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Appa! Mr Sudhama! You are too much.
Anyway, I know the names of 2 sons of Karna
a) Chitrasena
b) Vrshasena. this was the son killed by Arjuna, in memory of Abhimanyu, in the very sight of Karna.
I have no idea of Karna's wife's name. Although there is a tamil traditional play (a ala therukoothu) in which they refer to a Ponnuruvi as the wife of karna
sorry on a tangent here but thanx Geno for the reader site....finally make sense of jumbled gibberish :D
A Brief History on the Greatest Warrior - Ankaraj Karna
A great hero of the 'Mahabharata'. Karna lived such a life that he became another name for generosity and loyalty. It was his misfortune to be shunned as a person of low caste. To him loyalty was more important than the emperor's throne. He sacrificed his life for his master
The Ganga was flowing full to the brim. An old man stood on the bank. He made obeisance with folded hands to the sun that was just rising. He prayed as usual:"Oh Sun God! You give light to the whole world. I have no children and my life is miserable. Have mercy on me. Grant me a child. Bestow light on my life
As the prayer ended, Adhiratha's eyes were filled with tears. This was not the first time all this had happened. Every day he would pray like this, He was already becoming old. He thought perhaps God had not heard his prayer at all.
Adhiratha was about to leave. Then he saw something floating. Adhiratha stood still. The object was floating towards him. When it came near him Adhiratha bent down. Lo, it was a large basket! Inside, on a soft cushion, there was a child. It wore a Shining armor; it had a glowing earornament. The Child was lovely; it shone like a miniature sun.
Adhiratha was overwhelmed with surprise, pity and joy. At once he picked up the child from the basket. Tears of joy flowed from his eyes profusely. How strange! He had found a child just where he had stood in prayer! Did it mean that God had heard his prayer? Poor child, to whom does it belong? What did it matter! In future it would be his, and only his. Adhiratha joyfully took child in his arms and went home.
Radha was Adhiratha's wife. Like her husband she was also pining for a child. When she saw the child she could not contain her joy. They brought up the child lovingly.
They named the child Vasushena. But the name Karna stuck to the child.
Karna grew up to be a boy. He was brighter than his friends, stronger and more determined. Even as a boy he liked bows and arrows. He was far ahead of others in archery and in marksmanship. Those who watched him were surprised. "He is so young, but already so intelligent and so sure of his aim!" they said.
Karna wished to improve his mastery of archery. He longed to become an outstanding archer and a great warrior. But he needed a teacher to train him, didn't he? He was looking for such a teacher.
Once when he was talking to somebody, the great Parashurama's name was mentioned. Karna asked:
"Who is Parashurama?"
"He is the son of the sage Jamadagni. Although a sage, he is an outstanding warrior.
"Who is Parashurama?"
"How is that?"
"He has gone round the whole country twenty-one times. No Kshatriya could vanquish him. When he lifts his bow the whole world trembles. He knows the intricacies of archery. Do you know what people say about him?"
"What do they say?"
"He is the very embodiment of the art of archery. He is God born on this earth to wipe out injustice."
When Karna heard this, admiration and respect for Parashurama grew in him. He wished to become the disciple of such a great man and learn archery only from him. But there was one nagging doubt: would Parashurama accept him as his disciple?
Karna made bold and went to the hermitage of Parashurama. He prostrated before him. Parashurama asked:
"Who are you, Child
"They call me Karna."
"Why did you come to me?"
"You are regarded as a matchless and outstanding warrior. You know the intricacies of archery. I wish to become your pupil. Do not reject me."
When he observed Karna's humility and love of learning, Parashurama took pity on him. As Parashurama desired Karna gladly demonstrated his skill. Parashurama was surprised at his dexterity andconcentration. He felt Karna's skill was beyond his years. He also felt that Karna deserved to be his pupil. He agreed to teach Karna the art of archery. Karna was overjoyed.
In those days only Kshatriyas and Brahmins were allowed to stay with and learn archery from a teacher.
Parashurama hated that Kshatriyas. Therefore he had decided to teach archery only to Brahmins. He thought Karna was a Brahmin. And Karna refrained from telling him that he was not a Brahmin.
Karna's training proceeded without any hindrance. He would grasp his teacher's instructions instantly. He would carry them out perfectly, at the first attempt. Thus Karna grasped the technique of archery from the teacher. And he served his teacher with affection. Quite some time passed
One afternoon Parashurama was somewhat tired. He rested with his head in Karna's lap. He fell asleep.
At that time a bee flew in from somewhere. Flying hither and thither it settled on Karna's thigh. Within a few minutes it began to bore Karna's thigh. Karna could not attempt to drive it away. Even a slight movement of his thigh would disturb his master. So inspire of the increasing pain Karna sat still. He thought that his suffering did not matter if the teacher's sleep was not to be disturbed. The bee continued to bore Karna's thigh. Blood began to ooze from the thigh. The blood touched Parashurama's cheek. He woke up. He was taken aback and said:
"What is this, child? Where did so much blood come from?"
Karna explained what had happened.
Asked Parashurama: "Did you put up with so much pain without a murmur?"
"The pain did not seem unbear able to me."
Parashurama was surprised. He looked at Karna from head to foot. He had all along assumed that Karna was a Brahmin boy. But a soft-bodied Brahmin could not have endured so much pain. Karna was not a Brahmin. Parashurama suspected strongly that Karna was a Kshatriyas. Angrily he spoke to Karna in a harsh voice:
"You, Karna I"
"Yes, master?"
"Tell me the truth, who are you? Have you not hidden something from me?"
"What have I hidden, I do not "Are you a Brahmin boy? Tell me, tell me the truth."
Karna did not reply. He stood silent, with his head bowed. He had assumed that he was really the son of Adhiratha whobrought him up, Adhiratha was a charioteer. He Karna, was a charioteer's son; neither a Brahmin nor a Kshatriyas. What answer could he give to his teacher? He was Miserable and filled with fear. Karna's silence convinced Parashurama that his suspicion was confirmed. Karna's modesty, courage, reverences for the teacher and love of learning- he forgot all in his wrath. "You, boy! Have you not deceived your teacher and received training? I have taught you the use of mighty weapons; but when you most need this knowledge may you forget it all!" So Parashurama cruelly cursed Karna.
Karna felt as if the ground on which he stood gave way. He had hurt his teacher's feelings. Besides he had acquired the curse by which he would forget all he had learnt, when he needed it next, he left Parashurama's hermitage.
The education of the princes, the Pandavas and the Kauravas, in archery had just concluded. A display of their skill had been arranged. This news reached Karna.
He went there, curious to see the exhibition of the skill of archery by the princes.
There was a large field outside the capital Hastinavati City. A stadium had been constructed there. In the center there was a huge arena. The rest of the stadium was for the spectators. There was a huge gathering of people to witness the display. Members of the royal family were also there.
The display began. The princes gave an exhibition of riding swift horses. They performed strangle feats of horse riding. They drove chariots in breath-taking ways. They sat on elephants and fought. They swung and brandished swords in various ways and showed a variety of tricks. Arjuna all by himself gave an effortless display of archery. He showed the use of mighty arrows, which amazed the audience. Everybody began to praise him: "There is nobody to equal Arjuna. He is supreme in archery."
