IR News and Other Titbits Ver.2009

[Plum]

Wow, thanks so much, Plum. ungaL sEvai engaLukkuth thEvai.

Second this!
On the GKV-point: Confirms what i heard from a friend. So much work was delegated by the composer to Raaja that he ends up doing most of the composing.

sh!!!!!!!! Mooch !!! Bala , satham podapdaadhu. Apram pre IR MD'skku yellam kodai pidikkum OISG, Vengayam, SriramLakshman jambavangaLukku kobam vandhu "dhool" keLapuvaa

I guess we had this discussion during their tenure in TFMpage. The consensus was that it was a canard that Raja scored for GKV. In particular, KJY is said to have confirmed that it was GKV who scored thEN sindhudhAe vAnam, rather than IR as the popular belief is. That was the clincher based on which a "hence, proved" was stamped on "IR did not ghost compose for GKV". Now, SPB has reopened the debate. I guess his words should carry some weight as all of them are known to be SPB-ers rather than KJY-ers

[app_engine]

In particular, KJY is said to have confirmed that it was GKV who scored thEN sindhudhAe vAnam

பயங்கரமா உதைக்குதே, யேசுதாஸுக்கும் அந்தப்பாட்டுக்கும் என்ன சம்பந்தம்? அந்தப்படத்துலயே அவர் பாடலயே?

The song 'தஞ்சாவூரு சீமையிலே' from the same movie was a roaring folk number (sung by the GKV-IR fav lady, SJ) and was my favourite along with thEn sindhudhE during the pre-IR days, days when nobody seriously talked about who is the MD etc. It was regularly played in our school before certain functions.

I think both have some truth in it - that IR learnt a lot of techniques working with GKV and GKV got some inputs from this born-genius. Still, despite claims / counter-claims, even if that comes from SPB, I'm not going to subscribe to discrediting GKV.
இதெல்லாம் GKV இருந்தப்போ பாலு சொல்லியிருந்தால் பரவாயில்லை. தற்போது நம்புவதற்கில்லை

If SPB makes another loose comment about some IR song where an assistant had a sumaal input (e.g. punnagai mannan), are we going to make a judgement that so many of IR's works were by assistants?

[Bala (Karthik)]

"So much work was delegated by the composer to Raaja that he ends up doing most of the composing" (in those songs where the delegation is more)

[Bala (Karthik)]

இதெல்லாம் GKV இருந்தப்போ பாலு சொல்லியிருந்தால் பரவாயில்லை. தற்போது நம்புவதற்கில்லை

Avar munna sonnadhu ellame namakku theriya varanumnu avasiyam illaye

If SPB makes another loose comment about some IR song where an assistant had a sumaal input (e.g. punnagai mannan), are we going to make a judgement that so many of IR's works were by assistants?

How can we say for sure what the magnitude or kind of input was?
Also, there is a difference between playing an instrument and arranging, composing etc illaya?

[app_engine]

I agree Bala (to both).

Actually there's a strong case for a song from aduthAththu Albert (GKV Kannada song mysooru malligE used as munooru milliyE by IR here). Having worked with GKV for more than 100 movies, it's very possible IR had a lot of inputs.

Still, I somehow feel uncomfortable questioning / discussing the credentials of someone dead - and not in a position to defend himself.

Raja himself told in varalAtru suvadugaL that because his input was once made fun of, he was determined not to suggest anymore during GKV's sessions and reserved them for later (i.e. if and when he gets a chance). And he had decent regards for GKV always (MTK one example, also IR supposedly played some "benefit match" for GKV etc).

I think if IR is not complaining of getting a raw deal from some mudhalALi, there's not a case to discuss

[Sureshs65]

Plum,

No offense taken I am not sure if equa is talking about 'ravivarmake' song or the 'raasanu premaleka' song. And if I remember reading it right, it was PBS who is supposed to have said that GKV was the one who composed it.

I would agree with app_eng that it is not very correct to talk about it now. I guess even Raja may not want the talk. I was surprised that SPB made that statement. Whatever his intent, it does discredit GKV. And 'ravivarmake' is a well loved song in Telugu and Kannada. (I don't know that a Tamil version exists !!) While SPB may think he is correcting some historical wrongs, it doesn't come out that way. I am not saying there is no truth in what he is saying but just that he shouldn't be saying it now.

These have always been contentious matters earlier as well. I vaguely remember reading or hearing about some Subbiah Naidu song actually being composed by MSV-TVR. In Hindi, the songs of R D Burman which came under the name of S D Burman has been debated to death. I have read articles which suggested that 'hum bekhudi mein' from Kaala Pani was actually composed by Jaidev, who was working as S D Burman's assistant at that time. These are all documented in print media earlier and hence I quote here.

Once again I have to say I agree with app_eng and let us respect the memory of GKV. Hope Balu doesn't make such statements in a program which is widely watched.

[equanimus]

I am not sure if equa is talking about 'ravivarmake' song or the 'raasanu premaleka' song.

The latter. The melody was just lovely and I thought the rhythm and the arrangements were striking(ly Raaja-esque).

[jaiganes]

megangale ingu vaarungalen also is under GKV baton - but the signature is typical IR which he explored so beautifully in Thangaaliyalli ...

[kiru]

This is probably not related to GKV, but I positively remember IR saying in program/interview that lot of work was being done by assistants and the MDs were taking the credit. He did not want to do the same so he never had assistants. In one TV interview a mridhangham artist mentioned that IR wrote every syllable of a mridhangam prelude of a good song (I think it is ennuLLE ennuLLE pala minnal ezhum nEram). Uttam Singh and Puru do well-defined roles of an 'arranger' meaning they only work with the notes given by IR. Apparently per GA in the telugu TV program these notes are still around today and GA uses it for his stage programs.
IR is very much into originality and proper crediting. He even mentioned that he sang/played MSV's songs in streets and got the applause. But it was bothering him because the credit should go to MSV, so that is one of the reasons he wanted to compose by himself.

[thumburu]

Idhukku dhaan periyavaa nadhimoolam, rishimoolam ellam romba paaka koodaadhumbaa. Still, having heard few GKV films after Raja started reigning, the IRness was distinctly missing , Example : That GKV song "onnu rendu moonu" in multi MDed "kannil theriyum kadhaigaL" where IR also did "naanoru ponnoviyam kanden". Reg "then sindhudhe", the arrangement , tune etc is clearly IRish and IR employed similar techniques for "oru vaanavil pole". SPB Charan mentioned in a TV show that the guitar for the old SPB song under GKV, "thoduvadhenna thendralo malargaLo" was strummed by none other than IR. In this case it could have been entirely GKV's work with IR just playing a guitarist part. Yellame oru heshyam dhaan. Anyways, I loved GKV's songs when IR was assisting him in some capacity or other. "Raja paarunga raajavai paarunga" , "idhu viLakketrum neram" [SJ solo] and some obscure 70's gems like these were precursors to that phenomenon which couldn't be concealed for long