Is tamil derived from Sanskrit

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nedunchezhiyan

ÒðÀ¡ïºÄ¢, Å÷½õ ¦º¡ü¸ÙìÌ ¦À¡ÕÙõ §ÅÕõ ¾ó¾¨ÁìÌ ¿ýÈ¢ Bis Mala


¸£ú측Ïõ ¦º¡ü¸Ç¢ý §Å÷î ¦º¡ü¸Ùõ ¸ÕòÐõ ¾ÕÅ£÷¸Ç¡?

¾¢øÄ¡½¡
jathiswaram (º¾£ÍÅÃõ; ¸¢Ãó¾ 'º')
«Äâôâ

¿ýÈ¢
À½¢×

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Thil was actually an expletive, a syllable sound without meaning occupying the interlude., correspondingly known in kavithai as “asaichchol” thil + aanaa = thllaana. Aaku> aana (from peyarechcham).

Jathiiswaram refers to notes interspersed with jathis ( rhythmic footwork one after another)
Thaam-thi-thai shortened to tha-thi and corrupted to chathi then Sanskritized to jathi.


Chura(ththal) (=flowing) > sura > suram > Sanskritized to swaram..


Alaarippu means “expanded dance performace” from alar(thal) = malarthal. = expanding (also flower blooming)

Alarppu > allaarippu.

¾¢ø ±ýÀÐ þ¨º¿¢¨È×ì¸¡É «¨ºî¦º¡ø. þôÀÊ ´Ä¢ìÌÈ¢ôҸǢĢÕóÐ ÀÄ ¦º¡ü¸û §¾¡ýÈ¢ÔûÇÉ.

¸¡¸¡ ±ýÈ ¦º¡øĢĢÕóÐ ¸¡ì¨¸, ¸¡¸õ ±ýÈ ¦º¡ü¸û Åó¾É. «Ð§À¡ø ¾¡ÇìÌÈ¢ôÀ¡¸¢Â ¾¢ø¾¢ø ±ýÀ¾¢Ä¢ÕóÐ ¾¢ø + ¬É(Ð) = ¾¢øÄ¡É¡ ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø.

ºøºø ±ýÀ¾¢Ä¢ÕóÐ ºÄí¨¸!!

¾¡õ¾¢¨¾ > ¾¾¢ > º¾¢ > ƒ¾¢ > ƒ¾£ŠÅÃõ. (º¾¢ + ÍÃõ)

ÍÃõ > ŠÅÃõ from ÍÃò¾ø.

«Ä÷¾ø - ÁÄ÷¾ø.

«Ä÷ôÒ > «Ä¡Ã¢ôÒ.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by karuvaadu

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bis_mala

Mr Karuvaadu, make a collection of such words with opposite meanings for fun!!

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Madhu can also mean alcohol, isn't it?

My knowledge in Tamil is extra orordinary poor and I remember of certain things from my vast memory immediately when you come up with intial words.

matham (Tamil?) has two different meanings for example!

matham is religion as well as elephant running wild!

Just a comment:
Some religious humanoids also mathaththaal matham pidiththavarkaL (Well said isn't it?)
I am once again suprised at Tamil! :thumbsup:

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You are right. Busy. will revert later Mr Karu!!

¾í¸û À¾¢ø¸ÙìÌ ¿ýÈ¢ Bis Mala

¾í¸Ç¡ø º¾¢÷ ±Ûõ ¦º¡øÄ¢ý §Å÷¸û ¾ÕÅ£÷¸Ç¡?

Àþ ¿¡ðÊÂõ, º¾¢÷ ±Ûõ ¾Á¢ú ¬¼ÖìÌ þð¼ Ò¾¢Â ¦ÀÂ÷ ±É «È¢óЧÇý. Àþ ¿¡ðÊÂò¾¢ø ÅÕõ Àþõ ÁüÚõ ¿¡ðÊÂõ §À¡ýÈÅüÈ¢ý §Å÷¸û ¾ÕÅ£÷¸Ç¡?

¿ýÈ¢ À½¢×

'§¸¡ò¨¾' ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø ¸Îï ¦º¡ø ±ý¸¢ýÈÉ÷, þ¡ø þÂøÀ¡¸§Å ¸Î了¡øÄ¡? «øÄÐ ¦À¡Õû ¾¢Ã¢À¨¼ó¾¾¡? þ¡øÄ¢ý §Å÷ ¾Õţá?