At that time there was a sound of thunder near the door. The people turned to look. A youth was striking his arms as if in challenge and advancing. His radiance, his
well-built body, his tall stature, his bright armor and ear-ornament-all dumbfounded the people. A murmur rose on all sides:
The youth who had stepped forward was none other than Karna. When he came to the arena he turned towards Arjuna and said:
"You, Partha, do not think that there is no better archer than you and be puffed up with vanity. I shall display far greater mastery than your." So saying, Karna demonstrated his skill. He shot the Parjanya weapon into the sky and brought down rain; with the Vayavya weapon he checked the rain. By Agneya weapon he checked the rain. By Aneya weapon he kindled fire, and with the Varuna weapon he put it out. Into the mouth of a swiftly turning metallic figure of a boar he drove five arrows. He shot an Antardhana weapon, which made him disappear; swiftly he appeared in another part of the arena. After their display he took a mace and showed in how many ways he could wield it. People were astounded at this superb mastery. There was uproar on every side.
Hardly was the display over when Duryondhana raced to the arena, embraced Karna and said, "You matchless warrior, your Valor and knowledge of arms have overwhelmed me. Here, my kingdom and I are all yours. Tell me what you desire. I want to fulfil your wish at once."
In reply said Karna: "Maharaja, I do not want anything else. Your friendship and a bout of archery with Arjuna: These are the only two I want." Duryondhana said, "If so, your wishes are as good as fulfilled. From today you are my bosom friend; you are my equal. Need I fear anybody in future?"
All this talk provoked Arjuna who was nearby. Said he, "You Karna! We did not invite you but still you came. We did not ask you to speak, still you are talking too much, You have disturbed a quiet assembly. I will kill you at once. Be armed and get ready to fight."
Karna flared up at this and said:
"You Arjuna! This arena is not reserved for you. This is a public place. Whoever knows archery may exhibit it here. What is your objection? You are insulting me. Does a true warrior blabber? Come, fight. I will kill you with my arrow here and now."
Both of them got ready to fight. Dronacharya, who had trained the princes, had to agree to this. There was utter confusion in the assembly. Kunti, the mother of the Pandavas, fainted when she heard that Karna and Arjuna were to fight.
Kripacharya walked up to the arena. He knew well the rules of a duel. He said to Karna:
"Look, Karna. This person who is ready to fight against you is Arjuna. He is a prince of the race of the Moon, son of king Pandu. The person to oppose him should be his equal in all these respects. Whose son are you? To what race do you belong? Whose pupil? Tell it to the assembly."
Karna bowed his head overcome by a sense of shame and sorrow. 'I am the son of a charioteer. Therefore, it seems I belong to a low race. These people are making it a big issue. What does it matter who I am 7 Is not courage important for a man?' thought Karna. But that was the practice of the time. What could be done? Karna stood silent.When Duryondhana saw what had happened he was furious. "You Kripacharya, what are you talking about? You think that Arjuna is a prince and Karna is not, don't you?
Well, then, here and now I make Karna a king. He can then challenge Arjuna, cannot he?" So saying, he then and there crowned Karna, King of Anga State. The people shouted in approval. Karna was overwhelmed with gratitude. "Maharaja, how can I repay you for this favor?" he asked. Duryondhana said, "Karna, I value your friendship more than anything else. Let it always be mine" and embraced him.
Arjuna and Karna were about to fight. At that moment Adhiratha came there. He had just heard that his son had become a king. Karna went to him and saluted. Adhiratha lovingly embraced his son and blessed him thus: "Child, may your fame increase." Bhima who observed this understood that Karna was the son of Adhiratha. He said in a slighting voice: "You, Karna, are you not the son of Adhiratha, the charioteer? How can you be the equal of Arjuna born in the lunar race? Because he stands by the side of the sacred fire, does a dog get the right to eat the sacred offering? You are unworthy of the Anga kingdom; you are not even fit to be killed by Arjuna in a battle" so insulted Bhima. When Duryondhana heard this he became furious. He turned to Bhima and shouted: "Your words are not worthy of a Kshatriyas. For a Kshatriyas, valor is most important. How do Karna’s caste matters? Indra's mighty weapon, Vajraayudha, was forged out of sage Dadhichi's bone; Dronacharya was born in a s sacred pot; they say that Kripacharya was born in a handful of sacred grass. Why should birth matter? Karna was born with sacred earornament and armor. He shines like the sun. How is such a person unworthy of the kingdom of Anga? if anybody does not approve of the coronation of Karna let him fight against Karna and win."
There was commotion in the assembly. As it was getting dark, the assembly ended. People went home, praising Karna's prowess.
The friendship between Duryodhana and Karna grew day by day. Not for a moment did Duryodhana think that he was the emperor and Karna was his inferior. He was always in the company of Karna, He would tell him everything . When the officials employed for the purpose began to sing his titles he would stop them and make them sing Karna's titles, and feel happy. Every day he would give precious gifts to Karna. he valued greatly Karna's character, strength, honesty and generosity.
And Karna reciprocated. Duryodhana was dear to him as his own life. For his sake karna was prepared to offer his life. When others insulted by calling him the son of a charioteer, Duryodhana alone had treated him as his equal; so Karna had great regard and friendship for Duryodhana.
Karna was matchless in charity. So was he in carrying out his promise. Hundreds of poor people used to come to him. Wiht a smile Karna would give them money or clothes. He was called " Danashoora" ( outstanding in generosity).
The Kauravas and the Pandavas were sons of brothers. For the sake of the kingdom they were always at loggerheads. Whenever there was a quarrel Karna was on the side of Duryodhana, the eldest of the Kauravas. For him I must fight; in the future war I must kill his enemies, the Pandavas; in particular I must destroy the most powerful among them, Arjuna. That will please Duryodhana. Such were his thoughts. He had confidence in his ability to protect Duryodhana even if Bhisma, Drona and others let him down. Whenever Duryodhana was worried about the stronger of hte Pandavas, Karna would assure him. " Please do not worry. Only, let there be a war between ourselves and hte Pandavas, then you will see. I am going to crush them." Such words gave Duryodhana comfort and confidence.
The Kauravas and the Pandavas decided to wage a war for the kingdom. Krishna went to Hastinavati to prevent the war and bring about an agreement between the two. In the king's court he advised Duryodhana not to wage a war. Duryodhana did not heed the advice. When he left Hastinavati Krishna took Karna a little distance with him. He made him sit by his side in the chariot. Karna was diffident and uneasy. He thought: Krishna is a great man. Compared to him who is I-a low caste man! Why does he make me sit next to him? Krishna realised this. He said with a smile: -
"Karna, you need not be embarrassed. You think that you are the son of a charioteer, don't you? But no, it is not true. Adhiratha is your foster-father; not the real father.
You are Kunti's son. Kunti gave birth to you when she was not yet married. Fearing that people would blame her, she put you in a basket and sent you floating on the river Ganga. Adhiratha found you. Karna, you were born by the grace of the Sun God; you are a Kshatriyas, and the eldest of the Pandavas. As you are my aunt Kunti's son, you are related to me also. Come with me. I will take you to the Pandavas. Because you are the eldest among both the Kauravas and Pandavas, you will be the emperor of the Kaurava Empire. The Pandavas will also be very happy when they come to know that you are their eldest brother. Both Duryodhana and Dharmaraja will accept you as the emperor. There will be no war and thousands of people will escape death. You belong to a great family, but all these days you have been regarded as the son of a charioteer. Enough of such humiliation! You should live as the emperor obeyed by the Kauravas, the Pandavas and the Yadavas, but you have been begging alms of Duryodhana!"
On hearing Krishna, surprise, happiness and sorrow at once overcame Karna and his voice was choked. It was difficult to speak. Said he: "Krishna, you say that Kunti was the mother who gave birth to, me. That may be. However, she abandoned me at the instant of my birth. But as soon as he saw me Adhiratha lovingly carried me home.
