in a state, what can be called as, ‘stuck in the middle’. Bear with me while I try and explain.
Phase 1:
Here is a guy who has worked for a good portion of his formative years (as assistant and instrumentalist) with ‘classic’ music directors – yesteryear masters, those who swore by the melodic content in any composition, whose songs took birth on the harmonium, then took form and came to life in live recording sessions, those who would turn to classical music (WCM/ICM) to try out different rhythm patters and ragams when in need of sounding new, and those who, when looking for ideas, sourced their inspiration (genuine cue-taking to blatant lifting) from works of others. Electronic keyboards/synthesizers did have a small role in the picture, but that was just limited to providing new ‘tones’ (not new ‘tunes’!). That’s as much ‘technically advanced’ as one could be then! There was just no substitute for talent and ability. You either got it right, or screwed up the scene. Nothing better to hone one’s skills than the compulsion to match set standards aint it!
Now, it shouldn’t be too difficult to surmise the impact of such an environment on an enthusiastic, aspiring composer in IR.
Phase 2:
The post-gurukulam phase. The guy, after taking in all the gyan that was on offer, his skills sharp as a razor edge, breaks into the scene with a bang. He is still mostly ‘old-school’ in the basics, too much of deviance in this, would be like disrespecting his gurus whom he holds in very high esteem. At the same time, he houses this demon of a talent within himself that wants to break all barriers and perceptions of music, and also an enthusiastic youngster who wants to embrace the ‘new’ to see if it could ‘enhance’ what there is currently. Hence he introduces fresh WCM/folk musical ingredients, new recording techniques, new instruments, equipments and all that jazz! Again, the basics don’t change, all these new aspects are built around the ‘old school core’.
‘New’ sounds (from poly-rhythm pads, synthesizers and other gizmos) there maybe, yet, every note (well, almost) is still his brain-child, something that he has conceived and brought out. Electronic music is only in its nascent stage, too little options in the offering and expensive too! Musical ideas need to be ‘created’, nothing comes free or easy. And you still need skilled guys playing the instruments.
Phase 3:
Its 90s and electronic music is spreading rapidly the world over. Pop music takes centre stage (and tastes first blood in the death of rock/metal).
You cant leave India far behind can you? Enter ARR. The whiz-kid rides the new wave and paves the way for its entry into Thamizh and Indian filim music. There is a bigger out-burst of newer styles and sounds (whoever ever heard the shrill of bottles breaking in a Thamizh song before that!).
Now, one significant difference I see here is that the new kid openly challenges the ‘old-school’ and plays around with the very basics (something that IR was quite cautious in retaining).
Melody is there, but the overall melodic content comes down a bit. There is an inflow of fresh instruments and skilled instrumentalists but fast, electronic-beat driven, pop music is slowly emerging the order of the day.
Maybe, somewhere inside, IR felt his faith in the old-school principles almost being ridiculed. (it’s this factor according to me, that could’ve hurt IR a bit, then, rather than the popularly alleged jealousy over ARR's rise).
Musically, IR still has his act and kit mostly intact, predominantly live sounds, poly rhythms, etc and a small portion of the raging pop sounds too.
Phase 4
Through the 90s and post 2000, advancement in ‘computers in music’ sees electronic music grow in leaps and bounds. Internet, softwares, loops, e-studios, etc are all now household names.
Every kid wants to use his computer and internet to become the next biggest thing, his gig to get to the I’ve-got-10000-hits-in-10mins-on-youtube and 124000-likes-on-facebook stardom.
You no longer need razor-sharp skills when you have cutting edge technology. You don’t need to stress your brain cells for musical ideas, relatively miniscule pressure on your laptop keyboard will fetch you a million ideas.
Talent, you ask? Isn’t my tone groovy enough?
Expertise? Didn’t you read the article on all-in-all home-studios in the latest PC-chip edition?
I want to sing but I can only croak like a frog. Volla! we’ve got a tuning plug!
South-Antarctican native strings? Sam#19882. Sad Violin solo? Sam#1222. Electric guitar lead with distortion? Sam#666.
Music in this phase is more about packaged presentation and less about musical creativity.
Now this is the phase where all of IR’s beliefs and principles seem as extinct as the dodo.
But if there’s one person who has been actively involved in Indian film music from Phase1 through Phase4, it’s got to be IR. He is like a bridge between the classic and the new-age/electronic era, where his foundations happen to be strongly built in the former. His mind still seems to be craving for this even as he operates today. Well then, why does he have to embrace all this new-age tools? This, I think, we cannot have a certain answer. It could be just be the plain comfort that comes as a bonus from this lazy approach. Or like he says, maybe it’s the quality and availability of instrumentalists (the lack of) that makes him opt for it. Yeah, we can point out several talents around, but we don’t really know what he’s looking for.