¿ýÈ¢ À½¢×

//¾í¸û À¾¢ø¸ÙìÌ ¿ýÈ¢ Bis Mala

¾í¸Ç¡ø º¾¢÷ ±Ûõ ¦º¡øÄ¢ý §Å÷¸û ¾ÕÅ£÷¸Ç¡?//C

//Àþ ¿¡ðÊÂõ, º¾¢÷ ±Ûõ ¾Á¢ú ¬¼ÖìÌ þð¼ Ò¾¢Â ¦ÀÂ÷ ±É «È¢óЧÇý. Àþ ¿¡ðÊÂò¾¢ø ÅÕõ Àþõ ÁüÚõ ¿¡ðÊÂõ §À¡ýÈÅüÈ¢ý §Å÷¸û ¾ÕÅ£÷¸Ç¡?//

Àþõ ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø: þáÁ½ò¾¢ø ÅÕõ Àþ ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø¾¡ý. þÐ þô§À¡Ð "þó¾¢Â¡" ±ýÀ¾üÌ ®¼¡¸ ÅÆí¸ôÀθ¢ÈÐ.

§Á§Ä þáÁý ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø "þ÷" ±ýÈ þÕû ÌÈ¢ìÌõ ãÄò¾¢Ä¢ÕóÐ Åó¾Ð ±ýÀÐ ¸¡ðÊÔû§Çý.

«Ð§À¡ø, Àþ ±ýÈ ¦º¡øÖõ "ÀÃò¾ø" (ÀÃó¾ ¿¢ÄôÀ̾¢) ±ýÈ ¦º¡øÄ¢ø þÕóÐ Å󾧾. ÀÃó¾ ¿¢ÄôÀ̾¢¨Â ¬ûÀÅÛõ Àþ ±ÉôÀð¼¡ý. þÐ ¾Á¢Æ¢ø ÁÚѨÆÅ¡¸¢ «ý Å¢¾¢ ¦ÀüÚ, Àþý ¬Â¢üÚ.

Àþ ¿¡ðÊÂõ ±ýÀÐ þó¾¢Â ¿¡ðÊÂõ ±ýÛõ ¦À¡ÕÇ¢ø þ¼ôÀð¼ ¦ÀÂá¸Ä¡õ.

ºÐ÷ ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø:

¾¡õ¾¢¨¾ -> ¾-¾¢ > º¾¢ > º¾¢÷ > ºÐ÷

Rendering music(al notes) with dance footwork.

Thanks, will return.

Mala: Bharatha was explained by a dancer as standing for bhavam,raagam and thaaLam. You differ from that. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rajraj

Mala: Bharatha was explained by a dancer as standing for bhavam,raagam and thaaLam. You differ from that. :)

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That was an excellent explanation ex post facto.

Perhaps I can share with you the following "explanations"

There are 3 political parties in Singapore, where I work. They are PAP, WP and SDP. These stand for: People's Action Party, Workers' Party and Singapore Democratic Party.

Someone coined a joke as follows:

PAP = Pay and Pay. (referring to heavy taxation policy in some respects).
WP = why Pay? (This party was opposing the fiscal policies of the govt)
SDP = So Don't Pay!! ( This party may have told people to default paying taxes ).

There were many others : like:

SIA - Singapore International Airways / Sex in the Air!!

MAS - Malaysian Airline System /Mana Ada System (Where is the
system)

The word Hindu is said to be a Persian word. but in this thread, an earlier post said him+thu (one who denies "himsai" ) So the exponent said it was a Sanskrit formulation.

Thus it may be an ex post facto explanation, which coincides.

If it is Bha - Raa - Thaa (all elongated), does it fit in?

It is said the word Pakistan was coined in that manner using first letters of state names.

No Mala! I think you should read some books on Bharatha natyam and see what they have to say. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nedunchezhiyan

'§¸¡ò¨¾' ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø ¸Îï ¦º¡ø ±ý¸¢ýÈÉ÷, þ¡ø þÂøÀ¡¸§Å ¸Î了¡øÄ¡? «øÄÐ ¦À¡Õû ¾¢Ã¢À¨¼ó¾¾¡? þ¡øÄ¢ý §Å÷ ¾Õţá?

¿ýÈ¢ À½¢×

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"kOththai" is noted as having been used in Tolkaappiyam. Means a blind person.

kOthu - defect. useless.

kOththai < kOthu + ai (suffix).

Usage in certain areas may consider this word not refined but it is not inherent in the word itself.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rajraj

No Mala! I think you should read some books on Bharatha natyam and see what they have to say. :)

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mm. ok, raj! it's good to read .It is always good to take into account all contrary opinions. I shall. Thanks. :)

¿ýÈ¢¸û ÀÄ Bis Mala

¯ò¾Ãõ ±ýÀÐ ¾Á¢Æ¢Öõ ¯ñÎ, «¨¾ ºÁü¸¢Õ¾õ ±ýÚ ºñ¨¼ìÌ ¦¸¡ïºô §À÷ ÅÕ¸¢ýÈ¡÷¸û. ¯ò¾Ãõ ±ýÈ ¦º¡øÄ¢ý ¾Á¢ú «Ê ÑÉ¢¸¨Ç ¦º¡ýÉ¡ø Á¢¸×õ ¯¾Å¢Â¡¸ þÕìÌõ. «Ð ±ùÅ¡Ú ¾Á¢Æ¢Ä¢ÕóÐ ºÁü¸¢Õ¾òÐìÌ º¨Áì¸ôÀ𼨾Ôõ «òмý þ¨½ò¾¡ø Á¢¸×õ ¿ýÚ.