Mother Radha has fed me with her milk. Adhiratha has treated me better than his own son. He has brought me up lovingly -and celebrated my marriage. No matter what you offer me, how can I leave the parents who have lavished such love on me? And now about Duryodhana. We are two bodies but one soul. When the whole world was mocking me as lowborn, he honored me. I went to him as a nobody, but he bestowed a kingdom on me. He has given boundless* friendship. How can I repay his debt? In declaring war on the Pandavas he has mainly relied on me. Shall I join the Pandavas and betray him? No, Krishna. Duryodhana is the master who gave me succour. He is my master, my all. I will stand by him and fight the Pandavas. If I win I shall have the satisfaction of having done my master's work; if I die I shall have glory. So I am resolved. Now let us part."
On hearing Karna, Krishna was inwardly full of admiration. "Bravo Karna! You are the very embodiment of loyalty to the master" thought he. But he took leave of Karna without showing his feelings.
Next morning Karna was offering prayer to the sun on the bank of the river. At that time Kunti came there. Krishna himself had sent her there. He had asked her to get a promise from Karna that he would not kill the Pandavas. The moment he saw Kunti, Karna respectfully touched her feet and saluted her. Said Kunti, "Child, you are my son. The Pandavas are your younger brothers. You have been thinking of your brothers as your enemies. You have vowed to kill them. Please do not do so. Leave the camp of the Kauravas. Join your younger brothers. Am I not your mother? Hear my words, Karna. Is it not the duty of children to carry out the wishes of their parents?"
Replied Karna: "Mother dear, you are my mother, true. But till now people have been ignorant of this fact. Those who looked after me and brought me up are also my parents. How can ' I give them up? This is the time of war, a time when all those who have eaten Duryodhana's salt must fight for him, not rearing death. For the last thirteen years I have enjoyed all princely privileges with him. It was his friendship that brought me everything. All these days I haven't once said a word about my brothers.
Suppose now, when war is imminent, I talk about them and go over to the Pandavas. The whole world will call me a traitor. Therefore my joining the Pandavas is unthinkable. But mother, I will comply with one of your requests. You desire that I should not kill the Pandavas. I agree; I will not kill any of the Pandavas except Arjuna. Whether I kill Arjuna or Arjuna kills me, it won't matter. In either case you will be definitely left with five children. Now let us part." With these words Karna saluted hismother and wished her good-bye.
The armies of the Kauravas and the Pandavas got ready for war. Bhishma became the Supreme Commander of the Kaurava army. He was listing the names of the important generals on his side and on the side of the Pandavas. In those days the mighty warriors used to rank as Atirathas and maharathas according to their prowess.
Bhishma said of Karna: "This Karna is not an Atirathas; he is not even a purnaratha. Even the teacher who taught him has cursed him. Also the natural armor and earornament he had at birth, he has presented to others. So he is not as strong as he used to be. Therefore, he is an ardharatha." So Bhishma ranked him disparagingly, far below the renowned generals. Dronacharya who was nearby also said: "Yes, yes, tie is very vain. Truly he is an ardharatha."
Karna who heard all this was very much pained. He was also enraged. Said he: "Bhishma, why do you hate me so much? I am innocent. Still you always prick me with such fierce words. You are the Supreme Commander. Is it right to sow conflict in the army? Who can say that you know your responsibility as the Supreme Commander?
You are extremely old; you are senile. That is why you talk like this. "He turned to Duryodhana and said: "Friend, this man thinks he is the only warrior in the world. Single-handed, I can destroy the Pandavas and their army. But when he derides me in this fashion, why should I fight? Even if I kill the enemies, this Supreme Commander will get the credit. I do not like it. In any case, he will be defeated in the war. After that I will fight and kill the enemies". So saying, Karna renounced the war and walked away.
The war began. As Suprem Commander Bhishma fought against the Pandava army for ten days. He killed thousands of soldiers in the Pandava army. Even the mighty Arjuna found it difficult to stop him. Having fought like this for ten days, Bhishma fell, with arrows stickling all over his body.
True- ' Karna was angry with Bhishma because he had insulted him. But when he saw Bhishma's valor his entire wrath evaporated. Such was his magnanimous nature. He would recognize and admire whatever was good and noble even in enemies. Bhishma's prowess won his admiration. He went to see Bhishma who was lying in a bed of arrows. "Bhishma, I am Karna; I have come to pay my respects to You," so saying he touched Bhishma's feet and saluted.
A flood of tears gushed out of Bhishma's eyes. He embraced Karna as a father would embrace a son. "Karna, you think that I hate you, don't you? No child, truly I have the slightest feeling of enmity towards you. I know you are a mighty warrior. You are like a god. In valor and munificence there is nobody to excel you. In the art of war you are the equal of Krishna and Arjuna. But you are very vain about your strength. I used to speak to you harshly to check your vanity, that's all", said Bhishma.
When Karna heard this voice was choked with affection. "Grandfather, if I have spoken to you harshly in anger or ignorance, please forgive biess and me me," said Karna.
Bhishma told him that Karna was Kunti's son and said: "Karna, it is not possible for the Kauravas to win this war. Join the Pandavas. Advise Duryodhana to stop the war.
And let all of you live peacefully."
"It is impossible for me to join the Pandavas. Success or failure-God will be done. I shall fight to the end on the side of Duryodhana; he trusts me and relies on me." So saying, Karna again saluted Bhishma and returned.
After Bhishma, Drona became the Supreme Commander of the Kaurava army. On the fourth day the battle was waged in the night in the light of torches. Bhima's son Ghatotkacha fought fiercely that night. He was the son of demon Hidimba. He was very valiant and also a wizard.
The Kaurava army reeled under Ghatotkacha's magic. Seeing this, Karna faced him. He had a formidable weapon called Vaijayanti, Which he had kept by to kill Arjuna. But now he used it against Ghatotkacha and cut him into two. The Kaurava army was overjoyed at the valor of Karna. On, hearing that Karna had used up the Vaijayanti weapon Krishna and Arjuna heaved a sigh of relief.
Drona fought for five days and died. Thereafter Karna became the Supreme Commander. On the very first day he belabored in battle Nakula, one of the Pandavas. He could easily have killed Nakula. But remembering his promise to kunti he spared Nakula.
Karna was eager to kill Arjuna. In every respect he had excelled Arjuna. But there was one big handicap. He did not have as brilliant a charioteer as Arjuna had in Krishna.
He sent word through Duryodhana and persuaded the valiant Shalya to become his charioteer. But this only harmed Karna. Shalya was the uncle of the Pandavas.
Although he had joined the Kauravas he loved the Pandavas. And the Pandavas had made a secret prayer to Shalya: "if ever you become Karna's charioteer, speak to him in such a way that he loses heart."
Shalya did so. He began to praise Arjuna highly before Karna. He spoke so as to imply that Arjuna was mightier than Karna. This threw cold water on Karna's enthusiasm.
Poor man! That was his misfortune. The charioteer who should have helped him was himself inviting defeat. Besides, that very day he had lost two sons in the battle.
But Karna did not lose heart. That day there was a fierce battle between himself and Arjuna. Karna fought in such a way that both armies were thrilled and full of admiration.
