ARR's interview in Hindu .....-Intresting Point

Topic started by MumbaiRamki (@ 63.186.8.168) on Sun Dec 12 18:45:07 EST 2004.


http://www.hindu.com/mp/2004/12/13/stories/2004121300340100.htm

1.The 'Yuhi chaala ' song from swades was orginally composed for Lagaan .

2.Harris Jeyaraj worked with him only for 2 films !!

3.On today's music -
"What is today's Tamil film music all about? They are nothing more than fast numbers or remix downloaded. What took me weeks to make music for a "Gentleman" or "Rangeela" can be done today if you have a computer, software and then pre-set the rhythms and you have a disco number! Fast music is no big deal today as anyone can become a music director"

4.Rajiv Menon film in tamizh .

Old responses

Vijay:

"Theres a difference. And yet you feel these are the MDs who are taking us thru a quest of space, timbre and what not. Amusing :-)"

You didn't read a word of what I said, did you? Now THAT's amusing.

Shyam:

"Jus because i use a darbuka or a doumbek for a few seconds, doesnt make my song feel arabic/ middle eastern! "

Percussion instruments at this point retain no strong connection to their cultural origins, since rhythm travels so quickly and widely. However, melodic instruments like winds/strings continue to largely be used as signifiers of specific/exotic locale, barring a few like the sax, trumpet, flute and the violin that for historical reasons have gained international currency. The bagpipe to me still conveys a strong whiff of its roots, just as the didgeridoo does of the Australian outback as in DCH, or the kora would of its African association.

However if you're looking for stronger Irish doses in your fusions I wish you good luck on your journey.

Vijay:

"I agree some old-timers have that view. this is about a composer not able to spot a wrong note in his own composition. Theres a difference."

So the question is who spotted it for him? If it was SPB it's possible that he was applying older and more restrictive standards to newer compositional freedoms. If it was the composer in question himself who realised, or was apprised of, and acknowledged, his mistake, that should be allowed and overlooked. A mistake in pop, unlike classical, is not a criminal offence punishable by death. A series of such mistakes, unredeemed by any creativity whatsoever, will in any case soon remove the composer from the reckoning (AR Rehana anyone?). ARR and HJ have admitted to composing terrible songs on occasion, why shouldn't the young composer be allowed a similar sanction?

As you can see, right now we're doing little more than nitpicking each-other's statements of each-others statements of each-other's....Since our fundamental positions are clear and obvious to both of us and everyone else here, and we're not going to change those positions anytime soon, there is less juice left in this discussion than in sugarcane squeezed 50 times. If you want to keep contributing feel free to do so. I'll move onto other topics.

ippo puriyuthu unga kailyula evalavu time irukkunu.. evalavu periya posts!!!

Dude
the only thing, even though there was a monopoly MD, there was constant variety and he beat his own expectation!! that is my opinion

Anbesivam: I haven't heard that carnatic song well enough. IIRC, I recall listening to Maharajapuram Santhanam render it. However, if you say so, I am willing to believe it. I have heard enough numbers of ARR reminding one or other of old songs by MSV or IR, so it is not surprising.

Observer: I agree ARR has had a string of commercial failures since 2000, the likes of which he did not experience in the nineties. I also still believe, Ramki's list notwithstanding, that all the commercial successes (barring, arguably, Boys) since 2000 have been tied to the box office success of the movies themselves. The only conclusion that I am able to make is that the string of new MDs have indeed been able to mimic ARR successfully, so much so that ARR's music itself is not that hot anymore. It is reasonable to conclude that, true to the adage that all good (!) things must come to an end, ARR's reign of TFM ended by 2000. That by itself should not be a slur on ARR's capabilities; MSV and IR also experienced it. It is inevitable, this passing on of the baton (so to say).

"You believe:
1) Neither Rahman nor you care about the commercial outcome of his projects.
2) His creativity is as its peak and far exceeds that of his competition.
"

Observer, I never claimed 1 or 2 . Its just YOUR interpretation/inference/imagination. Rahman is not at his peak creatively. Where did I say that. I just feel that his good to bad stuff ratio is still significantly higher than his younger counterparts, commercial successes or failures notwithstanding. His creativity is now being put to use mostly in NON-IFM projects which I guess takes a lot out of him and for which he has set high priority.