¿ýÈ¢, À½¢×

¸ø ±ýÈ ¦º¡øÄ¢üÌ §ÅÚ §Å÷¸û ¯ñ¼¡? ¸ø ±ýÀÐ ÀÄ ¦À¡Õû ¾Õõ, ¸ø ±Ûõ ¦º¡øÄ¢ý ãÄõ ¾Õţá?

¿ýÈ¢, À½¢×

Ó¨ÈôÀÊ «¨Á¡¾ ¦º¡ü¸û,
þÆ¢ºÉ÷ ÅÆìÌ ( slang and usage of the uneducated etc),
¦ºöÔû ®ð¼ò¾¢üÌ ¯¾Å¡¾ «øÄÐ ¦¾¡ýÚ¦¾¡ðÎ ÒÄÅ÷¸Ç¡ø ÅÆí¸ô À¼¡¾ ¦º¡ü¸û,
¦¸¡î¨º ¦Á¡Æ¢
Åð¼¡Ã ÅÆìÌ
Ìè¯ìÌÈ¢,
þ¼ì¸÷î ¦º¡ü¸û

þôÀÊ ²ü¸ò ¾¸¡¾ ¦º¡ü¸û ±ýÚ ´Õ ¦ÀÕõ Àðʨħ ¾Á¢úô ÒÄÅ÷¸û ¨Åò¾¢Õó¾¡÷¸û.

¦¾ÖíÌ ¿¡ðÊø þ¼õ ¸¢¨¼ì¸¡¾ ¦Àñ ¾Á¢úôÀ¼ò¾¢ø ѨÆóÐ ¦À⠿ʨ¸ ¬ÉÐ §À¡ø, þíÌ ¾ûÙÀÊ ¦ºöÂô Àð¼¨Å ¸¢.À¢. 400 š츢ø ÓبÁ ¦ÀüÈ ºí¸¾¦Á¡Æ¢Â¢ø (skrt) ºì¨¸ §À¡Î §À¡ðÎ ¯Ââ ¿¢¨Ä¨Â ±ö¾¢Å¢ð¼É. ²Î ¦ÀÂ÷òÐ ±Ø¾¢ÂÅ÷¸û ÅÆ츢ø þøÄ¡¾ ºí¸¾î ¦º¡ü¸ÙìÌô À¾¢ø þò¾¨¸Â ¦º¡ü¸¨Çô ¦ÀöÐ ¦Á¡Æ¢¨Â §Áý¨Á ¦ºöШÅò¾É÷. À¢ýÒ «¨Å ¾Á¢Æ¢ø Ò¾¢Â ¾Ì¾¢Ô¼ý ѨÆó¾É. ¾Á¢úô ÒÄÅ÷¸Ùõ ²üÚ즸¡ñ¼É÷.

¦º¡ü¸Ù¨¼Â ãÄí¸¨Ç µÃ¢Õ ¿¡ð¸Ç¢ø ¦¾Ã¢Å¢ì¸¢§Èý.

//¸ø ±ýÈ ¦º¡øÄ¢üÌ §ÅÚ §Å÷¸û ¯ñ¼¡? ¸ø ±ýÀÐ ÀÄ ¦À¡Õû ¾Õõ, ¸ø ±Ûõ ¦º¡øÄ¢ý ãÄõ ¾Õţá?//

¦Á¡Æ¢»¡Â¢Ú §¾Å§¿ÂôÀ¡Å¡½÷ ¬ö§Å¡ð¼ò¨¾ì ¸ÅÉ¢ò¾¡ø, þÐ ´Õ Íð¼Êî ¦º¡ø ±ýÚ ¦¾Ç¢Å¡Ìõ.

¯ø > Ìø > ¸ø ±ýÚ §Å÷¡ø ÅÇ÷¸¨Çì ¸½¢ì¸Ä¡Ìõ. ¦º¡ü¸û Á¡È¢Â¨Áó¾Ð§À¡ø, ¸ÕòÐì¸Ùõ ´ýȢĢÕóÐ ´ýÚ §ÅÚÀðÎ ÅÇ÷¨¼óÐ ¦º¡ü¸Ùõ ¦À¡Õñ¨Á ¦ÀüÈÉ ±ýÀ¨¾ «Å÷ Å¢Ç츢ÔûÇ¡÷.

