app,Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
vizhiyilae - rework.
No app. enna oru azhagana paatu.
flute, guitar , violin spb voice nu ella
original sound oda azhaga irukara paatai - Kandipa
IR REWORK seiya kudadhu ...
IR melayae enaku kobam vandhudum.
Seidha tune kae oru pechu - IR ku different aga tune seiya
theiryalai. ahdan ipadi rework seiyarar nu.
80s songs - All are Original sounded. So andha padalai
IR kandipa use panna vendam, idhan ennoda opinion.
For 2010, we actually do not know what is in store.
The situation is no different to the one when 2009 started..
If you can recollect, There was no news about PAA, not sure about release of NaanKadavul and even PR release was not clear.
we were only looking at Valmiki, and Baghyadevatha then..
IR seems to be in good form and hopefully we will be treated the same way as in 2009.
raagas,
I think that serious music lovers are facing the same dilemma that the photographers and photography enthusiast faced when digital photography was introduced and tools like Adobe Photoshop became available. Given these powerful tools, it was getting difficult to say which was an original photo and which was 'photoshoped'!! The question became, who can be called a good photographer?
I think the same dilemma exists in the minds of many music lovers. And I believe no one is talking about real / acoustic vs 'unreal' instruments. I think what everyone is meaning is the difference between 'fully composed' music and 'composed cum arranged cum bought' music. It becomes difficult to compare the output of music directors like Raja who predominantly stick to 'I will compose everything' school versus all others of today who are OK with taking in commercially available loops / samples in their music. Ofcourse, the general public does not care about this distinction and vote with their money for whichever music they like. But for some serious listeners, this does stand in the way of assessing the relative merits of various composers.
One way this can be surmounted is for the composers to clearly mention which parts of their music were taken from which commercially available sample / loop etc. As we know even the name of the person that comes in and claps twice is mentioned in the inlay card nowadays and it is laudable. If the music directors will also mention their sources it will be even more laudable. But as you know, giving credit to your music sources is a very different ball game from giving credit to musicians.
Actor Vinoo Chakravarthy, who is in self exile because of an injury sustained in a car accident, will announce his first directorial venture in Jan 2010 and keen to have IR's music for that movie.
raagas,
I do not buy your argument that you cannot distinguish between less and more and that it is subjective. A commercial loop that runs throughout the song is more and a small sample which appears briefly is less. My definition :) I am not debating on which is good or bad but saying that even if you use a small sample it is the same as using a loop throughout the song seems to be too much of a stretch and is taking things too literally.
Again the argument that if you are using some tool then if others use the same tool for a different purpose it is OK is like saying that if you are using a knife to cut vegetables it is OK for someone else to use the same knife to kill someone !! Please don't take this to my comparing any MDs. It is just to say that you are stretching the argument too thin. Again, going by the photography thing, there are many good photographers who use Adobe to give some effects but within certain limits and they do criticize those who use Adobe for lot more.For example, many photographers feel that using Adobe to give filter effects is fine but getting something into the scene which was never there is not fine. But going by your argument, people can say 'if you have used Adobe, you have no right to criticize another one who used Adobe for a different purpose'. More than us, music directors have the right to publicize their aesthetic concerns and we need to understand it in that light. I think Raja may have a genuine concern that music composition is no longer real composition and I don't find it wrong in him expressing what he feels should be the limit of technology. You may disagree with his assessment but you cannot argue that 'you should not use loops if you want to criticize anyone'.