Krishna, Bhima and others were exhorting Arjuna: " What is this Arjuna, Your fighting is so lifeless? Karna is subduing all your weapons. Put more fire into your fighting,"
Do what he may, Arjuna could not gain the upper hand in the fight. So he used the Brahma arrow. At the Very sight of it, the Kaurava soldiers were terrified and began to run helter-skelter. But Karna was unmoved. Laughingly he used a mighty weapon and stopped it. Not content with that, he aimed the Snake Arrow, which he had kept by to use against Arjuna. Its blazing light lit up the whole battlefield. The Serpent, Arrow who raced like a leaping flame would have surely killed Arjuna. But in the nick of the moment Krishna pressed the chariot with his foot and depressed it by five inches. The Snake Arrow who should have hit Arjuna's head struck his crown. The crown tumbled down.
Thus the Snake Arrow was wasted.
Karna thought of shooting another mighty arrow. But on account of Parashurama's curse he could not recollect its use. Besides, the left wheel of his chariot got stuck in the ground. The chariot tilted. The horses stumbled. All dangers crowded on Karna as if there was no end to his misfortunes.
Karna turned to Arjuna and said: "Arjuna, the wheel of my chariot is stuck in the ground. Give me but a moment's respite. I will lift it and set right the chariot. Thereafter we may resume the fight. When I have got down from the chariot and I do not have the bow, do not shoot an arrow. That would not be worthy of a warrior like you.
Probably Arjuna would have agreed. But Krishna came in the way. "Arjuna, this is the right moment. If you hesitate now you cannot kill him later. Shoot your arrow without scruple," said he. Karna jumped down from the chariot and tried to lift the wheel with all his might. But he was unfortunate. He was a very strong man and he did his very best, but the wheel would not move. And even as he strove, obeying Krishna's advice Arjuna shot the Anjalika Arrow at Karna. The radiant Karna's head rolled down as if the sun tumbled from the sky.
Thus Karna sacrificed his life for the sake of his friend and master Duryodhana. He became the model of -truthfulness and loyalty.
Good writeup on Karna.He would not immediately die.His dharma protected his life.Krishna comes as a brahmin and asks him to donate all his dharmas.Even on his death and knowing well that he'll die if he surrenders it,he'll still magnanimously give it away.Krishna blesses that he'll reach the heaven of warriors.
After his death,all the other pandavas will come to know that he was their own elder brother.Yudishtra will weep unconsolably and curse Kunti.But,what is the use of crying now? :-(
Yes, Viggop, I am so much addicted to the character of Karna, and I will be till my Atma leaves this material body. :cry: :cry:
Any way, Yudishtra refuses to be King after all the Kauravas are dead, he was traumatised by the fact, the pandavs have killed their elder brother in an adharma way, but Lord Krishna convinces him to accept the throne
According to Hindu philosophy,the atma is undying.SO,Krishna will never feel sad for any death of the body.He does not bother about leading everyone to death as the death is for this body only.
That is why ,he leads everyone to the war.Some scholars have even accused Krishna to be a war-monger because he wanted the war and he did everything silently for the war and destruction therein
Of Course, the Atma never dies, the Atma takes birth and a new body according to its karma, be it its past life or present. Until this Atma differentiate Spiritualism from Maya (illusion) this material world, and surrender UN to the ParamAtma, Maha Iswar to attain Mukthi (salvation), it evolves around an indefinite loop of birth, old age, diseases and death. This is what has been happening for billions and billions of years.Quote:
Originally Posted by viggop
The best way around this is simple but HONEST devotion to the Maha Iswar and free our selves from the Maya Surrounding us
"viggop"
VATSALA-KALYANAM.. in Mahabaratham
===============================
//Balarama and his wife Revathy had a daughter called Vatsala...... When Balarama heard that Vatsala had married Abhimanyu with Lord Krishna's blessings was overjoyed and welcomed them to his palace//
This Story... also cinematised as ... Maya-Bazaar ...is Not an authentic one...May be a Fiction..
It does not form part of Mahabhaaratha
"Niranjana"
// Ok, a question from Indian Mythology..... What would you have done if you were Draupadi? Would you under any circumstance have married 5 men at a time? Would you be able to love each of them equally?//
Yes... if I were born as Draupadi ...I would have GLADLY married one and all the Pandavas...
... as Draupadi RIGHTLY DID.... especially under their typical circumstances in the forest
(1) Although Arjuna had several wives, none of them could accompany their husband in the forest... except Draupadi... because she was the common wife to all of them... So this was an advantage to a wife ensuring NON-SEPARATION from her Husband(s)
(2) I would have got maximum Enjoyment of life by having various types of five mighty Husbands of sorts... as Draupadi had... by means of authorised Marriage."
(3) Also I would have got maximum support from Five great warriors... whom I could proudly quote to others... as Draupadi did.. .but because she became over-proud of it to an extent of ARROGANCE..... which SINFUL Mind- sickness fetched her grave punishment...
... that even with the possession of five great warriors as Husbands... an innocent wife too can be seriously made helpless... if she lacks GOD-REALISATION.... captivated by sinful deeds
(4) Once mischivously Krishna created an embarassing situation for Pandavas in forest..... when Draupadi had to CONFESS.. that she desired to have Karna too as ONE MORE HUSBAND !!!
(5) Draupadi has another name as "Paanjaali"... since she hailed from the then Paanjaala-daesam... the present Punjab...
Sudhaama
I think Krishna tempts Karna that he can marry Draupadi provided Karna joins the Pandavas.Krishna ,being her closest friend,uses her as his pawn in the great game.
"viggop"
//Sudhaama ...I think Krishna tempts Karna that he can marry Draupadi provided Karna joins the Pandavas.Krishna ,being her closest friend,
uses her as his pawn in the great game //
No. Not So... Krishna never treated Draupadi so cheap ... Nor her Husbands Pandavas... nor Draupadi herself....
... but in fact all of them ESPECIALLY DRAUPADI ... had a burning Heat of Revenge within them... against Karna..
... that Draupadi was defamed MAINLY BECAUSE OF KARNA's instigation.... Duryodana implemented... IMMODESTY.. a grave injustice to an inocent Woman...and Queen Draupadi..
Even Krishna was much upset and terribly angry with Karna... for his such a shameful act caused by him.... even in spite of Karna being a NOBLE-MAN... (unlike his Friend Duroyodana ... an Embodiment of all the Inhuman-Qualities)
So it was beyond even a dream for Krishna to make Karna amicable with Pandavas...
...except to persuade Karna for his avoiding support to Adharma's Victory by means of his taking side with Duryodana.
We have to note that Krishna asked Kunthi to reveal her identity as the Mother of Karna as her son ... and also allowed Karna to know his brotherhood with Pandavas...
... but until Karna's death.. Krishna never allowed Pandavas or Draupadi to know of Karna's unknown blood- relation with Pandavas as their brother... another Son of Kunthi...
Because Krishna did fear of the probable development of complacency in Pandavas for antagonsing the sinful criminal Karna... especially in case of Draupadi...
.
After Kunthi's failure in making Karna to fall in line with Pandavas ... or at least to keep off the brotherly dispute....
Krishna met Karna..and persuaded on the dire necessity of fetching Victory for Righteousness ... and how Karna being the Son of SUN has more responsibility than others... and why it was unfair to support Duryodana ... the total shape of Evil-forces ....
... the highly meaninful discussions between them... brings out Karna's whole Heart... coupled with High Wisdom the ONE FACE of Karna... the Good side of his NOBLE character towards Righteousness....
Karna reveals to Krishna that he agrees with all the justifications on the Pandavas side...
...and that knowingly he has to fight against Dharma... as also against his own blood- related brothers....
The most important factor here is that he confidentially reveals to Krishna...