Ìø > Ìñ > ÌñÎ = ¸ÉÁ¡ÉÐ.
Ìø > ¸ø = ¸ÉÁ¡ÉÐ.
Ìø > Ìý > ÌýÚ = ¸ÉÁ¡É Áñ «øÄÐ ¸øÄ¢ý ¾¢Ãðº¢.

¸ø ±ýÀ¾ý «Êô¦À¡Õû ¾¢Ãðº¢. «¾ý ÅÇ÷ô¦À¡Õû ¸ÉÁ¡ÉÐ, ¸ÊÉÁ¡ÉÐ ±ýÀÐ.

¸ø ±ýÀÐ ¾Á¢ú¡ø. ¸øÌÄŠ ±ýÈ þÄò¾£ý ¦Á¡Æ¢î ¦º¡øÖõ ¸øÌÖìÌ ±ýÈ ¦¾¡¼Ã¢É¢ýÚ Åó¾Ð ±ýÀ¨¾ «¸Ã¡¾¢ò ¦¾¡ÌôÀ¡Ç÷ (lexicographer) ¿¡.º¢. ¸ó¨¾Â¡ À¢û¨Ç Å¢Ç츢ÔûÇ¡÷.

¸ø (Å¢¨É¡ø) - ¸üÚ즸¡û ±ýÛõ ¦À¡ÕÇ¢Öõ ¸ø (¦ÀÂ÷¡ø) stone etc ±ýÛõ ¦À¡ÕÇ¢Öõ ¬ÇôÀθ¢ÈÐ. À¢È ¦À¡Õû¸Ùõ ¯ûÇÉ. þÅüÚû ÌÈ¢ôÀ¢¼ò ¾Ìó¾Ð: ¸øÖ¾ø - §¾¡ñξø ±ýÀ¾¡õ.

§ÁüÜÈ¢ÂÅüÚû ²Ðõ ³Âõ þÕó¾¡ø ±ØÐí¸û.

Thanks for asking. Will revert to continue. vaNakkam.


Note: I could not find previous posts of others relating to "kal". Do you know whether there were /was any?

Mr Neduncheziyan

//¯ò¾Ãõ ±ýÀÐ ¾Á¢Æ¢Öõ ¯ñÎ, «¨¾ ºÁü¸¢Õ¾õ ±ýÚ ºñ¨¼ìÌ ¦¸¡ïºô §À÷ ÅÕ¸¢ýÈ¡÷¸û. ¯ò¾Ãõ ±ýÈ ¦º¡øÄ¢ý ¾Á¢ú «Ê ÑÉ¢¸¨Ç ¦º¡ýÉ¡ø Á¢¸×õ ¯¾Å¢Â¡¸ þÕìÌõ. «Ð ±ùÅ¡Ú ¾Á¢Æ¢Ä¢ÕóÐ ºÁü¸¢Õ¾òÐìÌ º¨Áì¸ôÀ𼨾Ôõ «òмý þ¨½ò¾¡ø Á¢¸×õ ¿ýÚ.//

ºí¸¾¦Á¡Æ¢Â¢ø skrt ¯ ±ýÀÐ ¯ûÇÐ. þ¾üÌô ÀÄ ¦À¡Õû ¯ûÇÉ ±ýÈ¡Öõ, ÍÕì¸Á¡¸ : "this very person [your worshipper] invokes you &c." ÁüÚõ also , further ; on the other hand ±ýÚ ¦À¡ÕûÀΞ¡¸ì ÜÈÄ¡õ. þÕìÌ §Å¾ò¾¢ø: [RV. ii , 20 , 4] , him I praise , Indra , him I sing) ±ýÚ ÅÕÁ¢¼í¸Ç¢ø þ¡ø ÅÕ¸¢ÈÐ. ¬É¡ø «Ð ÓØÅÐõ ÓýÉ¢¨Äô ¦À¡ÕÇ¢ø ¾Á¢Æ¢ø ¯ûÇЧÀ¡ø þø¨Ä.

¾Ã(õ) ±ýÀÐ ºí¸¾¦Á¡Æ¢Â¢ø surpassing , conquering ; excelling , crossing , passage RV. ii , 13 , 12 ; viii , 96 , 1 Mn. viii , 404 and 407 Ya1jn5. (ifc.) ÁüÚõ impassable, excelling , ±ýÈ ¦À¡ÕÇ¢ø ÅÕ¸¢ýÈÐ.

uttar (as in uttar predesh,) u +tar ±ýÚ ¾É¢Â¡¸ô À¢Ã¢ò¾¡ø ¦À¡ÕÇ¢ø¨Ä.