everything depends on ones perspective, understanding and exposure
ex - for me the 1st time i listened to the TIME album (1999), i cudnt listen to any of the tracks more than once, until i came to "niram pirithhu" - the other tracks had too many synth/loop usage - though 'thavikkiren' was good despite synth/loop usage - technical makkals may correct me
AFAIK, a song is genuine and good, if its eminently singable/hummable all by itself, without the orchestration - if the orchestration is equally hummable and gels perfectly with the original context/theme of the base tune, it gets a double nod - its in this context that IR had set a benchmark - on occasions, he may have fallen short of either the tune or the orchestration, but makes up for it with either of them (there are certain tracks, for instance, where i dont care for the tune, but the lilting strings usage in the interlude or the interlude might just be breezily jazzy as in the second interlude of 'en uyire' from "poonthotta kaavalkaran")
what IR probably refers to are those kind of 'outputs' where the effort of the composer is getting lesser and lesser but still the composer gets the 'credit'
as a digression - of late, IR's tracks have usage of strings, that are either getting too complex/layered and i cant hum the interludes - the use of strings in the 1st interlude of 'oli tharum' is so minimalistic and subtle by even IR standards, that i need to listen to it actually, rather than play the interlude 'inside' my head (this kind of playing music 'inside' my head, is something IR's music has done to me, i must admit) - i have been noticing this ever since 1993 (his symphony year) - maybe the hand of karthik raja's style, maybe IR decided enough with his string ensemble style, and stopped being bombastic with the exception of a Guru, a PR or a TiS - i dont know the exact reason
and then i get to hear 'ottesi chebutha' 'om shanti om' which have 'am a loop, am a loop' screaming all over the tracks, with very little of IR's handiwork in them!
now i am prompted to listen to others' use of loops and how they differ from IR, or, viceversa!
I'm really unable to understand why the comments written by me and ezy0265 have been deleted.
What u people r trying to show?
Jaiganes writes on ezy0265 'Sorry buddy you are atleast 5 years late by hub timelines.'
What's all these?
U people don't encourage new hubbies..
u have a circle ( i don't know by which 'unique similarity' u people have been connected? NRIs?)
Give response to the people who are coming with their own idea..
I can mention many idiotic conversations between u people.
I strongly condemn that u people have deleted our comments..
Senior Hubbers should respond to my complaint..
Mohanraja,
I don't have a clue on what you wrote or who deleted it but I can assure you that there is no 'circle' here. As you rightly said, we have had enough 'idiotic conversations' here and everyone is free to join. Even non-NRIs, me being one :D
I am sure the mods would have taken exception to some comments and deleted the post so as to prevent any major flames. But that is for the mods to clarify to you. All I can say is that the moment you post here, you are part of the 'inner circle' :)
Suresh,Quote:
Originally Posted by Sureshs65
when i meant it is subjective, i mean by relative standing point.More or less is totally relative.Shankar Jaikishan began competing with Naushad and started using 100+ member orchestra.Now there were people who enjoyed music made through such huge set up and there were also people who criticized that fad and appreciated minimalistic arrangements of S.D.Burman, Ravi, Madan Mohan etc.Who is right? who is wrong?I understand your definition of more or less. But what is more for IR, is probably normal for any other composer. When IR complains about loops,I do not disagree with him.He speaks my mind.But then,music made with loops also has become a genre by itself now.Atleast thats how i see it.Like say, Lounge Music.the musical richness is less and its more of sounds in lounge music.but it has become a genre.You might compare IR with a photographer who uses Adobe at times but I see him as a painter firstly, not even a photographer.I never doubted IR's genuine concern and i myself subscribed to his concern.But then, i hear his own "Om Shanti" or some songs which have loops (popular loops that too, which have already been used by other MDs) and i say to myself "Oh my dear IR,you too?but you just complained!! why double standards!!". Now, why should my idol let such a thought creep into my mind?
Secondly, IR was one of the pioneers, in adapting technology.He opened the gates for technology to come into music.Today, there is an overdose.I think thats bound to happen, like it or dislike it.
Thanx Suresh..
I'm a great fan of raja but i never praise him for his recent worthless compositions. According to me raja has done his best from '79 to '85.
ezy0265 has written abt rahman. His points are really valid.
Hope u people haven't forgot that i've given a tight slap to Charu on his irresponsible and idiotic comments on raja in my blog. But no one from ur side ( I really don't want to be appreciated for just a small artcile!Honestly) have given me good comments. Leave it. It's not an issue. Senior hubbers like rajasaranam still believe that charu is a good writer. I know abt that guy very well as I'm in Delhi for the last 6 yrs (though he has left delhi before my coming , my friends used to tell abt him! I'm working as an freelance illustrator for uyirmmai also. I strongly condemned Manushyaputran for publishing charu's idiotic 'reviews'. He really had no answers!)
I'm a regular reader of ut thread, and felt very bad that my comments were deleted.
What else I can say?