..."that he knew well that ultimately Pandavas will win" ...
...because Dharma is on their side... while Duryodana's side was Adharma...
... However... just for one man Duryodana's Sake... he would fight with whole-hearted sincere support for him... and even will die for him...
... as a Duty towards a Friend who fully trusts him... as also as a mark of Gratitude to Duryodana for support at his critical moments... when others all around condemned and rejected him at such helpless challenging occasions...
This shows the Greatness of Karna ... the GOOD side.by one Face... while his OTHER FACE ...was a CRIMINAL one....
Karna is a COMPLEX- CHARACTER. of Contra- distinction... Very difficult to define wholly and understand him well..
this the ONLY black mark in Karna the legend, enough to spoil his characterQuote:
Originally Posted by Sudhaama
KARNA the Complex of ... MAN & the BEAST ... TWO Opposite Faces....
"Sudhaama" :-- //... Draupadi was defamed MAINLY BECAUSE OF KARNA's instigation..//
"Raghu":-- .//... this the ONLY black mark in Karna the legend, enough to spoil his character //
ONLY Black-mark?....Now I will put forth the contra-distinctory Characters of his both the Faces ...
MANs Face on one side and the BEAST's Face on the Other side.....
(A) BEAST -Face... the CRIMINAL Karna...
(1) While Karna was basically a NOBLE-MAN with high Principles of EMULATIVE- IDEALS .... his intimate Friend, Duryodana was the opposite to his Propensity of Noblity by Character... in every sense.. ... being an embodiment of... Jealousy, Greed,Wickedness, Vengeance, Hatred, Hypocricy, Oppression, Domination, Selfishness, Tyranny and Injustice ... Mainly... JEALOUSY. and GREED
When Duryodana expressed to his Friend Karna.... his peaceless mind due to the Invincible advancement by valour and Fame of Pandavas outweighing Kauravas in one and all respecs .... Karna kindles such a negative Life-approach by a Sick-mind in Duryodana ..... by repeatedly advising him that they both would jointly avenge Pandavas ...
Was there anything to avenge or revenge or treat anybody as ENEMIES... just because he is more competent in any talent, outweighing all others... Was it not necessary for a Sportive-spirit there... instead of Battle- spirit? Other than exhibiting their better talent than all others.. what harm or injustice Pandavas had done to Kauravas? ... But one-sided Enmity of Duryodana sheerly out of Jealousy and Greed...
...on which Pandavas could not help.. Just for pleasing Duryodana... should they get defeated FALSELY in the Games... although they were capable of winning or performing as the best of emulative talents?
Karna could have advised Duryodana to beat out Pandavas... with a COMPETITIVE APPROACH... instead of COMBATIVE-APPROACH between the Brothers... because he knew about the values of Dharma, the Righteousness as also the suicidal trend of sick-mindedness by Jealousy, Greed and Wickedness... By which healthy persuasion, Duryodana might have got awakened on reconsideration through Positive- thinking.... at least..in the long run. Such a healthy aaproach from a trustworthy friend Karna would have definitely made an impact in the one-side minded Duryodana.... If not total reversal of Duryodana as topsy-turvy... at least it could have developed a healthy challenging attitude by means of Introspection, Self- improvementt and could have lead towards at least a check on his rash determination... to radically antagonise and finish the Pandavas at any cost.... Rather Karna was a party to FANNING, INSTIGATING AND JUSTIFYING... Duryodana's wicked Intention and Deeds... right from the beginning of his Friendship.
(2) Bheeshma was the most competent and authoritative Mediator between both the sides ... being the highly respected Senior-family-member as well as the high Intellectual, sincerely NEUTRAL AND IMPARTIAL.
Whereas by means of repeated surmisive and baseless blames, .Karna created Hatred and Disbelief in the mind of Duryodana towards Bheeshma... that the latter was partial, one-sided and highly favouring Pandavas to the radical detriment to Kauravas.
Consequently Karna and Bheeshma often had a bitter arguments resulting in an unending mutual-hatred... and whenever Duryodana was persuaded by his parents along with Bheeshma ... it was Karna... who UNNECESSARILY and UNCALLED FOR ... plunges himself in between.... thwarting the healthy endeavour of all others with the leadership of Bheeshma ... towards an amicable settlement ensuring peace in the country without war... ensuring eschewance of bitterness between the brothers.... caused UNREASONABLY AND UNJUSTLY... but only by SENSELESS AND RASH Antagonism to all such peaceful efforts towards development of amity...
Only by such NEGATIVE INSTIGATIONS by ONE AND THE SOLE person the trusted Friend of highly Noble-character basically...Duryodana became more and more ENRAGED that he was forsaken by all except his Friend Karna.... and developed more Hatred and Jealousy towards Pandavas.... as the MOST BITTER DIAMETRICAL ENEMIES... who werte trying tograb away his legitimate ownership on Kingdom... while Pandavas has no right in any manner.
(3) Pandavas were prepared to get contented with just at least Five Houses only as their due share ... which offer was conveyed by Krishna their Ambassador.. representing on their behalf... Such a proposal was acceptable and supported by all (while Duryodana was the silent spectator initially).. Karna alone vehemently opposed it... saying Pandavas had no legal claim nor moral right to even stay within Duryodana's Legitimate Kingdom. Enthused by such instigative encouraging and justifying words from his trustworthy Friend, ... Duryodana declares that he would not allow to Pandavas even a Pin-head space of property ... which was exclusive to Kauravas only.
Thus all the peaceful efforts came to an End... because of one single sole interference of KARNA ONLY..
... To Continue..
can somebody clarify :
Dhridrashtra was elder to Pandu and was as such the rightful successor to be the King....However, since he was visually impaired...Pandu was crowned the king....to act in his elder brothers place.....so he was just an acting king.....
Being Dhridrashtra's eldest son, was Duryodhana not entitled to be crowned as the next king?........How does it matter that Yudishtra was born ahead of Duryodhana..........
Also , by lineage, Yudishtra and other other Pandus were not the bloodline of Pandu..... In that case how can they lay any claim for ruling the country..
Vir
discrimination against the visually challenged was not against the law then!!!
Atleast duryodhana could have given back the Indraprastha which pandavas built after they came back from dwelling in the forest for 14 years.he could have kept the hastinapura to himself but he refused to give even a pin head of land.
Greed and jealousy will always lead to downfall.
In fact, according to the prevailing Dharmashastras of that time, a son born blind, deaf or otherwise impaired was automatically disinherited!
Dear Sudhama Sir,
Yes, what Karna did was adharma in our view, ie supporting his evil friend Duryodhana, that was Karna's dharma according to him.
he thought, to pay Duryodhana for bringing him up, he would sacrifice his life, no matter what, and that is exactly what he has done. so according to him he has accomplished his dharma.
this why I find dharma so confusing :? :? :? , what is dharma to one may be an adharma to others, I don't find any concrete platform for dharma.
Could you please enlighten me on this. :?
thank you
"vir"
// Dhridrashtra was elder to Pandu and was as such the rightful successor to be the King....However, since he was visually impaired...Pandu was crowned the king....to act in his elder brothers place.....so he was just an acting king....//.
Pandu was not crowned as an ACTING-KING... but as a King himself... because Dhrithrashtra lost his chance... as also his lineage heirs ... as per the then existed Dharma-Sasthra ... However Sasthras were NOT RIGID on the matter but gave enough room for flexibility of options.
