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We need some good oil to run app_engine smoothly
blame balu mahendra not KHQuote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
blame IR not KamalQuote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
I didnt know thatQuote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
Kamal is mentall sick and the rest doesnt have brain at all :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by app_engine
Point 1:
Kavin said "Does he believe that he has this self appointed role of liberating the tamil populace of their sexual repression"
App Engine said "spoilers of culture in TN..."
I say "Does App Engine think he is the protector of TN culture" ?
ithu eppadi irukku?!
Point 2:
"audience has grown up and matured"
Kavin, the whole point is the opposite of what you said -
the audience, evidently, have gorwn more conservative with old age - because they don't want their teenaged daughter to do what they did when they were teenagers - you catch my drift?
The audience has also grown senile with old age. How else do you explain, someone blaming India's HIV crisis on Kamal?
I wonder what the Africans would blame it on! The damn monkeys making out in public??
If people become bad by watching Kamal movies, how come there is no record of people becoming good by watching MGR movies or Rajni movies? After all, as someone pointed out earlier they are Super Stars and Kamal could never be one.
Blaming Kamal for scenes in his early movies like Sakalakala Vallavan is really stretching it. What next, blame Kamal for promoting pre-marital sex in Kalaththoor Kannamma?
Come on guys. Grow up!!
"it is totally untrue...the simplest example is the `silukku' scences of moondRam piRai...an otherwise classical movie spoilt by the unwanted scenes:-("
app engine, Balu Mahendra has to take the blame for it, not Kamal. He followed it up with "NeengaL kettavai"(probably meaning this is what the audience of the 80s wants - in frustration) - a silk smitha special. But probably BM himself was forced to compromise by the producers/distributors at that time(?). He has conveyed his mixed feelings on this sometime back. Moondram Pirai, of course, was a flop.
As for Kamal's other 80s masala movies like Sakalakalaavallavan, andha oru nimidam, Kaaki chattai etc. which had all those scenes, how much of it was Kamal's intent is just speculative. Sometimes, on screen, it does look as though he enjoys it really. (Hardcore Kamal fans may say thats because he is a really involved actor :-))
But as for spoiling culture etc. lets talk about bad megaserials, midnight masalas, some Satell. TV shows,,really bad vulgar movies of the 80s/90s etc. before we even come to Kamal. To me, that side of Kamal is just a minor gripe when compared to what he has contributed to Tamil cinema. But there are others, like say KS Ravikumar(in films where he himself acted as hero), SA Chandrasekhar, SP Muthuraman and several others in the 80s, who didnt contribute anything except vulgarity. They are the bigger culprits.
This thread is really becoming too cool now..I agree totally with Vijay and App engine... this is extremely subjective mostly reflecting individual opinion based on their own upbringing, background cultural integrity, openmindedness, readiness to accept or integrate with changes in culture etc etc..
MNT,
We can go on and on back and forth forever ( we , because I agree with your responses 100%), IMHO, taking cinema medium seriously to influence one's own ideology, principles, behaviours, virtues etc... etc.. is far fetched and too much, common guys, it is a entertainment media created by us which is constantly progressing over the years in different aspects, yesterdays dramas....then to W/B movies to Colorful outdoor locations, the dushyum dishyum, the graphics kalakkal ( as the SUN TV likes to call) to the DTS, digital effects to probably many more to come.
I think till we have some sort of conceptualisation of the different genre of the movies ( like the hollywood) catering to different taste we will have to either tolerate or ignore the inappropriate, excess, unwanted , irrelevant, movie spoiling cheap ( both sexual and non sexual oriented) scenes. And depending on the tastes and acceptance different scenes in the same movie sometimes may be of different appeal to different audience.
Just an ex.
The comedy scenes in SS's CM, is total crass merely because these kind of jokes ( double meaning) has been beaten to death from Bagyaraj to Pandiaraj to parthiban to the lowest class comedian and some think they didn't like because they didn't expect this kind of comdey from SS ( I don't know what they mean not expecting this from SS , in otherwords they are Ok if some other actor does the same , adhuve avaru 45 second air le kaal thooki 360 degree round adichaaruna they can accept that, but not from any other "sullan") any way I am going off topic now I think..