¯ò¾Ãõ ±ýÈ ¾Á¢ú¡ø ¯ ±ýÛõ ÓýÉ¢¨Äî Íð¼Ê¡¸ô À¢Èó¾ ¦º¡ø ¬Ìõ.

¯óÐ > ¯òÐ > ¯ò¾Ãõ (¯òÐ+ «÷ +«õ). þó¾ô¦À¡ÕÇ¢ø §ÁÖûǨ¾ ¯ó¾¢ò ¾¡í¸¢ì¦¸¡ñÊÕôÀÐ ±ýÚ ¦À¡Õû.

compare: º¢óÐ > º¢ó¨¾, º¢ó¾¢, º¢ó¾¨É.
º¢óÐ > º¢òÐ > º¢ò¾÷.


¯óоġÅÐ, Óý¦ºøÖ¾ø, §Áü¦ºøÖ¾ø ӾĢÂÉ. Óý ¿¢üÀÅÉ¢ý ¦À¡Õ¨Ç "¯ý ¦À¡Õû" ±ý¸¢§È¡õ. "¯ý" ±ýÀÐõ ÓýÉ¢¨Äô¦À¡ÕÇ¡Ìõ.

¯ + ¾Ã× = ¯ò¾Ã× = Óý ¾ÕÅÐ. ¬¨½. given by superior before you can act on it.
¯ + ¾Ãõ = that which presents itself before or as prior or afterwards.' height, response, north,

¯ + Ð = ¯Ð (compare: «+Ð, þ+Ð).

In Tamil. the words are connected to "¯". In Sanskrit it (u) is not clearly showing the concept of "front", "up" distinctly. Therefore it is clear it is a Tamil word.

If you have any further things to ask on this word, pl do not hesitate.

Best regards vaNakkam.

///Note: I could not find previous posts of others relating to "kal". Do you know whether there were /was any?////

ÁýÉ¢ì¸×õ, «Ð ÀüÈ¢ ¡ý «È¢§Âý.


¾í¸û Å¢Çì¸òÐìÌô À½¢Å¡É ¿ýÈ¢¸û.

Žì¸õ

nivR ±ýÈ Å¼¦º¡øÖìÌ Â¡Ð ¦À¡Õû ±ýÚ ¸¡ñ§À¡õ.

to turn back , stop RV. ; to turn away , retreat , abstain or desist from , get rid of ; to fall back , rebound R. ; cease , end , to be withheld from , to turn downwards , let sink (the head) ; to turn back i.e. shorten (the hair) ; to lead or bring back , reconduct , return AV. ; to turn away , avert or keep back from to give up , abandon , suppress , with, to restrain , curb , check , suppress , restrict

§ÁüÌÈ¢ôÀ¢ð¼ ¦º¡ø, ¾Á¢ú : ¿¢ø > ¿¢Ú > ¿¢ÚòÐ ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø ¦¸¡ÊÅƢ¢ĢÕóÐ «¨Áì¸ôÀð¼ ¦º¡ø ¬Ìõ. þ¾üÌ §ÁÖõ Å¢Çì¸õ §¾¨ÅôÀ¼¡Ð ±ýÚ ¿¢¨É츢ý§Èý.

¿¢Ú (¿¢Ú¨Å ¦ºö) ±ýÀÐ, ¯ñ¨Á¢ø Ðġ째¡Ä¢ý ÁÚÒÈõ ¿¢ü¸î ¦ºöÐ À¡÷ôÀÐ ±ýÀÐ ¦À¡Õû. ¿¢ø ±ýÈ «Ê¢ĢÕóÐ ¿¢Ú ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø À¢È츢ÈÐ.

ÀÄ ¦º¡ü¸¨Ç ´ôÀ¢ðÎ þõÁ¡üÈí¸¨Ç «È¢Â§ÅñÎõ.

ºÃ¢ ´Õ ±ÎòÐ측ðÎÁðÎõ ¾Õ¸¢§Èý

¿ø > ¿Ú. (¿Ú Á½õ: ¿øÄ Á½õ). «¨¾ô§À¡ø¾¡ý ¿¢ø > ¿¢Ú ±ýÀÐõ. ¬É¡ø, ¿¢Ú ±ýÀ¾¢ø ¿¢ø ±ýÈ ¦º¡øÄ¢ý ãÄô¦À¡Õû Á¨ÈóÐ ¿¢ü¸¢ÈÐ. ¬É¡ø ¿¢ÚòÐ ±ýÛõ§À¡Ð, Á¨Èó¾¢Õó¾ ¦À¡Õû Á£ñÎõ ¦¾Ç¢Å¡¸¢ÈÐ.