// Being Dhridrashtra's eldest son, was Duryodhana not entitled to be crowned as the next king?........How does it matter that Yudishtra was born ahead of Duryodhana..//
In fact Mahabharatha fight was in between the TWO GROUPS OF HEIRS... one by the latest Monarchy and the other Ex-Monarchy.... Both have their own points of justifications...
That is why... on the advice of Krishna... Pandavas were prepared to share half of the Empire equally amongst Kauravas and Pandavas... as the right of Pandu on one side and the same equally for Dhrithrashtra on the other.
// Also , by lineage, Yudishtra and other other Pandus were not the bloodline of Pandu..... In that case how can they lay any claim for ruling the country..//
In the Property or Kingdom ownership... such consideration is immaterial. .. especially when there was no competiotor for Pandavas... as the Pandu's born children.
The most interesting Basic-factor in Mahabharatha is... that behind every odd or untoward development ...
... there was a hidden mistake or blunder by one of the Key- Persons ... Good or Bad.... without which there would not have been any Epic of Mahabharatha at all.... a Warning Lesson to Humanity. eternally
One such best example of the BADs...is... the INCONSISTENCY of Bheeshma.
At the earlier juncture...Bheeshma turned down the proposal to make Dhrithrashtra as the King...because of his physical handicap...
... and so his younger brother Pandu.. was enthroned (Pandu had NO legal-right.. to occupy the throne... being younger to Dhrithrashtra)
But while the similar consideration came once again... after Pandu's death... Dhrithrashtra's Physical-Handicap was ignored and was made as the SECOND KING... after his younger brother Pandu..
.. But Bheeshma found out a solution.... by making Dhrithrashtra's brother Vidhura ( an intelluctual warrior) as the King's adviser...
Whatever it may be ... both the Resonings are INCONSISTENT. as well as INTRA-CONTRADICTORY...
If the former justification was Right and Proper... the latter one cannot be so since contradictory... and Vice-versa.
The starting point for all the subsequent confusions was this BLUNDER. of RIDICULOUS Self-contradiction... by the Wise Senior Leader of the Heirarchy.
But most of the Scholars do not contribute to such a Negative view on Bheeshma, but interpret his actions and thoughts in a Positive Healthy way... on which we will see later.
"viggop"
// discrimination against the visually challenged was not against the law then!!! //
No Question of Discrimination... It is the matter of COMPETENCE TO EFFECTIVELY PERFORM THE DUTY of a King / Emperor.... more than the factor of his BIRTHRIGHT.....
Because.. Peoples welfare shoud not be in jeopardy due the Kings Handicap... either physically or by competence to be the Proper Ruler.. to carry out all his duties efficiently.
Pandu was preferred over Dhrithrashtra...by the Advisory-committe of Scholars... considering all the relevant factors in totality... not only the Visual handicap of Dhrithrashtra.
There have been several cases in the History and Puranas... where the Eldest brother was not enthroned... but one of his younger brothers... on consideration of the comparative suitabilty amongst different brothers and such heirs... to rule over the Kingdom... safeguarding the reputation of the Ancestry... defending the country confronting the probable attacks from the Enemies.. and so on.. as applicable to a Ruler.
// Atleast duryodhana could have given back the Indraprastha which pandavas built after they came back from dwelling in the forest for 14 years.he could have kept the hastinapura to himself but he refused to give even a pin head of land.//
Because of Karna's Strong objection ... to allow Pandavas to reside within the Duryodanas country... even though the nation of birth for Pandavas too.
Pandava Vana-vaasam... 14 years? .... No.. That was in Ramayana. But in Mahabharatha.. it was 13 years... (12+1 )
//Greed and jealousy will always lead to downfall.//]
Yes... with any amount of SUPPORTING- MIGHTS ... one may acquire..!!
There we can see the God's Hand working behind and against such nefarious Forces... especially as the RULER
"Raghu",
// what Karna did was adharma in our view, ie supporting his evil friend Duryodhana, that was Karna's dharma according to him….. he thought, to pay Duryodhana for bringing him up, he would sacrifice his life, no matter what, and that is exactly what he has done. so according to him he has accomplished his dharma.…. I find dharma so confusing :? :? :? , what is dharma to one may be an adharma to others, I don't find any concrete platform for dharma…Could you please enlighten me on this. :? //
Karna’s sincere “ Sense of GRATITUDE “ .. is No doubt quite laudable
..And his spirit of INDEBTEDNESS as well as the accrued sense of Duty of repayment towards all the benefits he got from his Duryodana ... .There is NO ADHARMA in it
Even in his Sacrifice towards such a NOBLE-CAUSE on one side ..OK
But at WHAT COST?... There arises the Question of DHARMA- SANGATAM .. a Clash between Two sorts of Dharmas. Which one to be PREFERRED?
There only Karna. SLIPPED and committed a BLUNDER of ANTAGONISING Dharma
Can anybody kill his own Son. UNJUSTLY?....just to save his Sheep ?
Dear Sudhama Sir
Of course, there is no adharma in itQuote:
Originally Posted by Sudhaama
Even in his Sacrifice towards such a NOBLE-CAUSE on one side ..OK
that was exactly my point, how does one decides what is dharma in a situation like that (Dharma Sankatam), does the situation, environment and circumstances play a part in it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sudhaama
sorry, but who killed, his own son? :shock:Quote:
Originally Posted by Sudhaama
"Raghu"]
// Sudhaama :-- But at WHAT COST?... There arises the Question of DHARMA- SANGATAM .. a Clash between Two sorts of Dharmas. Which one to be PREFERRED?//
// Raghu :-- that was exactly my point, how does one decides what is dharma in a situation like that (Dharma Sankatam), does the situation, environment and circumstances play a part in it? //
It is very Simple… Keeping the Mind (Heart) and Wisdom at equal plane of Yardstick we have to measure the Pros and Cons of a Problem evaluating on the basis of One after another Dharma … one after another imagining ourselves in the other man’s position also… so to say by the Moral-approach. We can easily get an Answer… which Dharma-criteria… is preferable under a particular situation.
Some such situations do arise in our day to day life to a lighter or heavier degree time to time.
For Example…imagine..
You’re the responsible G.M of a Major Company… suddenly you get a call from your boss at another Country … to start immediately by next flight… for attending a Crucial-meeting… for which all concerned feel your personal presence and participation… is quite imperative and inevitable
Whereas on the same day… you have already planned to receive your prospective Son-in-law from Overseas …a long awaited guest… of highly competitive offers…
What will you do… since you are caught in between Two parallel Dharmas… one the Official-duty and the other your Family duty… especially your daughters Future…her married life… under such dilemma… depending upon the circumstances you may decide.by preferrence.
But if thesituation is such that in one of the cases… some eventuality of Sin is attached… that one has to least preferred… How ?
An Orphan boy got his life shaped by a … Rich man…. Which lead him to become the Senior Police officer at the same Town… So the Boy takes a Vow that he will pay back to the Rich man… for the Gratitude in his future.
But surprisingly…One day that Rich man is caught Red-handed by the Police-Officer… with a clear proof for his anti- national activities… a serious Crime deserving the worst punishment for any Criminal… What should the Boy do ?