Reg 1. Rahman of course cares, otherwise he wouldnt spent weeks composing for an album. Bbut a few misses in TFM shouldnt scare him to death as he has a better coverage market-wise. If a couple of TFM albums flop then Bombay Dreams or something else somewhere scores and so on. This is not 1995 where Rrahman is all TFM and nothing else.
As far his comments on his competitors I dont think that he went out of way to criticize them or anything. Now that he has some stature he is probably being more forthright and less shy about his comments than he was, say 10 years back when he was still a newcomer and must have been careful, regarding commenting on others works. That shouldnt be mistaken for insecurity.

Anyways, we have been going around in circles and I surely think you will find something to nitpick in my post. So lets put this to rest and move on as you say.

"Now that he has some stature he is probably being more forthright and less shy about his comments than he was, say 10 years back when he was still a newcomer and must have been careful, regarding commenting on others works. That shouldnt be mistaken for insecurity."
Vijay

I agree to this!!

Hi!

One small inference by me from some recent posts(I hope I am allowed to infer in this thread).
1. ARR is very costly!
2. his clones are cheap.
3. Though ARR has slipped in commercial viability, he still has better output than his clones
4. ARR success ratio is 60 to 80 %(60 claimed by observer, 80 claimed by Vijay & Co.)
Assume ARR charges 1 crore and his clones charge 25 lacs (max). Hmm..
Also Assume I am a producer, then If I am using ARR and he gives me the 40 - 20 % stuff then I incur a huge loss. Whereas if I use his clones and by chance if their music is received very well, then I go to the bank laughing! Add to all this,if I am a Tamil movie producer, I have to sign a stupid agreement with ARR that all his tunes are his properties and can't be resold by me, then all I get is the sale in TFM only. So the whole point of using ARR is negated. And this didn't happen because of any new situation, it is a self made situation by ARR. So to come out of this
1. ARR should be more accessible to budget producers @ lesser cost. He can recover it in the remake/recycle of tune for Hindi movies.(by budget producers, I don't mean that he should score for V.Sekar movies)
2. If same cost ratio is to be maintained, then give up recycle/reuse of tunes right to the producer (I guess in Baba this was done by Rajnikanth. Thats why Ashuthosh had to buy the rights of the song "Baba kichu tha").
3. Consciously shift style and introduce variations to thwart his clones.
4. Doing point #4, he would also give breathing space to his own assistants like Praveen Mani and Joshua Shridhar, so that they will not be subject to the simple criticsm that they sound so ARRish.

Thanks,
Jaiganesh

ps: Yes I have a lot of time for this post! that does not mean that I am a dumbo and you are the Prez of some nation Mr.MusicIsLife

Jaiganesh:

So Thundu Bhai's songs are not worth for the money (I mean 1 crore)? If he reduces his charge, that will imply that he is losing his ground.

I don't believe that his statemetns are misquoted in The Hindu. He gave the same opinions to Ananta vikatan too. He just wants to say that he is better than all these new comers. Commercially he is a gone case in Tamil. Slowly the same trend is happening in HFM too,BOIndia site's prove that.

Jaiganesh
Why r u getting MAD at me, while i have to appreciate the fact for long posts, owing to many pages, usually the points are getting diluted.. it is frustrating to traverse many pages..
Secondly, i did not pin-point you.. i was generally telling LOOOOONG POSTS

I don't need to be a prez to tell this.. please see it for yourself.

vijay- just out of curiosity...what do you do ?? you seem to have too much energy and time considering the fact that you have been on TFMpage for a really long time :-))

I think both observer and Vijay have valid points. The points made by Jaiganesh is correct as well. I can't speak for others but the music for Samy, Dhool, Gilli, Kovil were excellent. I enjoyed them. I don't care what ARR is doing in other markets but in Tamil nowadays, most of the songs I hear is from YSR, HJ, VS and others. You can't expect people to not listen to music just because there's no major trend-maker since ARR. The new composers have adapted themselves very well to the film industry at the moment. The film music is to serve the cinema industry. I liked ARR for his Tamil film music. Just because ARR feels that the Tamil music industry is not going where he feels it should be, I can't stop from listening to Tamil music. The music for 4 Students by a new composer is nice.

Hi
I apologize for sounding rude to MusicIsLife. My points apply if and only if ARR is planning to regain ground in Tamil music Industry! If that is not his serious intention, then So Be It. Fact to bring to Shri. Nattamais notice is that TFM market has eroded over a period of time. Audio piracy is a killer and for any MD, be it IR, YSR, HJ or anyone to retain a good fees, piracy has to be killed. I could spot so many mp3 CDs of all recent releases in a music shop and people prefer that only. People may argue by saying that mp3's dont last as long as a legally recorded Audio CD, but sorry to say that the songs themselves don't last till the time the mp3 CD starts to wear. In fact my friends in Music world Bangalore say that all 'legends' albums are moving faster than new releases.