I don't justify kamal's kissing scenes , it looks like he has some kind of obsession with those situations at a subconscious level and unfortunately fails miserably in aptly using them in an appropriate manner in movies that would really warrant, one such movie would have been " Guna" where he is obsessed about Abhirami all along
and even in a mentally deranged person the sexual instincts are always there (except when they are on medications for therapy, sad thing, I mean the side effects) and probably "devar Magan" with Panchvarnam to forget his past relationship with Banu yet Bahrathan, Kamal combo came out neat with "Injiiduppazhaga" song, thanks to IR.
If anybody is interested watch a kannda movie by name " kaadina benki" by a talented actor/director Suresh Hebliker, a fantastic movie about Oedipus complex in the hero affecting him so badly that even in bed with his wife he has the obsession about his mother failing in his sexual relationship and to outgrow which he becomes a voyuer himself , just a jist, but very well narrated without any obscenity despite the sexual content depiction.
I perceive cinema and related media as a relief mode in my routine daily life just to sit and relax if they are of my interest ( and my interests are not very rigid and keep changing just to see what is different or innvative or creative, many of them may be creative yet boring some may be interesting but sickening etc..) I am not a teenager yet movies like " american Pie" sometimes I watch and enjoy as a time pass casually ( with my wife not with the kids ofcourse), at the same time when I had to watch "boys" Shankar's movie ( before the movie review) with a group of 14 family members in a theatre in Bangalore with my teenage neices and nephews I could see my wife and few others kind of "nelinjing" with some sort of embarrassment (again because of the way we have been brought up)
see another reason in Hollywood is the strong and effective movie making specifically catering to KIDs and lots of times interesting to adults also ( Lion King being one of the best IMHO) and it is this part of Cinema ( movies specially for children) which none of the Indian movie makers are really either even think or plan to make and the result is a final product with mixed ingradients presented as wholesome entertainment crap.... :banghead:
I feel many times the so called "sexual scenes" if used as needed and in a proper sense they are way better than the umpteen number of Rajini movies belittling the women characters ( the villain natured) to the lowest possible way ( pombale nna adhu pannanum ithe pudunganum kind of nonsense dialogue..) I just can't imagine :roll: how the so called fans tolerated and continue to tolerate such kind of outrageous acts and portrayal about woman, now I am not taking cinema too seriously but these kind just do not give me a refreshment or relaxation hence I try to avoid them
now coming to Kamal's comedies, how many of us will be willing to see a Kamal making a " Budget Padmanathan", " kandha kadamaba..) and many of those vivek, pandiyarajan,vadivel kind of movies, I must be joking right, ( I can only think of Maharasan as the only movie, despite kamal doing his job 100% perfect with his typical cheri vaasi) yet there is constant churning out of those kind of low class comedies by many , some of them even making money all because of the patronage by people and it is very hard to educate an uneducated to ask them avoid patronising such movies especially when even educated think in the lines of " Kamal as one of the spoilers of culture in TN"
:rotfl: :rotfl:
Now MX could have been way way better despite being one of best by kamal, if
1.The second half had better script
2.Crazy was part of the team , I meant Kamal-crazy both writing the dialogues, otherwise we would have missed a Kamal as a comdey writer
The last best clean comedy I can remember in Indian cinema is Kundan Shah's "jaane bhi do yaaro", an outrageously hilarious movie made more than 2 decades ago with Naseeruddin Sha and the other Ajit Vachani, even Kundan Sha couldn't come out once again with such great comedy, If MX is not as close to this movie definitely a good movie
It is really outrageous quoting HIV crisis relating to Kamal and other media people, there is always a cheaper availble medium available all the time ( MTV etc...) if they really think it is media which causes this, it is total absurd... think of other probably more sensible and true reasons guys ( Poverty, illitracy, human exploitation , both male and female) there is crisis in our thinking which probably needs more immediate attention
MNt,
point 2 is very much appropriate......
a more better example probably more meaningful and thoughtful influence of media ( and this is scientific fact, as published by WHO funded project) is the smoking on screen in movies by movie stars influencing teenagers ( the highest risk category to develop habitual smoking) was not by anyone else but by Indian actors and that too SS raced way ahead of many followed by King Khan, a disgrace indeed and attrocious
I am damn sure if Indian Government allows Tobacco industry to advertise in TV media with super heroes like sachin, Dravid, Shewag as models, the statistics will skyrocket with out any question, for the enormous fan following they have.
Prabhudas
Another dig..