¿¢Ú ±ýÈ ¦º¡øĢɢýÚ À¢Èó¾ ż¦Á¡Æ¢ ÅÊÅõ¾¡ý nivR ±ýÀÐ.

Dear Mala,

when I look at your avatar, I indeed do because you have minimized it to all it counts, I am set back to 1978, about 13 or 14, riding on bicycle after the school girls singing nadai annai peedu, idai minnal koodu - could have been by SP Balasubramaniyam. :lol:

You changed it because of pooja shankar?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Saya Setju

Dear Mala,

when I look at your avatar, .........................bramaniyam. :lol:

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Hi! I liked it: ladies should be trim and fit. Must exercise everyday. This is the message I get from the avatar. In your case, it has brought you back to 1978!! Effective in more than one way.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Saya Setju

You changed it because of pooja shankar?

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Well, received a message from God that it's good time to give it up. Cannot ignore God,,,,,

I think I need a change of too. My avatar is losing its lustre!

¿ðΨÅò¾ ¸õÀò¾¢üÌ, ¦¾öÅî º¢¨Ä¸ÙìÌ «øÄÐ º¢ÅÄ¢í¸ò¾¢üÌ ±ñ¦½ö §¾öòÐ «À¢§º¸ï ¦ºöÅÐ ÅÆì¸Á¡Â¢Õ󾾡ø, "¦¿ö§Åò¾¢Âõ"
±ýÈ ¦º¡ø ±Æġ¢üÚ. þ¾¢ø ¦¿ö ±ýÀÐ ¿£ ±ýÚ ¾¢Ã¢ó¾Ð.

¦¿ö¨ÅòÐ > ¿¢§Åò¾¢ > ¿¢§Åò¾¢Âõ. > ¨¿§Åò¾¢Âõ.

þÐ ¾Á¢ú ãÄí¸Ç¢Ä¢ÕóÐ §¾¡ýÈ¢ þó¾¢Âò Ш½ì¸ñ¼ÓبÁìÌõ ¦ÅÇ¢¿¡Î¸Ç¢Öõ §º¨Å ¬üȢ즸¡ñÎûÇÐ.

Hi,

Today I came across some words formations in Tamil - English/ Hindi(Sanskrit) and would like to know the roots.
The word Kol in Tamil is almost the same as Kill in English, Please let me know the possible root for this word and your reasons.
The Word Murder in English is very close to the Sanskrit word Maranam, as per Mr. Masilamani, this sanskrit word is of Tamil root, which means something like Maram tree, as this is the state of a dead man. This means the Word Murder is also one of the detrivative of tamil word... your opinion please..

Thanks,

===========================
Very good question! According to legal history William the Conqueror imposed a fine on those who committed culpable homicide and he called this fine “murdrum”. He does not appear to have left any note as to where he took this word from. The word murder came from murdrum.

Conflicting with it or adding to it, the English etymologists looked for a connection to the word and eventually pointed their fingers at OE morthor and Old French murdre. The Germanic had a strikingly similar term and that was identified.. That was as far as they went. Sanskrit has not been adverted to by these persons. Sanskrit does not show it to be a fine imposed. Latin has “mortua”. Latin was invented language of the Roman Empire.

Tamil term: madi > mari. (to show you the full words ).

-da and –ra interchangeable.


(mar) > mari
( mar) > maram

mari + aNam (suffix) = maraNam.

cf: kattu + aNam = kattaNam. and others.

Only Tamil/ Dravidian has the verbal root "mari". In MalayLam, it is still in common (home) use. Madi is in literary usage in Tamil. According to Western linguists themselves, if a language has the verb and the other languages have the nouns formed therefrom, the one having the verb should be the source language. Now apply this rule. Result?

I will write about "kill" later. Now pressed for time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bis_mala

The Germanic had a strikingly similar term and that was identified

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Mord -> murder
Ermorden -> to murder
toeten -> to kill
tot -> dead
Tod -> Death

late (German) -- kol-lutal (Tamil). kill
wolte (German) -- ozithal (Tamil) die

comment: nil.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Chappani

Hi,

The word Kol in Tamil is almost the same as Kill in English, Please let me know the possible root for this word and your reasons.

Thanks,

---

DevaneyappaavaaNar in 1952 (if I remember correctly) published few hundred words which sound very close or as you say: "almost the same as". Others too have published lists of such words.

PaavaaNar theorized that Tamil is the first mother of (all) other languages. "Muthal thaai mozi". Many quarters were displeased.

However, now Western linguists are working on a Proto-World Language theory, which might also be able to put an end to the claims made by people such as Tamils (one example in their minds, though not the only example).

They believe Proto-World Language Theory and the dispersion of people from somewhere near the Promised Land would also satisfy Christian doctrines and the relevant story in the Bible.