Thanks,
Jaiganesh

Jaiganesh,
That is OK. If only recent MD's made everlasting melodies, or all stalwarts made melodies, that could be heard over and over again, this trend will not change!!..

Jaiganesh,
That is OK. If only recent MD's made everlasting melodies, or all stalwarts made melodies, that could be heard over and over again, this trend will not change!!..

MIL,

How would you know if a song which has just released will be everlasting or not? You would need psychic powers to do that. Also if anyone can do this, maybe the music directors could employ them. If a song would not become everlasting, why release them at all?

And while at it, what exactly do you mean ever lasting? And why should only melodies be everlasting? Yaaradi nee mohini was not a melody, but we still hear it and like it right? Ye aatha aathorama vaariya is not a melody, pettai rap is not a melody...

I was just listening to songs from Desam. What a pleasant surprise. If this music is not a hit with tamil masses, so be it. Good work by ARR.

Dude,
I was not talking about a newly released song, I was just talking on the Trend.. dont pounce on me.. coz for ex if a song just got hit by somekind of craze not by the real worth!! of it, it just becomes a way of trend to follow.. Seriously, dont u get bored to turn on to Sun-Tv programs (more than bored, frustrated) to listen to crappy song, just diluting some good ones out there!!
That is what i mentioned about, probably Everlasting was a wrong word, i do take it back.. probably "likeable" a softer overtone wiould be good, so once in a while, if we get to hear, we dont cringe. ne ways.. suddenly sure.. i have become a looooong poster, let me stop it here!!

I somehow stick to some good ol' melodies, though i come upon hearing some new ones, which are good. Basically i was referring to more towards the trend or the individual MD output!!

I will stop it here, coz, it is disgressing too much on ones opinions.. let us stick to the topic

"or the individual MD output!!" should read "and not the individual MD's output!!!"
Dude, also i just added to JG's post!! kind-a agreed with him on piracy and other issues.

all the talk abt. ARR not doing well and he shuld redue his salary is all crap.......do u xpect sachin tendulkar to reduce his salary just bcos he is scoring pretty badly at the moment......if ppl. can't afford ARR so be it......he is only for the rich producers and there will be less ARR movies in Tfm which is gud for his fans like me.....

enga maddy, unga selavu kuraiyum'nu pakkareengala?:-)

MIL,

Sorry, i was not pouncing on you:-) I was just wondering about the 'If only recent MD's made everlasting melodies' statement...

Hmmm!
MADDY!
Just a thought!

1. If Sachin is going to average less than 30 in the coming cricketing year, will the BCCI still wait for him to get into form rather than showing him the door?
2. What if BCCI goes bankrupt in a year or two? Will Sachin say, I don't care if BCCI is banrupt, I still want the same old salary?
I guess as far as TFM is concerned, point 2 applies and ARR soon will have no takers even if Mani Ratnam and Rajeev Menon desparately want ARR to score. They will just get into low budget film making(Already Shankar did that with Kaadhal). They will not say, 'let me go bankrupt, but I will use only ARR for the same price'.

This is just an extrapolation of current trend of unfettered audio piracy and mp3 downloads being abundant source of ARR's music.

ARR can even be frank on this issue and start a movement against this twin evils as I beleive he is the wort hit because of both.

As far as the impact on ARR's clones are concerned, well, they operate at a much lower cost and they are insulated by the movie's producer from these trends. All said and done, it's MONEY MONEY MONEY.

Thanks,

Jaiganesh
http://silencerocks.blogspot.com

"This is just an extrapolation of current trend of unfettered audio piracy and mp3 downloads being abundant source of ARR's music.

ARR can even be frank on this issue and start a movement against this twin evils as I beleive he is the wort hit because of both. "

Jaiganesh,
Just think!
Before music was so much commercialised to make a few individuals stinking rich and music making/listening an expensive affair, it was just radio & public address systems...or inexpensive cinema tickets...sole greed and commercial considerations have been ruining the music industry for a while. I think MP3's & cheap-copies of cassettes is not a bad idea if that gives access to more people good music (as much as radio / public address systems / recording centers etc. gave in the past)...That ARR or X or Y or Z making a few hundred thousands less is not going to hurt anyone (not even the music moghuls in the business , as they need to handle less of black money:-))...