Should he forego his Police-duty and pay his gratitude by helping a Criminal to escape?... A case of Dharma-Sangatam.. In brief…
(1)Swaya-Dharma: One’s own interests… the Basic, Elementary Dharma…
(2)Griha-Dharma: Duty to Family interests, Wife and Children – Higher to (1)
(3)Pithru-Dharma… Duty to Parents… Greater than 1 & 2
(4)Karthavya-Dharma:- Duty to Profession… Greater than.. 1 to 3
(5)Samaaja-Dharma … Duty to the Society… Greater than 1 to 4
(6)Raja- Dharma: Duty to Motherland.. Living Country & Rulers :- Greater than 1 to 5
(7)Sathya / Deva-Dharma… Moral-Code. .Duty to God : GREATEST of all
// "Sudhaama… "There only Karna. SLIPPED and committed a BLUNDER of ANTAGONISING Dharma… Can anybody kill his own Son. UNJUSTLY?....just to save his Sheep ? //
// Raghu :-- sorry, but who killed, his own son? :shock //:
It is only an Analogy… imagining one’s own Two sorts of Possessions under jeopardy… when he has an option to retain only one amongst the two…either the Sheep or his own Son… which is GREATER for him amongst the Two.?
The next important Questions
(1) Just because Duryodhana gave the Deserted … Forsaken. Karna a Helping hand … a Succour at his crucial moments of dire crisis .
Did Duryodana deserve to be Karna’s Friend with the Consequence of Paying a HEAVY PRICE by Self-sacrifice and the further worst for Karna ?
(2) Why Duryodana supported and helped Karna... contrary to all others?... Was it for rendering Justice to him?.. Kind-hearted?... Sense of Friendship?
Dear Sudhama Sir,
Your posting on different types of Dharma was highly informative, thanks a lot
Duryodhana never deserves friend like KarnaQuote:
Originally Posted by Sudhaama
Never, it is for his own selfish reason, he wanted some one to defeat Arjuna as Defaeting Arjuna was like Defeating the Pandavas, he found the perfect warrior for that, hence he used the situaution wisely, was Shakuni behind this wise decision, I don't think duryodhana was wise or cunning enough to make decisions like this :shock:Quote:
Originally Posted by Sudhaama
Sudhaama Sir
Thanks for your posting on various types of dharmas.Nice to know that Swaya dharma is the least important
I did not know there were this many types Dharmas' :roll: :shock:Quote:
Originally Posted by viggop
Lord Krishna has been cursed by a Rishi called Uttang, did any one know this, after the war is well and over, Lord Krishna Returns to dwarakai, on the way he encounters couple of demons, after destroying them, he hears the Meditation vibration of Rishi Uttang, so the lord stops and pays him a visit, the Rishi gracefuly recieves the lord with great love and affection, but the rishi suddenly found out that Lord did not stop the Mahabharatha battle, he curses the lord, the rest tobe continued on Monday.
I will tell you what the curse is after watching Ramanand Sagar's Krishna today,....
Sudhama sir,
so when you are in a dharma sankatam, you choose higher type of dharma, right?
Which category did Karna's dharma fall into?
thanks
"Raghu"
// "viggop".... Sudhaama Sir...Thanks for your posting on various types of dharmas.Nice to know that Swaya dharma is the least important//
// I did not know there were this many types Dharmas' ://
NOT .only..." There.... WERE... "... "But... THERE ARE ...". Existing Now too...
.. 32 (Thirty-Two) Varities of Dharmas... prescribed by the Vedic- Dharma- Sasthras.. which were sincerely adopted by the Ancient Indians ... several thousands of years back itself...
... while the rest of the world... is understood to be comparatively far behind in Culture as well as Human Emanicipation and Advancement... ..
... by which News...the Advanced standard of Indian Culture OVERWHELMIMG .... all other World Human-Cultures can be understood and discerned properly....
... so appreciated by the Non-Hindu overseas Research Scholars
... Especially they wonder that such an advanced Healthy mind Indian people of yester-era had ....
.. so that there is also one Dharma.. exclusively towards NURTURING other Creatures like Ants, Snakes, Crow and such other petty creatures as well...
...apart from patronising... Nature... like pouring water to at least one SHADE OR FRUIT-GIVING Tree every year...
... .a..." LIVE AND LET LIVE POLICY".... by Co-Operation with Nature.
Out of such prescribed Dharmas I have mentioned here only the Seven -Dharmas...the Salient ones... relevant to the context.
Dharma means ... ARHAM ... in Tamil, the high and uncompromisive HUMAN-VALUES ...
... which has been accentuated ... all through the various Tamil- Scriptures.. irrespective of Religion... more than the Overall Indian Vedic Culture.
Raghu
Lord Krishna wanted the war to happen.He did everything for that.What was the curse of the rishi on Krishna? I'm curious to know.
Friends,
I have one sincere request. Please do not pass remarks on the 2 epics - Ramayana & Mahabharatha. They are not just stories but acts that are ingrained in the faith of the devout hindu.
Qs like whether Lord Rama was right in klling vaali from behind a tree, whether Lord krishna did the right thing by covering the Sun & assisting Arjuna in killing abhimanyu's slayer are superfluous. Every act has a reason.
Dr.Rajagopa;lachari rightly remarked that these epics are like mother's milk & beyond any human questioning.
I hope the readers consider the sentiments of many others like me & desist from passing judgements.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanjay
epporuL yAr yAr vAik kEtpinum - apporuL
meypporuL kANbathaRivu
Continuing ....Quote:
Originally Posted by viggop
Rishi Uttunk,was about to curse Lord Krishna ,as the rishi got angry by the fact the lord being able to stop the war did not, Rishi being a great scholar, forgot about the truth for split second and became controlled by human emotions like ego and anger, due to this he forgot about the 'Maya' concept and that the Lord is standing infron of him, and he was about to curse, but Lord Krishna explains about dharma, karama and destiny, the rishi realised his false ego and surrendered unto the lord, and he asks the lord, he wishes see the Vishvaroopa of Lord Vishnu that Arjuna once enjoyed. The lord agrees to this and shows his Vishvaroopa and asks the Rishi, if he wishes anything for him. The Rishi replied, I want water for the community as the were was extreme water shortage, so lord grants him the boon and departs.
But the lord wanted to play a little trick on the Rishi, as he knew that Rishi Uttung was still under the influence of maya, as he often had false ego. So Lord Krishna asks Indran to disguise him self as a dirty old man and take some water to the rishi, so indran went with water, but the rishi would not even look upon his face as the rishi only saw the dirty perishable maya body of this atma, Rishi refuses to drink the water,and virtually chase the dirty man, suddenly he realised his false ego and his attachment to maya ,and begs mercy from Lord Krishna and lord Krishna forgives him and remove the maya from the rishi's mind and continues the journey back to dwaraka, there is another meaning will encounter with Balram in dwaraka, ..to be continued
Continuing....
Lord Krishna arrives at Dwaraka, he has been greeted with a tremendous reception by Balram, as Balram runs towards the lord Krishna to hug him, Lord Krishna has been confronted by yet again by some demon, Balram confronted the demons and killed the demon (NOTE, THE DEMONS DID NOT HAVE ANY WEAPONS, when they were killed)
This was a trick played by Lord Krsihna, to teach Balram anna a lesson.
Remember How Balram was annoyed and was fuming by the fact that Bhima killed an unarmed Duryodhana, Balram has done exactly the same thing, which Bhima has done before.
Ok, here is the tricky bit, was there any dharma in Balram's and bhima's act, regardless of the fact that their opponent was devil, evil, ...etc?
"Raghu"
// Remember How Balram was annoyed and was fuming by the fact that
.... "Bhima killed an.... "unarmed"... Duryodhana" //
It is NOT CORRECT to say that Krishna wanted a War.. and so he machinised towards such a mass-Disaster by weaponry.
In fact Krishna tried his level best to bring out an amicable settlement... but failed..