I have in one post pointed out in the History Section how the word makan (son) has close- sounding words in many other languages. Even mac (as in MacDonald). (This “mac” was pointed out by Western researchers).

Caldwell himself surfaced many homonyms between Tamil and other world languages.

Study of words (etymology) has been used in philology to construct language theories and then to reconstruct lost history. (For example, the Aryan Migration Theory).

CONCLUSION: Either Tamil is the mother of other languages or one of the earliest descendants of the Proto-World Language which is being presently constructed or reconstructed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bis_mala

late (German) -- kol-lutal (Tamil). kill
wolte (German) -- ozithal (Tamil) die

comment: nil.

---

Is English derived from Tamil Aangilam?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by indian224080

Is English derived from Tamil Aangilam?

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Do you want to claim that English is an indian language?

This question from an MS of CS is telling everything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by indian224080

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bis_mala

late (German) -- kol-lutal (Tamil). kill
wolte (German) -- ozithal (Tamil) die

comment: nil.

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Is English derived from Tamil Aangilam?

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To ascertain whether X came from Y language, linguists have their own means and methods, regardless of who X is and who Y is and where they live. Once those linguistic means and methods are satisfied, it is up to the people of other relevant disciplines to further handle the matter.

Just like if the radiologist finds and states in her report that you have cancer, it is then up to the physician to treat you, the surgeon to operate on you, the nurses to take care of you etc etc., If treatment etc., are not successful and you died, then the pathologist will do a post mortem and issue an autopsy report!!

If you are somebody, the newspapers will publish on you. Otherwise you will be just taken to the crematorium.

Of course, the common man in the street can express shock that you died. But for the rest of the others I named above, it is just another case.

Mr Indian -- "you" I do not mean you!. It's just a way of narrating.

ż¦Á¡Æ¢Â¢É¢ýÚõ ¾Á¢Æ¢ø ¾òºÁî-¦º¡øÄ¡¸ ....²üÚ즸¡ûÇôÀð¼Ð "¸Äºõ"... ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø
±ýÚ º¢Ä÷ ¾ÅÈ¡¸ô ÒÈõÀ¢¾üÈ¢ ÅÕ¸¢ýÈÉ÷.

¸Äõ > ¸ÄÂõ. (¸Ãõ §¾¡ýÈ¢ ¦º¡ø ¿£ñ¼Ð)

þý¦É¡Õ ±ÎòÐ측ðÎ:

¬Äõ -- ¬ÄÂõ. (¸Ãõ §¾¡ýÈ¢ÂЧÀ¡ø)

¸Ä ±ýÀÐ Áñ¸ÄóÐ ÌÂÅý ¦ºöŨ¾ì ÌÈ¢ôÀÐ. ¸Ä ±ýÈ ¦º¡øÄ¢üÌô ÀÄ ¦À¡Õû¸û þÕó¾É ÀÆó¾Á¢Æ¢ø, ±ýÚ ¦¾Ã¢¸¢ÈÐ.

¸Ä+«ý = ¸Äý.
¸Ä+«õ = ¸Äõ
¸Ä +« +«õ = ¸ÄÂõ.

¸ÄÂõ -- ¸Äºõ.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bis_mala

ż¦Á¡Æ¢Â¢É¢ýÚõ ¾Á¢Æ¢ø ¾òºÁî-¦º¡øÄ¡¸ ....²üÚ즸¡ûÇôÀð¼Ð "¸Äºõ"... ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø
±ýÚ º¢Ä÷ ¾ÅÈ¡¸ô ÒÈõÀ¢¾üÈ¢ ÅÕ¸¢ýÈÉ÷ .

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¡÷ «Å÷? :roll:

¯í¸û ¾¡ò¾¡-¾¡§É ¦º¡ýÉ¡÷! :)

«Åâ¼õ ¦º¡øĢŢ¼ §ÅñÊÂо¡§É!

¸ÄÂõ = ¸Äºõ ±ýÚ! :D

"stranger"

quote="bis_mala"] //ż¦Á¡Æ¢Â¢É¢ýÚõ ¾Á¢Æ¢ø ¾òºÁî-¦º¡øÄ¡¸ ....²üÚ즸¡ûÇôÀð¼Ð "¸Äºõ"... ±ýÈ ¦º¡ø
±ýÚ... º¢Ä÷ ¾ÅÈ¡¸ô ÒÈõÀ¢¾üÈ¢ ÅÕ¸¢ýÈÉ÷//

¡÷ «Å÷?//

// ¯í¸û ¾¡ò¾¡-¾¡§É ¦º¡ýÉ¡÷! «Åâ¼õ ¦º¡øĢŢ¼ §ÅñÊÂо¡§É! ...¸ÄÂõ = ¸Äºõ ±ýÚ! //

¾¡í¸û ¸ÕОüÌ Á¡È¡¸ ±ÅáÅÐ §ÅÚ-¸ÕòÐìÜȢŢð¼¡ø.....«§¼ÂôÀ¡... ±ùÅÇ× §¸¡ÀÓõ ±Ã¢îºÖõ ÅÕ¸¢ÈÐ!!!!!!..... stranger, bis_mala «ýÀ÷¸ÙìÌ....