And this is my point, as to why he does not practice what he preaches in this regard.
When you’ve seen the film music world around you go through such a sea change (and maybe felt that you haven’t been able to do much to turn the tide), contradictions and ironies and sarcasms are bound to catch up on your tongue, sooner or later.
At the end of it all, it is only admiration, of the highest level, that I have for him, for his ability to keep his creative energy flowing through all this turbulence.
Back to Ponnar Shankar.
KV,
One of the best post in hub in recent times.:clap: :clap: Wonderful read.
Now from just about loops, you have treaded a big path in IR's music history, very good.
I agree word by word and IR is definitely 'stuck in the middle'. You have to express your frustrations on current trend, technologies, composers, but at the same time you need to compete with the current trend, you cannnot escape. What a difficult task!. I know every composer would have experienced such scenario, but for Ilaiyaraaja the difference he is seeing that too within 20 years is larger than the sea.
I don't blame him for such contradictory talks. If anyone other composer than IR is in such scenaraio, he would have peacefully retired by this time, quoting the current trend. Still he has energy, passion and belief, just like the same way he used to embrace both our indian and western classical form of music in his compositions, he is coping with the current trend without compromising on the roots he had developed over these years.
If he does not oblige to the current technologies, he would be discarded as outdated composer, on the other hand if he obliges there are still complaints that he has to go back to his old school, as this is not is forte, even if it is good. Just can't imagine how he got in the middle. Only I can feel sorry for him.
But one thing is for sure, whatever changes are happening is definitely not good for indian music, only good for music directors, producers who just see money out of it (IMHO).
Very sad day today to know about Chithra's loss :cry2: :cry2: :cry2:
Fantastic post, KV!
Raja has coped with all kinds of professional hazards and can be given the championship in endurance!
(It's not a big deal to be in the business for 30-40 years when the changes are not drastic. OTOH, any top techie artist of 80's to be in the reckoning after globalization is definitely a test of endurance)
Obviously, unlike his top years when he set the trend, post 1997 he had been mostly a (reluctant) follower of the trend set by others. (Was in state-of-shock between 93&97 when one after other partners kept leaving him).
TbI was an exception but it was like an art movie (means not mainstream) and not affecting / affected by any trend.
It is very painful to hear that Chitra lost her daughter. May the lord give her all the strength to get through this tragedy.Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
Wonderful post KV! I was just sitting back and enjoying your write up!
Infact one thing to admire is his passion for music has never come down even a bit and his consistant search for excellence continues even in this dreadful atmosphere...
I would be more happy to see him coming with more innovative instrumentals in the line of HTNI, NBW etc...than composing for film music in this kind of market.
chithira .......en bommukkutti ammavukkuQuote:
Originally Posted by anegan
சித்திர சிட்டுக்கள்.... என் பொம்முக்குட்டி அம்மாவுக்கு பிலிம்
சித்ரா has sung a composition for ஸ்ரீ.இளையராஜா for a similar situation .
சுஹாசினி- சத்யராஜ் couple lost their daughter at the end of this song scene .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HITfCwpAXek
losing a child is a terrible experience.
very sorry chithra.
hang in there, cope with it the best you can all those horrible feelings...
shock, pain, guilt...
eventually you will endure the situation & find ways to honour your child's memory.
love,
vinatha.
KV,
Aptly put. I agree with you. That was yet one more guess-map of the change in his thoughtware over the years. It could be true. Or may be there is something more. I too felt that he is kind of trapped between schools of thought. But i admire the way he still holds unto his own school of thought, despite changing the robes of his songs. Yet, i would like to highlight one thing. Change is inevitable. Whether the change is good or bad is a subjective issue. But I feel that artists, as time progresses, must put an effort to be little more accomodative in their views about change. I am talking about views, not the artist's ability to adapt to change. thats a different game/topic. I admire R.D.Burman in this aspect. He too has seen some of the best music taking shape in front of his eyes. And he too produced some great music. And when he hit an all-time low, in 80s, due to Bappi Lahiri wave... he was still optimistic. He did not criticize the disco wave. He had every right to, given that he has seen his father - one of the Greatest Composers, do some outstanding music and seeing/interacting with other legends. Despite the disco wave, RD kept encouraging people/instrumentalists to try new things, try synthesizers, push more and get more experimental. I know it is difficult for IR to accept such kind of tolerance levels in his opinions. but just saying. Yet Ilaiyaraaja must be appreciated for his spirit. So many composers came and went in all these decades. But this man continues to charm us. And his contemporary-ness gets into amazing form sometimes.