I watched" april maadhathil" movie just recently on DVd, there is this hero who is shown constantly smoking ( srikanth), and at one instance the director's creative genious (not totally sarcastic) comes out with this explaination with the heroine why he only smoked but never drank beer, "because I always enjoyed watching my father with a cigaratte in his hand with a style sitting in fron of the galla petti in my father's Biriyani stall, and I always wanted to become like him when I grew up and eventually it became a habit", there may be some element in it a sort of role model opportunity, but u see how these cinema guys can create illusion even in the way they justify few things.. it was a Ok movie in any case with some nice songs and some nostalgic moments of college life
prabhudas
the credit for bringing in virasam/vulgarity in Indian cinema should go to ex-doyens like Raj Kapoor, MGR etc
In KH's case, honestly speaking, except for a few unwarranted insertions of sequences, most of his onscreen dalliances are reasonably acceptable, since his movies have other note-
worthy, interesting elements
As for SS's comedies - give me a big break! his comedies are meant to cater to people with primitive intelligence - pardon me for saying so - am yet to see subtlety in SS's humor, the exception being 'Thillu mullu' (remember the immortal scenes involving Thengai Srinivasan and SS!) and that was becos KB was at the helms, and we saw SS not acting as SS, but as KB's sincere student!
The acceptance of the banal, derogatory remarks/ dialogues/ themes of SS movies directed against the opposite sex is mainly due to the patriarchal system of our society, in which even today, many sections feel comfortable with the male dominating the scenario (unfortunately, in this same society, at the other end of the spectrum, neo-feminist liberals, repeatedly miss the woods for the forest, by going to ridiculous extremes of asking for reservation for women in Parliamentary seats!)
But IMO, SS's days of throwing silly tantrums such as referring to women as men's slaves are over- perhaps his career too - one cannot underestimate people's sense of logic and intelligence forever - at least that will give a breather for youngsters with fresh ideas in the film industry
So far as KH keeps thinking fresh and comes up with clean comedies, and intelligently aesthetically crafted serious cinema, he will survive
Vijayr sir correcta sonneenga. SA Chandrasekahr is a "rape specialist". In all his movie, the story revolves around a rape scene, this includes his latest Sukran. His son Vijay now is spoiling hte industry now (following Rajni's footstep). As long as these kinda ppl rule tamil industry, tamil movies wont reach even canes film festival.Quote:
Originally Posted by vijayr
Nothing like that. Thillu Mullu was a well made copy from Golmaal hindi movie and the original hindi humor was carried over. I have yet to see a true (original) comedy by SS / KB. Even some of Nagesh comedy movie by KB had Chaplin influence, but neverthless they are gem, purely because of Nagesh.Quote:
Originally Posted by tmrrmt
SS's only comedy I can think of starting from his "childhood" until CM is the "Paaambu" comedy. I dont know in how many movie SS will ride on the snake. Compared to these idiotic comedy (tmrrmt you nicely put it, but I can do that), even the worst movie of KH (many of you might think Aalavandhan as worst movie, but there was a movie Maharajan or something starring KH and Banupriya, the worst movie if KH I saw) had better comedy
In comedian's term
SS comedy = Vadivelu comedy
KH comedy = Vivek comedy
you decide
Digression:
GUYS!! I clocked 2 hrs and 13 minutes in the Half-Marathon Category (22 Kms distance) in the Bangalore Lipton International Marathon, held yesterday, the 15th May, 2005, Bangalore
Compared to the topper (1hr and 5 min, appx), this was nothing great, but given that I started training only from April 10, 2005 (came to know of the marathon only then!), I feel elated!
THe sheer joy of running and completing the distance and to be cheered and welcomed at the end by a crowd of 8000 plus has no equals!!
Next time around, it will be the New York/Boston/London full marathon for me - all set and preparations underway
It was an awesome inspiration and a humbling experience to see our army jawans/hawaldars/servicemen coming topper in the first 20 in each category - Hats off to our army guys - one should be there to see these guys run off their hearts in relatively hot conditions in Bangalore, on tar roads, with bizarre uphill portions most of the way (Windsor Manor, Mekhri circle, Hebbal flyover, to name a few)
It was an overall terrific experience and I personally request every TFMDFer to run/participate in marathons
at the end, for my part, I managed to spread/create some awareness about IR and TiS to several of my co-participants/runners! my little bit