The word `piracy' cannot be applied to these fellows (i.e. cinema MD's) as most of the time they themselves draw from many previous sources freely and shamelessly, without paying a penny while trying to make millions...(in fact many have MADE millions by even plagiarism)...why make public pay too much for these so called `arts'?

vambu,

yours is a warped logic which effectively says "two wrongs make a right".

that is not so, it is just the MDs and movie makers who plagiarize have been lucky all these days. Until people start suing these guys will continue to do that.

Look at kamal and rajinikanth, both keep plagiarizing left and right, kamal from hollywood and rajini from other language movies. All these years they were allowed to go scott free. but today rajini's chandramughi is in so much controversy because the original film maker is threatening to sue. In fact, the movie is banned in kerala even before the shooting is complete.

Kamal's new film (donno its name) is supposed to be inspired from a spanish movie. And he proudly announces that he is going to buy the copyrights for making it in tamil. But hey, what about the numerous movies he plagiarized earlier, is he going to contact the producers of those movies and pay them royalties?

I think it is just a matter of time before these MDs and movie makers fall in line. People around the world are now starting to look at indian movies, its not far away before original movie makers and composers start suing these plagiarists.

Now that doesnt mean that while these people plagiarize we can also endorse piracy. Why not endorse shoplifting of audio cassette shops. Hey these people are selling plagiarized music, why not steal from them, that will teach them a lesson.

That was how it was before the 'thiruttu vcds' were outlawed recently. I am sure something will come up for audio cassettes and cds soon.

I agree with you Dude that a wrong cannot be made right by another wrong. Let me clear up things : I do not endorse MP3's or `pirated' cassettes personally either. When I'm not willing to spend money on certain music / movies, the only way it can reach me is through radio / TV.

So if my previous post has got some kind of endorsement to piracy, I apologize and definitely take it back...

I simply wanted to make an observation about today's music industry which is so greedy / commercialised and trying to make things very expensive. At least some of them try to do the `basmathi / turmeric patent' which is deplorable:-)

Hi Vambu!
The only reason why people buy cassette or CD is to listen to the songs they like to listen(without disturbing anybody else) at their own convenience. The reason you have mentioned seems to be flawed to me. Radio and TV will not telecast / broad cast movies specially for you. For that you gotta call 'Pepsi',oops Jayachandran textiles UMA buddy.
pun intended! Offense unintended!!

Thanks,
Jaiganesh
http://silencerocks.blogspot.com

A word on Irish music, a random afterthought to some comments in the old responses.
I believe Irish music was first introduced to TFM by - not YSR, not ARR -but ofcourse IR!
How?
Hint: IR-ish ;-)

jaiganesh, my whole point was that ARR shuld stop composing in TFM.......within 2 yrs i dunt think any MD can demand any salary in india......they will have to take wat they get........so ARR shuld shift to private albums and shuld create a new genre for himself......he shuld stop composing for movies in all......i think eeven IR shuld do that.....how many situations do u get to compose a song for.....all bloody same situations-10 max????.....private albums wud mean more scope for MDs............

prime reason why ARR and IR are doing film music is that they get money only in that. Private albums do not get the kind of visibility that film albums get. Having said that, ARR did gain much out of Vande Mataram. How to name it and Nothiing but Wind still sell for IR. But if there was a huge sum, by this time both these guys would have been focussing only there. Added to that a film score by default gets a lot of publicity through media compared to a private album, which the creator himself/herself has to push.
Thanks,
Jaiganesh.
http://silencerocks.blogspot.com

As it is, new ideas in film music itself is lifted and cleverly reused by skilful MD's, witness VS's smart adapation of the ARR number "Thanga thaamarai magalE ..." (What is this number by VS? Anyone?). Why should ARR do private albums when surely those ideas will be reused by other MD's for TFM for higher monetary rewards and greater recognition?

IR must be the worst hit. Every MD draws freely from his old numbers or BGM's.

seriously IR's songs have been copied Right-left-center-top-bottom by Anand Milind and many others......poor guy has not registered a case even against anyone.....ARR's muqabla had 8 versions in hindi within 3 months......OP.Nayyar termed it as the lowest point in HFM history......Bollywood is all abt. wat u make ppl. perceive..they convince ppl. that it is their music....sadly in Mumbai, PERCEPTION IS REALITY.....
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Maddy
It is not in Mumbai, but everywhere, but sometimes REALITY is hard to accept, though we dont wish that should be the REALITY

Adengappa, Idhe computerum softwareum ellam ivar veetile illaya appa. Romba costly polirukku. Adhu thaan ivaraala idhellam mudiyalla. Appo 90's digital revolution munnadi irundhanvanga ellam (MSV,IR incl.) eppadi polambanum???!!!!