And yes, atleast you are agreeing that there are contradictions, ironies and sarcasms. This is what I have been underlining many times - that IR fans(not all) should not be denial mode but just treat things objectively. Having admired his work over years, having an objective opinion doesnt dent admiration at all (if fans are mature enough). and this should be applicable to anyone, not just fans of a particular composer.
Just curious: if the same album Ponnar Shankar carried the name "Harris Jayraj" or "ARR" or "GV Prakash"(i know that this album is uniquely IR, but just consider a hypothetical situation) - i bet a lot of IR fans would have pounced on the album (while appreciating some songs at basic level) cribbing about synth overkill, synth violins etc. They would not even consider speculating reasons such as "did composer have budgetary constraints? did the director want exactly this deliberately?" etc. Since it is IR, there is sympathetic guesswork about 'compulsions' etc? if it were other composer, would there be any such considerations? by now, the opinions would have had fireworks in them :-) This is something I find weird. Evaluations are never without labels/biases (not just IR fans, but fans of every composer). There are only optimists(who see justifiable reasons behind flaws) and pessimists(who undermine a music, even if it has interesting stuff, by taking potshots at something or other). I rarely come across realists (just listen and decide, without any bias coming from the name of composer and over-analysis/speculation).
Back to Bavani Varugira... I like the way milliblog karthik termed this - genre bending. absolutely.
Again very nice write up Raagas. But I think it is plain simple, not wierd. First of all, as you said it is hypothetical. Everybody guess a composers work by the way they have approached the music with their stamp, pattern and style. We ( or I would only say for me) defend IR just because we have seen him use real instruments and live orchestra and that has been his strenghts for most of these type of projects. This is the first project we have seen him doing with synth and even I have expressed my concerns.Quote:
Originally Posted by raagas
On the other hand, for other composers definitely we expect that they should be using live instruements and orchestra atleast for these kind of projects, is that a big sin?
Also I see that most of the time, finding faults on IR fans does not look good, but I also feel there is a vast difference in IR fans perception from 1992-2000 period to the IR fans now. Even seen many IR fans openly accepting other composers music in recent times unlike earlier days. So first of all we cannot generalize something and put 'lot of IR fans' just to be on safer side. And analyzing music without bias is utterly impossible nowadays.
OMG... I could not believe what I read about Chitra's tragedy...after so many years trying for a child and finally being given that blessing only for it to be snatched away so soon....I hope she can survive this tragedy...life is just too cruel at times....:cry2:
Not at all a big sin. Even i expect them to. and we all expected IR also to. And hence some of us had concerns (though we are enjoying the album). But i only meant that not many fans have such concerns. Many fans are praise just any album or any treatment to compositions, once they see the name IR. Give the same cd to them, by changing the name from IR to something else, and they will find lot of faults with those very songs.Quote:
Originally Posted by V_S
Analyzing music without bias is uncommon, but not impossible. I dont know why you think that it is impossible. do you think, for example, some of our fellow hubbers liked PS because of bias? or because of the merit of the album. If one is analyzing music with bias - then I cannot call that as an objective opinion at all. whats the point afterall then? Bias takes precedence over merit and if someone is analyzing something, or even IR music, out of bias instead of merit - then it is nothing but sycophancy. And more importantly, an insult to the artist too.
Absolutely. The most disturbing news I have heard in recent times. it upset me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Querida
K_V it really was delightful to read your write-up and analysis :thumbsup:
Raagas, as someone who is just enjoying reading this thoughtful debate, kudos to your questions and points. I personally cannot relate to them, but can appreciate. :thumbsup:
Again this is a big topic. The reason why I said impossible is just because everbody has music listening history and their likes and dislikes. I have never seen just a 'music fan'. He will be having some or other favorite (eventhough he is not fan of anybody). Their itself comes the bias. So eventhough they start approaching the music neutrally, invariably that history just creeps and sits in his brain while listening, which makes him to compare music and to/not to compromise. Only thing we can be true to ourselves little bit, but not 100% and not all the time. Even this is true with reviewers (unless the music is discussed), they have some kind of liking of particular music, trend etc, if the music does not fit in to his requirement, then even it is good, no use for them. Means there is expectation about the composer before listening to it makes them biased. I am not saying whoever (our hubbers) liked PS is because of bias, but because of bias the percentage of likeabality is more, compared to other mds fan or their favorites. So be it PS or whatever soundtrack reviewing neutrally is highly impossible IMHO.Quote:
Originally Posted by raagas