.. On which Balarama too had to cut a sorry figure before Krishna... accepting his failure.. in spite of His Greater Voice on both sides.... especially with Kauravas... including the King Dhrithrashtra.
Krishna... as a last endeavour to avoid war...asked one by one of Pandavas and finally Draupadi... to suggest the suitable way to AVOID WAR...
Each one said different ideas ... suggesting to AVOID war...
... except... three... Arjuna, Bheema and Draupathi... FAVOURING WAR...
Yudhistra tried to convince them.. but miserably all failed... and had to put down his face .. on...
... the HOT WORDS OF DRAUPADI... that all because of him ... and no more COWARDICE..
And also...It is NOT CORRECT to say that Duryodana was UNARMED ...while he was hit by Bheema.
Two important factors ... we have to note here.
(1) It was the Conventional practice... by Yuddha Dharma...
... that at the last stages... after tiring the Enemy by series of Offensive attacks... (similar to initiation of a Game with Fast-bowling ... to be followed by Spin-Bowling)...
... the Next step used to be ...to weaken the enemy one after another... by eliminating his supports and allied strengths... like... losing his Chariot, Crown... his Defence-arms... then his Bow or some such weapon... with which... the combat is conducted...
... Finally making him a NIRAAYUDHA-PAANI (Armless)... as a Silent-Gesture of challenge...
... "Oh my Enemy... I have slashed down all your supporting strengths... Now Tell me are you going to continue the Fight... or accept the DEFEAT... and Surrender ... or RUN-AWAY... exhibiting your gesture...
... that you are accepting the Defeat to-day... but will come back next day fully armed to fight with greater Strength...
... while such a gesture of CHALLENGE from a defeated Enemy... may be accepted by the opponent... or Not.. since left to the Victor's discretion.
... But without conveying any message by any sort of gesture... but tries to retain back his strengths... or by any sort of Restoration or Revival...
... AT THE BATTLEFIELD... it is a challenge... which will be countered by the opponent... even though the Enemy be UNARMED..
... Since the Purpose of War itself... is either to DEFEAT OR ELIMINATE the opponent....
there is No place for Mercy or Sympathy or Humanitarian-spirit in the War-field.
that is the Reason... wars are always eschewed, avoided and averted by Wise people.
That is why Bheeshma could not defend in favour of his side... on the criticism of Duryodana...
... about the attack by Arjuna on Karna as well as by Bheema on Duryodana.
(2) During Bheema-Duryodana Fight...Why Krishna waited until last ...
... and SUDDENLY INTERFERED... at what Stage?... Why Then?
if Krishna would not have interfered...
Duryodana's last moment CHEATING Bheema... would have lead to the
... UNJUST... DEFEAT AND DEATH of Bheema... as innocent VICTIM...
.. of Duryodana's FINAL ATTEMPT... Cowardice FOWL-GAME. What was it ?
Dear Sudhama sir thanks for the perfect explanation.
I have question for you, Lord Krishna & Arjuna goes on a pilgrimage to calash to do a thalami to wards the PARAMATHAMA Maha Iswar and get a boon (Weapon) to slay one warrior, This warrior had been granted a boon by Parama Iswar that he will be immortal (except on some condition), Gadotkaja goes to inform Duryodhana in his military camp, that Lord Krishna & Arjuna have gone to Kailash to get a boon from Maha Iswar to slay this warrior? Duryodhana laughed at Gadotkaja, insulted him and sent Gadotkaja back.
In the next day, during the battle, lord krishna plays a trick yet again, he turns day into night using his sudharsana chakaram, so Duryodhana & this other warrior were overjoyed by the fact, that Arjuna could not kill this warrior, out of this excitement, Duryodhana tells this warrior to come out of hiding and he does, and when he does Lord Krishna instructs Arjuna to shoot the arrow (Boon from Maha Iswar) at this warrior and carry his head towards his father and drop it on his hands/laps, so Arjuna does this. And the warrior's father blows into pieces.
who was this warrior? Was it King Jeyatrada? :?
Raghu
I think it was jayatrada.This king got a boon from Shiva that he should be able to keep at bay other pandavas except Arjuna for 1 day in a battle.he does this successfully when Abhimanyu is inside the chakravyuham and other pandavas cannot save abhimanyu.So, Arjuna vows to kill jayatrada or kill himself by next day evening if he cannot succeed in killing jayadratha.
When kaurava camp comes to know this vow of arjuna,they try their best to protect jayatrada from hands of arjuna and succeed till Lord Krishna steps in and does the trick of causing the eclipse.
There is one interesting thing here.There was another eclipse just before the war and Krishna causes this brief eclipse during the war.this has been used by some scholars to find out the date of mahabharatha.When in astrological history did 2 eclipses occur within few days of each other(i dont know the excat date difference). Since,this can be scientifically determined,some people tried to find the date of the mahabharatha war using this information in the epic
Oh yes, I remeber this from the Tamil Film Karnan, when two rishis are chanting vedic mantras along the river side, Duryodhana approaches shakadeva to ask a date to commence the war in which Victory will be for them, here Lord Krishna plays a trick for the eclipse to occurQuote:
Originally Posted by viggop
My Dear Mr. Raghu,
One Request... Please read this Thread... right from the Beginning... as if you are A STRANGER reading for the first time.
Please tell me then... what you feel... about this Thread-matter you have made...
Do you find it interesting to read continuously... as the Topic on ONE SUBJECT.?
Don't you find it ..... as simply a BEGGAR'S SHIRT... without any Cogency or Continuity... or Mutual- Relevance...my dear Friend?
Jumping here and there... HAPHAZARDLY... AT RANDOM.. What is this CONGLOMERATION ?...
(Sorry for my BLUNT AND OPEN-CRITICISM... although with a healthy Intention as YOUR WELL-WISHER....(Repeat: "Your Well-wisher"))
Dear Mr. Raghu,...Is this a... THINNAI-PAECHU... or ... OOR- VAMBU- MADAM .. or Thunhukku- Thoranham... or REALLY a WORTHY FORUM?
Sorry to say... You are LEADING OTHERS also ... in your peculiar way of Scattered- presentation to the VIEWERS.... making them MAD
You are discussing about Karna... in the midway you leave him in the lurch and jump to Balarama... then that too left half-done... then over to Bheema... left incomplete... and then Krishna & Eclipse.. left midway ... then Lord Parameshwar... Ohm Nama-Sivaaya !!!! !!! !!!! !!!! !!! !!! !!!
In spite of my SPECIFIC REQUEST.?.... Pinpointing this Lacunae...
... in this BEAUTIFUL FORUM you have rightly started and WELL- PARTICIPATED by several Hubbers...
... in a VERY INTERESTING MANNER.... by individual post ONLY...
I have raised some questions ... at several places... wherever you have DRAGGED ME...
... and I am waiting for your REPLIES... from one and all the Hubber- participants...
... thus it will become INTERESTING in all respects.. ENSURING COGENCY.
After which I will Reply to those Questions I had raised ... on Karna, Krishna.. Duryodana... and so on.
I hope You or others will not mistake me... but will take in a HEALTHY- SPIRIT.
Dear Sudhama
Thank you very much for your not so NICE words, I am very serious about this, you will have to accept that my knowledge on this subject is very limited unlike your broad knowledge, I am just answering questions and postings bits from the greatest epic, It will be imposible for me to start the mahabharath story from the begining to end, perhaps you should write that, so all of us can learn from it, I just post my questions here for which I don't know the answers.
I seriously started this topic on an INNOCENt thought, well if you have been offended by this, then I am terribly sorry, as that was never the intention.
thanks