³Â¡ º¡Á¢ stranger «Å÷¸§Ç.... ±ÉÐ ¾¡ò¾¡¨Å측ðÊÖõ ¾¡í¸û º¢Èó¾-«È¢Å¡Ç¢ ±ýÚ ÜÚ¸¢È£÷... «ùÅÇ×¾¡§É?.... ²üÚ즸¡û¸¢§Èý. «¾üÌô§À¡ö ±ý§È¡ Á¡öóÐ Á¨ÈóЧÀ¡öŢ𼠫Ũà ţñ-ÅõÒìÌ þØôÀ¡§Éý?..... ¸üÚ즸¡Îí¸û ÌÕ§¾Å¡.... À½¢§Å¡Î ¸üÚ즸¡û¸¢§Èý.... ¬ÚÅÐ º¢Éõ.

deleted]

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sudhaama

³Â¡ º¡Á¢ stranger «Å÷¸§Ç.... ±ÉÐ ¾¡ò¾¡¨Å측ðÊÖõ ¾¡í¸û º¢Èó¾-«È¢Å¡Ç¢ ±ýÚ ÜÚ¸¢È£÷... «ùÅÇ×¾¡§É?

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±ý «ýÀ¢üÌõ Á⡨¾ìÌõ ¯Ã¢Â ;¡Á¡ «Å÷¸§Ç!

¯¹¸û ¾Á¢Æ¢ø À¢¨Æ ¦º¡øÄ ¿¡ý ±ýÉ ¿ì¸£Ãá?!

¿£í¸û ±ÎòÐ ¦¸¡ñ¼Ð§À¡Ä ¿¡ý ¦À¡Õû ÜÈ ÓÂÄÅ¢ø¨Ä!

ÁýÉ¢Ôí¸û ÍÅ¡Á¢ þó¾ «È¢Â¡ÌÆó¨¾Â¢ý ¾Å¨È! :D

[tscii]//Tamil-Culture was the most ancient.... as well as the PRIME-CULTURE OF MANKIND.... ever adopted all over the world...

... and the TAMIL LANGUAGE IS THE FIRST LANGUAGE OF MANKIND... ever spoken in comparison to multiplicity of savage-culture and their Audio-symbolic means of communications, UNWORTHY TO BE NAMED AS ANY LANGUAGE...

.. But they were the origins for several Great Classical-Languages like Latin, Greek, Hebrew etc.

By stating so.... neither those foreign Historians nor the Tamilians mean to under-rate other Cultures or Languages of the Global arena... ever in the History of Mankind... //

::deleted::

Friends,

We do not have a Single Lit. in Tamil which does not has impact of Vedas and right from Thoklkappiyam dated to 50BCE TO 50CE, and Tirukural all are influenced by Vedas.

Tamil as per Linguists of International Reputation- has heavily burrowed around One third words from Sanskrit and half that from Pali and Pragrit. So let us keep this in mind.

Devapriya.

/

Quote:

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/We do not have a Single Lit. in Tamil which does not has impact of Vedas and right from Thoklkappiyam dated to 50BCE TO 50CE, and Tirukural all are influenced by Vedas//.

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All the verses in Tolkappiyam are just chantings to invoke the power of god Indra and Brahaspathi. It is in fact a copy of Rig Veda!! This Sangam lit is just a collection of mantras to perform yaga.
What else can these be?

Quote:

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//Tamil as per Linguists of International Reputation- has heavily burrowed around One third words from Sanskrit and half that from Pali and Pragrit. So let us keep this in mind.//

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Of

course, of course, Tamils did not borrow but we burrowed all our words from them. Do not forget, during Sangam time, most of our Tamils had wives from ganges area, of international reputation. These words came from those wives.

Can anyone explain me the roots of the word Oor(place).
I find many North Indian places named as Oor like Jaipur. Does this mean the Tamils were there in North India originally?

Good news for everybody !!!

Here is the fact which says Indus Valley Belongs to Dravidians !!!!

http://www.vikatan.com/jv/2006/may/07052006/jv0602.asp

I am sorry, paste this Microsoft Word and choose font as Vikatan_TAM (you can download from vikatan.com)
http://www.vikatan.com/Vikat_tm.ttf

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